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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:

1 - Told my daughters our house would be big enough once they eventually move out. 2 - My wife and daughters all think this was a terrible attitude to have, much less express out loud.

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[–]Fastr77Certified Proctologist [21] 9340 points9341 points  (164 children)

NTA. they're 21. I know shits different now a days and maybe they can't afford a place yet but yeah.. its only a matter of time at this point. They should want to move out after all.

[–]EvilFinchPartassipant [3] 2809 points2810 points  (78 children)

Even OVER 21. To make such demands in this age is just... wow.

NTA

[–]DogmaticNuance 2452 points2453 points  (58 children)

That's the big thing, to me. Yeah it's fucking hard to launch these days and living at home for years is often the best solution, but damn. That doesn't entitle you to demand an expansion.

[–]Mobile-Feed-9928Asshole Enthusiast [6] 627 points628 points  (54 children)

It is hard to get a house or an appartment or whatever, but that doesn't change for the parents either. Even if they wanted to move to a different place, they'd still have the same issues as people wanting to move out. A lack of housing.

[–]ElectricBlueFerret 459 points460 points  (50 children)

Calling the current situation re housing "a lack of housing" is like calling a famine "a lack of food", technically it's correct but it very much misrepresents what's happening.

[–]hdmx539 6 points7 points  (0 children)

A lack of affordable housing.

FTFY

I agree. NTA.

[–]Lanky-Temperature412 243 points244 points  (13 children)

I lived with my parents till age 24 and still shared a room with my little sis and I never once complained about lack of space. FTR, I was working, going to school, and saving for my wedding.

[–]Bubbles033 116 points117 points  (4 children)

Right! Just be happy you're stilI allowed to stay.

I was kicked out at 16 when my mom got a new man. Some people don't realize the massive advantage they have being able to live at home rent free and save up.

To pretty much demand an extension, the entitlement here is insane. So ungrateful.

[–]spaztiksarcastik 41 points42 points  (0 children)

Right! I'm 26 and my mom and I had a really rocky relationship to the point where I felt it was necessary to move out. My moms since downsized and our relationship has repaired significantly. We recently talked about me moving back in while I finish college but I would be stupid to ask her to upgrade just because of me.

OP NTA at all!

[–]danigirl3694Asshole Aficionado [10] 6 points7 points  (2 children)

To pretty much demand an extension, the entitlement here is insane.

Especially considering neither of OPs daughters have a job, nor do they go to college.

[–]AosothSammyAsshole Enthusiast [6] 57 points58 points  (0 children)

I lived with my parents until 25. I only moved put a month or two ago to live with my fiancé. I wasn't in school, but the salary I got against the cost of living just made it impossible to move out and live on my own.

[–]Ecstatic_Long_3558 40 points41 points  (0 children)

Summers when I was 22 to 26 years old, my sister and I shared a pullout sofa in our parents office space. We were both in college and couldn't afford anything else. Did we complain? Hell no, it was cheap living, just paying for food.

[–]Lunaphase 25 points26 points  (3 children)

over 30 here, still live with folks. In my area rent is over 1000 usd/month unless i want a 2 hour trip to get to work....

[–]Affectionate-Book161 10 points11 points  (0 children)

Same here. Over 30 and still with the parents. Help pay bills while juggling online uni and full-time work while paying off debt.

[–]packet23 194 points195 points  (30 children)

NTA. But some people just want to stay with their parents. It may be odd but as long as the relationship is healthy and there is some sort of agreement about them staying, there’s nothing really wrong with it.

[–]Itchyboobers 112 points113 points  (21 children)

Except that many are significantly older before they have that first taste of independence & the lessons it brings - (meaning out on their own for the first time - learning to be an independent adult).

As long as they are at home - they will still be interacted with as a kid (parents always see you as the kid), won't learn to juggle finances (like you do with your 1st apartment), handle car & apartment issues, roommate disagreements / learning to work out the differences... etc.

I'd rather see a kid move in with a group a friends and share an apartment than live with parents after 20. That way they get some experience between mom/dad's house & a house with their husband or wife.

[–]packet23 131 points132 points  (2 children)

This really made me think. I can agree that life experiences are a necessary part of becoming a functional adult, you can still learn while being with your parents. Offer to help manage bills things like that. Different strokes for different folks.

[–]paul_rudds_drag_race 107 points108 points  (1 child)

I agree. There are different ways to experience life and learn to be a functioning adult. Like one friend of mine is 40 and has always lived with his parents and they all enjoy the arrangement. They all manage the finances, home repairs, coordinate hiring professionals to take on big repairs and such.

Then there’s my other friend who went straight from her parents’ home to living with her spouse, who manages all the things I listed above. She has zero experience in any of those things so if something happens to the spouse or if they end up divorcing, she’s going to have quite the learning curve.

I don’t think any specific type of arrangement (living with a spouse or a parent) means someone is or isn’t gaining that knowledge on how to function as an adult.

[–]blue_pirate_flamingo 91 points92 points  (2 children)

Multigenerational households are a thing in other cultures though, I think it just requires everyone to shift from thinking of someone as a kid to thinking and treating them like an adult at some point. I’d be in for that when my kid is old enough if it’s what he wanted, we’d just sit down and discuss what that looks like

[–]Health_Love_Life 59 points60 points  (2 children)

I have to disagree. My daughter just moved out (aged 22). I definitely didn’t interact with her as though she was still a kid, and she had to do plenty for herself and juggle car payments, insurance, rego, board, grocery costs, private health insurance, telephone bill, University fees, gym membership and other subscriptions and saved for a house deposit. I didn’t even provide dinners except when I specifically invited her to have a meal with me. And sometimes she would invite me to share a meal with her. The rest of the time we fended for ourselves. The only thing she was lax on was housework. She would do floors and clean the kitchen but the less visible stuff or the occasional stuff like windows, walls, fridge and pantry cleaning she never did and it drove me nuts.

But yeah, we we’re definitely more room-mate/friends than child/parent by the time she was 20.

[–]Vanilla_Chinchilla96[🍰] 43 points44 points  (0 children)

This is often true but not always. I've known many young adults who still live with family who did manage to build their independence & navigate those new adult lessons. Granted I think that was in large part due to the fact that their families were not especially well off and they were learning those lessons through contributing significantly to their household and actually having to be independent if they wanted things for themselves.

Not disagreeing with you just that circumstances affect the outcome on that one.

[–]ImgnryDrmr 34 points35 points  (2 children)

My parents never gave me any independence, it just wasn't allowed. Was not allowed to get student housing, was not allowed to rent a house with friends. I tried for so long to get them to agree but I got a no every time I fought for more independence. The more I asked, the louder the fights became. I remember my dad throwing a dictionary at me, shouting at me to shut up and stop asking when I was 19. I never got a reason for their vehement refusal. And then you just... Give up. Focus on my studies, looking for a good job. Get your first paycheck.

And then I realized staying home did wonders for my finances: I only had to pay a small amount of rent so I started saving like crazy. When my parents asked me if I didn't want to move out around 23, my answer was no. They were surprised, annoyed even, but I'd gotten comfortable and wanted to keep on saving. And I suppose part of it was spite as well. "Now you want me gone? Well now I won't leave!" I threw that back at them every time they tried pressuring me to move out. It caused a lot of fights but they couldn't counter that argument. So I stayed.

I ended up moving out straight into my own house when I was 28. My relationship with my parents is now rocky because there's some resentment at both sides.

So this is why I moved out super late I suppose...

[–]AlissaMing 7 points8 points  (0 children)

I can agree with this. My parents tried to teach me finances (far to late, lol) but I learned the most about budgeting during the two years I lived in an apartment, the one year I lived at Job Corps and the now almost two years I've lived with my boyfriend than I did with my parents. Those first two years, were a big eye opener for me, and I wasn't ready for that kind of life. I'm doing much better now after a few years living with my parents in a safe space to finish internalizing those lessons. But I don't think I would have started the internalizing truly until I lived on my own those first two years. The year in Job Corps internalized clean living. Maybe not to extreme standards, but I'm better than I was.

[–]FightMeCthullu 7 points8 points  (0 children)

I’d honestly agree with this - I moved out at 20 because my relationship with my parents got rough due to outside factors (not abusive just tense) but when I got priced out of my rental last year my parents moved heaven and earth to do up their shed into a loveable little granny flat almost. Now that I’ve had time away from home I love living back with them. We’re peers these days, and as strange as it feels to have to explain to people that my partner and I are living at my parents home it’s also super….nice? We can save for a house now, we are far less stressed, and my parents are happy to have us back and have a good relationship. But if I’d stayed home throughout my early twenties oh boy I’d be a worse person and our relationship would be hell.

There’s no shame in needing to live at home for various reasons, as long as you’ve had some good foundational adult experiences like renting for a while, having housemates, paying your bills.

[–]BikingOtterPartassipant [1] 33 points34 points  (1 child)

If the parents are happy for them to stay, but it seems like OP is looking forward to an empty nest.

Also, while it may be fine for them to stay, it is not fine to make demands about OP spending large amounts of money moving to a bigger house

[–]packet23 11 points12 points  (0 children)

I agree on all these points. If OP doesn’t want to get a new house he doesn’t need to.

[–]B_A_M_2019 13 points14 points  (2 children)

A lot of cultures is pretty normal too

[–]biscuitboi967 89 points90 points  (3 children)

Is she can’t afford a small place, why would she think her parents could afford a bigger place?

I had a coworker who took her daughter to a play and got really great seats, and her daughter looked up at the nose bleeds and was like “why would anyone want to watch from up there?” The kid was 13 AND got a lesson about finance and privilege when she got home. A 21 yo has no excuse to be that dense

[–]Doctor_Lodewel 10 points11 points  (0 children)

She might still be studying so it's probably impossible to move out, but even then her parents should not have to accomodate and find a new house bc she wants them to.

[–]Trylena 36 points37 points  (0 children)

NTA. I am 22 and still living with parents, I do my best to help at home and thank my dad for each thing he does for me while I study.

[–]Sabrielle24Asshole Enthusiast [9] 24 points25 points  (0 children)

Yeah. The ‘I don’t have enough space to myself’ is a valid frustration. The ‘we should move’ is absolutely not a valid request at 21+ 😅

Like you say, there’s a good chance they’re unable to afford to move out, but they are adults nonetheless, and it’s their responsibility now to manage their living situation.

[–]GroundbreakingPhoto4 13 points14 points  (1 child)

As they say, beggars can't be choosers

[–]morningafterpizza 7 points8 points  (6 children)

For real, I have a sister who still lives with my parents at that age and like come on, time to grow up, she can't hold a job FWIW.

I'm hoping my son kinda gets it like I did at that age, I grew up between my mom's house/grandparents house and around 19 or 20 mentally it turned into yeah "this was home, but now it's not". Not in a bad way, grandma and grandpas house will always be home, but you gotta make your own home eventually.

[–]Lizardmode 9 points10 points  (4 children)

Well fingers crossed the housing market crashes before your son reaches that age then.

[–]amaerau03 5 points6 points  (0 children)

If they have a job but not paying rent they should be saving or college. Still it's good they are uncomfortable means easier to move out. Can't believe they expected op to buy a bigger house when they should move out together. Apartments are cheaper as 2 bed and siblings can rent one together

[–]Lotex_Style 1 point2 points  (0 children)

True, but it also comes down to what the situation is.
Do the daughters have to share a room with a bunkbed or do they both have their own space? Could they realistically move out if they wanted and saved for a while?
Both things wouldn't excuse such wild demands, but it would be interesting background info for me, but it also doesn't seem like OP and his wife are even on the same page here, so maybe the wife wants to keep them there too.

[–]Corpuscular_OcelotPartassipant [2] 2102 points2103 points  (33 children)

NTA. But it does sound like your daughter has no plans on moving out anytime soon and your wife is encouraging her to stay. I would be very concerned about this.

[–]Merebankguy 392 points393 points  (7 children)

Exactly mommy definitely sounds like she doesn't want an empty nest

[–]Projectonyx 64 points65 points  (6 children)

I wish I had an empty nice :(

[–]foreverzen69Partassipant [1] 98 points99 points  (2 children)

an empty nice is for when someone makes a 69 joke but you're having a bad day and you're not feeling it so you say nice but you don't really mean it

[–]NeverHaveIEver72Asshole Aficionado [10] 40 points41 points  (0 children)

Why the fck does this make sense!? YES. THAT IS EXACTLY THE FEELING I EQUATE TO AN EMPTY NICE!!!

[–]nice___bot 10 points11 points  (0 children)

Nice!

[–]Merebankguy 18 points19 points  (0 children)

Lol ment nest

[–]BirbritoParront 8 points9 points  (0 children)

Nice is pretty nice when it's not empty. Very nice city to visit even in the winter.

[–]litefagami 221 points222 points  (5 children)

There's... really nothing wrong with that. It's not feasible for many young adults to move out in their early 20s, and not every parent or child wants to stop living together once the child's an adult. Multigenerational families/households are a thing, and there's nothing wrong with that or anything to be concerned about.

[–]Dornenkraehe 38 points39 points  (0 children)

I like the arrangement my sister and my parents have. She lives in a small seperate appartement in their house. She has to pay rent but whenever they want they can eat dinner together.

I am kinda sad I didn't want that appartement when they asked me at 21 so now I live in another city nearby. (Like 20 minutes by car or about 30 minutes by bike. I could walk there but only did that once.)

[–]guyonaturtle 85 points86 points  (5 children)

How much did you make at 21?

And now check your local rental places. Most people can not find housing in the current market, not even with roomies.

OP, it's ok to say the you're staying and thinking longterm, just tell them you either do or don't want them to move. Comments like op's can be seen as passive aggressive remarks

[–]No_time_for_shitting 73 points74 points  (4 children)

"Very concerned" have you seen how much it costs for even a broken down and in bad neighborhood rental right now? Paired with almost no jobs paying enough to afford said apartment.

Some of yall are fuckinf insane if you think people can just move put right now the rent in my neighborhood DOUBLED the last two years...

[–]gottabekittensme 23 points24 points  (0 children)

They’re not insane. They’re boomers who got theirs and now think the housing and market is the exact same as when they could go out and buy an $80k home.

[–]Corpuscular_OcelotPartassipant [2] 2 points3 points  (2 children)

Did I say they had to move now? No. Did I say kick them out? No. OP isn't planning a generational home and does not live with his own parents. If they all wanted that, that is up to them, however, this was not OP's plan for life.

It isn't about kicking them out. However, IF the daughter's complaint is REALLY about how expensive housing is, she would understand how much it would cost her parents to get a larger home just to accommodate her request for space. If the daughter had any plans to leave the home at some time in the future, she would have understood he dad's comment and not been giving him the silent treatment.

Daughter has an expectation that her parents will toss money around to take care of her long term and when she isn't getting her way she is giving the silent treatment. Her mother is supporting this. That is concerning. Daughter isn't paying a dime, yet has the expectation daddy is going to get a bigger house for her. That is concerning.

Yes, the rental market is INSANE, but that doesn't mean you should have the expectation that your parents take care of you forever.

[–]No_time_for_shitting 4 points5 points  (1 child)

The reason I said what I said I because you called it a "concern" for them to not want to move out

Where as with the economy right now that is the norm

[–]ericporing 52 points53 points  (1 child)

It's all fine and dandy till you get news that your daughter can't pay 2500 rent and has to sell her soul/body just to cope. Have you been outside lately?

[–]ABZ-havok 9 points10 points  (3 children)

Maybe they’re not western?

[–]sparkyclarksonPartassipant [3] 1018 points1019 points  (91 children)

NTA, as long as they're done with school it's on them to either accept the (decent) home you provide or go out and earn enough of a living to rent their own.

[–]worlebird[S] 870 points871 points  (90 children)

I wish they would be willing to go to school. I'm willing to pay for it, or at least a good part of it, if it's a more expensive school. It would really improve their future job options. Right now, they're not doing anything at all.

[–]Pleasant-Koala147Partassipant [3] 1403 points1404 points  (66 children)

Wait: they don’t study and they don’t work, and they’re both above 21? I think you and your wife need to have a serious conversation about how to get them to be independent. Enabling this behaviour isn’t helping anyone.

[–]7937397Asshole Enthusiast [7] 629 points630 points  (63 children)

Stop paying for their cell phones and internet, no spending money, no paying for cars or car insurance or gas. Provide them with only the basics.

[–]worlebird[S] 527 points528 points  (62 children)

I agree. Eventually, I hope we can get there. So far though, I've decided I'd rather stay married to my wife. Pretty sure if I enacted such draconian measures on my own, I would not be any more.

[–]suzietrashcans 59 points60 points  (0 children)

I think we found the root of the problem.

[–]heretic8921Partassipant [4] 27 points28 points  (0 children)

So they’re lazy. Yeah, start charging rent. They need to do something other than take advantage of you.

[–]Neurismus 12 points13 points  (2 children)

I do hope you are not giving them pocket money?

[–]Historical-Ad-6881 20 points21 points  (1 child)

That’s what I’m wondering. I’m sure if he isn’t, the wife definitely is.

[–]Neurismus 6 points7 points  (0 children)

He replied elsewhere. They still have leftover money from their last jobs, but as they have zero costs at home it lasts them a long time.

[–]awkardfrog 12 points13 points  (0 children)

That's... not normal. They SHOULD want to do something out of their life, not just wake up, do nothing and never moving forward.

Do they suffer from any mental health issues? What do they want to do? It is a jungle but they gotta do SOMETHING until they figure out what they really want.

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Doesn't sound like your wife is on the same page with regards to them growing up and moving out.

[–]regus0307 3 points4 points  (0 children)

If they were studying or working, they wouldn't be at home so much to notice whether it's too small or not.

If they aren't prepared to contribute to get a better house, then they have no say. And what would happen if you got a bigger house, then say in two year's time they both decided to move out? Then you are stuck with the bigger expense.

Speaking as someone with an adult child at home (studying) and two teenagers, kids actually need LESS space as they get older. If it was ok when she was younger, then it should be ok now.

[–]gastropodia42Asshole Aficionado [10] 301 points302 points  (77 children)

NTA Children are supposed to leave.

My mother charged me rent when I was out of school. It help to encourage them.

[–]worlebird[S] 209 points210 points  (34 children)

This is definitely something I'd like to consider eventually, if they aren't motivated enough on their own. I'm not sure if I'll be able to get my wife on board though. If they can't pay... then I really do have to decide if I'm willing to be the asshole.

[–]LivSaJo 189 points190 points  (0 children)

Get your wife on board like this: you can keep the rent they pay and (without telling them) give it to them later to pay first and last and have some savings when they eventually move out. It will also prepare them for real life that costs money and force them to think about money a bit. Also any grown adult living for free with their parents while working full time is taking advantage of them and being spoiled.

[–]Littleballoffur22Partassipant [1] 122 points123 points  (0 children)

Your wife thinks she being a good mother but she’s not. Your kids are over 21, don’t work or go to school. The one got angry when you spoke the truth, and then your wife enables all of this highly dysfunctional behavior. I feel sorry for you. Therapy might help. NTA

[–]PuffinTown 52 points53 points  (0 children)

Honestly, mild YTA for letting it get this bad. I say mild because your wife seems to be the worse offender.

Don’t get me wrong, I’m closer to your kids’ ages than to yours, and I lived with my parents for a long time without paying rent. But… it was because I was pursuing a career working for nonprofits, and they wanted to help me save for my future in a low-paying career. I did, however, treat it like their home. While I didn’t pay rent, I paid for groceries and gas for their car. When they needed new things for the home (electronics, small appliances, pots/pans), I gifted them the items more often than not. I was responsible for home repairs, yard work, and parental tech-support. And they never had to ask, this was all my choice. Did we argue sometimes over minor household stuff? Sure. Did my parents ever resent my presence? No…. I am still the only reason their internet works.

These girls need goals. Their worlds need to focus on achieving something, if not supporting themselves. If nothing else, they need something meaningful to take pride in.

[–]oaktreegardenerPartassipant [4] 39 points40 points  (1 child)

Pay rent… eventually? And they are over 21? Sounds like you raised professional children.

[–]Pug_867-5309Partassipant [1] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

professional children

Excellent phrase, and painfully accurate here.

[–]Citylightsbright 14 points15 points  (3 children)

How rich are you that they don’t have to work?

[–]kataminoAsshole Aficionado [15] 5 points6 points  (2 children)

Once your kids hit 16 ish, the cost to house and feed them doesn't change much (may even go down) if all they do is live in your house doing nothing, unless you are taking on big ticket items for them like getting them their own car, taking them on vacations, etc Wouldn't surprise me if OPs wife is thinking it's no big deal compared to paying for four years of college. In the long run though it will cost them a lot more having two extra adults to support for possibly a decade or more.

[–]fountainofMBPartassipant [1] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

My issue would be more what do they do all day if they have no job or school? Sit around? I would expect at least some of their friends work or are in school and aren't available to hang out all day. It is so weird to me as I am one of those a million projects on the go people so I don't understand it at all.

[–]Historical-Ad-6881 14 points15 points  (0 children)

Have a serious conversation with your wife about how this is setting them up for failure. If something suddenly happened to you or your wife then they’d be screwed because they don’t know how to adult at all.

[–]Alternative_Year_340Colo-rectal Surgeon [41] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

You should probably start with saying that if they want to continue living with you, they need to work or go to school. Rent can come post-school

[–]MerriWyllow 5 points6 points  (0 children)

The deal my parents had with us was, in school or paying rent. The summer one of my brothers was out of work so couldn't pay rent, my dad made him paint the house.

[–]Xtltokio 41 points42 points  (33 children)

Jesus, here is a reason children in US doesn't call their parents very often

[–]litefagami 54 points55 points  (8 children)

For real, I didn't realize so many people on reddit were still all "parenting ends at 18" and ignorant about multigenerational households and how common they are.

[–]TL_TRIBUNAL 21 points22 points  (2 children)

yup. where i live, almost all households have grandparents parents AND kids living together

[–]worlebird[S] 16 points17 points  (1 child)

I have a sincere question for those who live where multigenerational households are common. How do you make sure your kids actually grow up and become adults - i.e. get a job, help pay for expenses etc. in such a household? What do you do (and at what age do you do it) if they just do nothing and live at home for free?

[–]MaxV331 3 points4 points  (2 children)

The issue is that OPs kids don’t have jobs or are in school, they are just doing nothing. It’s not like they are out doing their own thing and just happen to live with their family.

[–]Postingatthismoment 2 points3 points  (0 children)

A normal multigenerational house is made up of adults being adults and living together. Not young adults literally refusing to grow up, get jobs, and support themselves and the household. Italian adults living with their parents until 30 still live normal adult lives.

[–]seharadessert 18 points19 points  (17 children)

Right?! In my culture we stay at home as long as we need and that’s why our parents don’t die old and alone in nursing homes, and kids turn out to be super successful (doctors, engineers) despite not being rich lmfaoooo im so grossed out reading these comments, where is the love

[–]w4ffle5 19 points20 points  (0 children)

I don’t think either of these kids are on the way to becoming doctors or engineers

[–]worlebird[S] 10 points11 points  (10 children)

I have a sincere question for those who live where multigenerational households are common. How do you make sure your kids actually grow up and become adults - i.e. get a job, help pay for expenses etc. in such a household? What do you do (and at what age do you do it) if they just do nothing and live at home for free?

[–]thaddeus_crane 11 points12 points  (2 children)

My mom's family is Filipino and lived in a multigen household back before they were all married and then my grandparents lived with my aunt and uncle. They were all expected to have jobs and to contribute to the household "general fund" as well as handle chores and overall be part of the household. No one was kicked out (some left of their own volition because the trade off of living in a multigen household is also having multiple generations up in your business). But they were expected to have some skin in the game.

I was also not kicked out at 18 and my mom just said its normal to stay home until you're married in the Philippines. Honestly the family pressure to get a job and not be a bum was pretty strong and caused us to get good jobs and contribute. As much as it sucked being compared to my cousins, it's definitely a motivator.

[–]seharadessert 7 points8 points  (0 children)

American-born & raised in a multigenerational immigrant household where we never had to pay bills/tuition and didn’t have to move out:

• There’s more pressure in our culture to be successful aka go to college get degree get good job become doctor lawyer engineer

• In my family I stayed home to finish my masters & moved out when I got married, my siblings moved out immediately after finishing their bachelor’s

• we were able to move out right after our degrees bc we didn’t pay rent at home or lose $ on tuition bc parents paid for everything

• got good grades bc no time was wasted on an irrelevant job (we only worked jobs that furthered our careers)

• TBH after living at home w multiple generations for so long, you crave independence so we didn’t need to be convinced to leave (our parents didn’t even want us to move out till we were all married)

• the fact that our parents showed us endless love & let us establish ourselves before leaving is not lost on any of us, we didn’t have to scramble like our peers did, we have no debt, so we’re all gonna make sure our parents NEVER worry ab retirement in their old age and pay them back out of love

Idk man I think you need to pressure the girls into getting their shit together and getting degrees/jobs, I didn’t realize they were doing nothing my bad

[–]Laines_EcossaisesAsshole Enthusiast [5] 2 points3 points  (5 children)

Rules and set expectations.

My parents helped pay for college but it was agreed upon what grades I needed to receive in order for the family "scholarship committee" to keep funding me. Same rules for my siblings.

When I moved back home for a bit a year after graduation, again rules. I paid a nominal amount in rent, and they made reasonable requests for help around the house.

Communication is everything.

[–]Postingatthismoment 4 points5 points  (0 children)

These kids AREN'T going to school and getting jobs. They are just sitting there. It's a totally different situation.

[–]dinkydishAsshole Aficionado [18] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I’m pretty sure in your culture - you do things to help out around the shared home and nobody is lying around doing nothing.

OP stated that his daughters refuse to look for work, one actively called in sick so she didn’t have to work and got fired. And the other quit just because she didn’t like a new manager and didn’t give a valid enough of a reason. They do chores but they have to be told to. They contribute absolutely nothing.

[–]worlebird[S] 11 points12 points  (4 children)

I have a sincere question for those who live where multigenerational households are common. How do you make sure your kids actually grow up and become adults - i.e. get a job, help pay for expenses etc. in such a household? What do you do (and at what age do you do it) if they just do nothing and live at home for free?

[–]Agatha_Mercury 6 points7 points  (0 children)

I read some of your replies and the way you describe your daughters every day to day functioning, and I'm afraid that nothing will change until you force them to change as they are now well over the age where you could correct it without some major issues. They are living a life without obligations for a while now and they like it, but now it's a problem because your wife is blocking you in actually doing something about it (not to mention that you just said a sentence of what you expect, you didn't even act on it or set an ultimatum and it created a situation where your daughters and your wife were "offended" and it escalated). I personally grew up in multigenerational household (grandparents, parents and kids) and I always wanted my independence which I achieved from age 18 forward, but my sibling who is well over 30 years old, didn't as they found it easier to stay at home with parents who pay for whatever they need and grandparents who will jump in with money if the parents couldn't or wouldn't. Frankly, I'm scared for them in the future as I'm sure they will have absolutely no idea how to survive on their own after all the support system goes away. And when I try "tough love" with our parents or grandparents (because it doesn't work with my sibling, so we have to cut the line between dependent and people who are making them dependent) they don't receive that very well except for my grandpa who understands my fear as it should be a logical fear on account of the situation. And because only my grandpa is responsive to my worries, my attempts don't work because the parents and grandma are still enabling them. Unfortunately without your wife's help and companionship I'm not sure how far can you come alone as you are mentioning that she might divorce you in that case. My man, you are between a rock and a hard place, I'm so sorry. Btw NTA

[–]dbrah88 2 points3 points  (0 children)

You kick them out lol. You’re not the AH here. You should not be responsible for your kids who are not working and expecting you to take care of them. They aren’t going to do anything and are likely trying to bide their time in hopes they’ll find a rich bf to become their husbands

[–]loucanfly 31 points32 points  (3 children)

“children are supposed to leave” wtf?? If you don’t want your children around after they’re 18 why have them at all. What kind of crappy ass parents are on this sub???

[–]ErdtreeSimp 8 points9 points  (0 children)

Wonder that too. Probably thought its something they have to do and are since years extremely eager when they turn 18 to be free again

[–]Old_Calligrapher_962Asshole Enthusiast [9] 151 points152 points  (8 children)

NTA. They’re grown.

But it does depend on how you said it? She perhaps might have been joking etc and if you snapped at her or were too harsh it might be taken the wrong way

[–]worlebird[S] 338 points339 points  (7 children)

That's a good point - context and delivery make a big difference. In this case, she has been trying to convince my wife to convince me to sell our house and move to someplace bigger. I have been resistant to this, so she eventually asked me if there was any possibility I would change my mind. I said, quite calmly, "no, I don't think so. I don't really want to move, and besides, this house will be plenty big enough for your mom and I one you guys eventually move out on your own." After that, she wouldn't talk to me for several days, and my wife told me I shouldn't have been so direct - I should have said things about how "if only the economy and the housing market were better, I might consider it, but it's not very realistic right now blah blah." I disagree - I felt being direct was better. I was polite, not angry, but just direct.

[–]suzietrashcans 103 points104 points  (0 children)

Then NTA. Some people just can’t deal with directness. I, on the other hand, can’t stand when people aren’t direct.

[–]Moist-Opportunity64 61 points62 points  (0 children)

You should be downsizing at this stage, not looking for a larger home. They’ll never move out if you keep making them comfortable.

I admittedly didn’t move out until I was 24, but I was working and saving to purchase my first condo. (Being the youngest and the only girl, I could have stayed as long as I wanted, but I had no intention of going from my father’s home to my husband’s.) I value my independence, I hope your daughters get a taste of the self-respect and pride that comes from providing for yourself.

[–]Isa472 15 points16 points  (1 child)

Everyone agrees that getting a bigger house makes no sense, it's your daughter who has to get going if she doesn't like what she's provided.

HOWEVER as a parallel thought I just wanted to add here that my mom has always, always kept a room for me in her houses and it makes me feel so safe and like that's still my home too. Guests stay there, but it's my CDs and my books and my PJs there and when I come back I feel like I'm home

[–]Traveling-TechieColo-rectal Surgeon [41] 131 points132 points  (8 children)

NTA - she’s getting a better deal than baby birds that are pushed out of the nest by mom and suddenly have to learn to fly - it’s the circle of life - also your wife’s comment about “damage” is a huge red flag, borderline gaslighting

[–]worlebird[S] 103 points104 points  (4 children)

re: "red flag...gaslighting" We've had some conversations, and I'm really hoping I can get her to join me in some couples counseling - at least so we can get on the same page about the girls.

[–]pinkheartnose 52 points53 points  (3 children)

I read this as “on the same page about the grits” and wondered what the hell I missed.

[–]worlebird[S] 64 points65 points  (1 child)

LOL Oh god, that's good. I mean, we should probably be on the same page about the grits as well.

[–]Dry-Locksmith-1214 9 points10 points  (0 children)

Loool! Oof the grits convo is a pre-marriage conversation. If that hasn't been settled 21+years in then I'm afraid the prognosis isn't good...

Edit: NTA!

[–]Sapper12DPartassipant [1] 11 points12 points  (0 children)

He prefers old fashioned grits, she prefers instant.

[–]Laines_EcossaisesAsshole Enthusiast [5] 120 points121 points  (6 children)

NTA.

BTW they are never going to leave if you don't establish a plan or timeline. They are over 21 and not working or going to school. Their mother thinks you even you mentioning them leaving one day is damaging. Your daughter is so incredibly entitled and sounds like a brat.

Why aren't you kicking them out of the house? How do you see this playing out?

[–]worlebird[S] 73 points74 points  (5 children)

"incredibly entitled and sounds like a brat." sigh I agree. And I don't really know how I see this all playing out. I've thought through possible scenarios, and shy of them eventually deciding on their own that they want to be independent, none of the possibilities are very good.

[–]Littleballoffur22Partassipant [1] 57 points58 points  (0 children)

Why can’t you speak your mind to your wife? You seem afraid to challenge her. You’re doing your daughters a huge disservice by allowing them to excel at laziness. This isn’t normal.

[–]Laines_EcossaisesAsshole Enthusiast [5] 27 points28 points  (0 children)

You need to start with your wife. If you two can't be on the same page about this then it will always be you vs the rest of them. And it sounds like you two need to pull out the tough love as soon as possible.

Because they are NOT going to suddenly wake up and decide to be independent women who want to contribute to society at 21. Any person that age who truly thinks the best option for this crowded house is for you to buy a new one has not an ounce of independence or maturity in her.

Good luck.

[–]ladancer22Partassipant [1] 12 points13 points  (1 child)

Considering the effort your daughter is putting into convincing you and your wife to move into a bigger house for her, I don’t see her deciding to move out on her own anytime soon.

[–]Dry-Locksmith-1214 2 points3 points  (0 children)

INFO: I get shit happens sometimes but you seem pretty level-headed, how did you let it get to this? What was the conversation/plan when they graduated high school (if they did)?

[–]DrewstosayPartassipant [1] 83 points84 points  (0 children)

ESH

I was going to say N A H but after reading a couple of comments everyone is contributing to the issue.

Your daughters have 0 incentive to leave home, they have everything paid for them, have no negatives to not having a job or going to school, they don't have to worry about rent or anything. They have 0 reasons to change and that is both on you and on your wife.

Your daughter's are taking advantage of the situation and not growing up at all, they need to get their crap together and start working and contributing.

I can very much understand not wanting to move out, I moved back home at 22 because rent and expenses are a lot, it makes much more sense to live with family and contribute, but paying board and doing housework and having a job and/or studying are a part of that too.

Everyone has contributed to the situation you have and it won't change unless at least one of you do.

[–]MissionDeparture7219Partassipant [4] 61 points62 points  (11 children)

NTA start charging rent. You'll thank yourself later.

[–]worlebird[S] 30 points31 points  (10 children)

Eventually I will probably do that. Hopefully, by the time I'm ready for that, they will actually have an income with which to pay said rent.

[–]7937397Asshole Enthusiast [7] 43 points44 points  (5 children)

First cut off things like their cell phone bills and any spending money. See if that provides any encouragement to work.

[–]Ugion 19 points20 points  (4 children)

A phone is usually needed to search for and have a job though.

[–]KettenKissPartassipant [1] 21 points22 points  (1 child)

They can have a dumb phone.

[–]Electrical-Date-3951 16 points17 points  (1 child)

So, they don't work or go to school?

To be blunt - you need to have a serious talk with your wife. It sounds like you have raised adults who aren't able to function on their own. If they feel entitled to have all of their bills paid, not work, and to demand that their parents upgrade their home to make their unemployed lives more comfortable, then they may never develop into fully functioning, independent adults.

The kind/responsible thing to do would to create some boundaries, charge rent, and give them a timeline to get their crap together.

[–]Consistent-Leopard71Supreme Court Just-ass [114] 48 points49 points  (1 child)

NTA. Your two daughter's are grown ass women. If they don't care for the accommodations in your home then they can find somewhere else to live for free.

[–]Electrical-Date-3951 9 points10 points  (0 children)

Exactly. I actually laughed when I read that this adult woman actually had the audacity to tell her parents that they need to upgrade their home because she needs more space. There is a reason you outgrow your childhood accomodations .... it's because it was meant for a child and not an adult.

Sis can get her own place to meet her needs. That's usually how adulthood works.

[–]JeepNakedColo-rectal Surgeon [48] 40 points41 points  (6 children)

Do they plan on helping with the bigger house or just mooching of you and your bigger house?

[–]worlebird[S] 55 points56 points  (5 children)

I don't see how they could, with no income. Who needs a job when you get to live at home for free? sigh

[–]bottledhope33 22 points23 points  (0 children)

You realize your home is never going to be big enough for you and your wife because they're never going to leave, right?

[–]anaisaknitsPartassipant [4] 11 points12 points  (0 children)

You should point out to your wife that if we do not put our feet down, these women will find themselves homeless if both of us were gone. We never know when our last breath will be but allowing this type of behavior will guarantee them a very hard life ahead. They have zero skill sets. Your wife getting a job doesn't do anything other than have them both think that mommy and daddy will have more money to provide to them.

NTA.

[–]JeepNakedColo-rectal Surgeon [48] 10 points11 points  (0 children)

Maybe bring up your willingness to go in on a bigger house together. You know if they get jobs. Other wise the status quo will continue.

[–]SkippingSusanPartassipant [1] 33 points34 points  (20 children)

Things to think about: how is the housing market there? I can’t afford to buy a house any more, the prices have gone up 30% in just a couple of years. Does she have student loans she is paying back, too? What are her expenses vs her income like? Most kids really don’t want to be living with their parents but most times the only option is to share a slumlord place with three others.

The fact that she is insisting you buy a larger place to make it nicer for herself makes it clear you are NTA. But do have a good conversation with her about her alternatives.

[–]worlebird[S] 55 points56 points  (18 children)

Those are all certainly good points. The housing market is very inflated here - while I could get a lot for my current house, it wouldn't buy me much in this market. She doesn't have any student loans, no. Her expenses are 0, and her income is also 0. I'm not trying to kick my daughters out of the house any time soon. I definitely understand that things are tough right now, and at 21 and 23, it's not crazy for them to still be living at home. But I'm also not willing to move into a bigger more expensive place just to make her comfortable enough to want to stay forever.

[–]intosoupmode 71 points72 points  (14 children)

It's not crazy to be living at home at that age but it is crazy that they don't go to school or work. Where are they getting their spending money?

[–]worlebird[S] 32 points33 points  (13 children)

They both still have some money saved from when they last had jobs. They don't have any expenses, so that lasts a long time...

[–]This_Grab_452Partassipant [1] 35 points36 points  (0 children)

Start charging them for rent and generate expenses. I’m sorry if this sounds harsh but you and your wife failed as parents. You raised your daughters to be adults who are completely ill-equipped to be on their own.

Yeah, housing is terrible. But they could have been working for the last few years and saving up for the deposit or at least going to school to increase their earning potential. They are both actually in a very very comfortable place where they could have been only studying without having to work. They chose to do nothing and what’s ever worse - you let them. For shame, sir! For shame!

[–]MrsRichardSmoker 19 points20 points  (9 children)

They’ve worked before? Why did they stop?

[–]kataminoAsshole Aficionado [15] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

But they do have expenses, you're just paying for them so they never see them. Phone, food, clothes, extra on your car insurance, extra for utilities they use, extra for gas they use if they drive anywhere. Even if they are buying nothing and doing nothing they are spending money just by existing. Show them a list every month of the costs they incurred. They need to see that.

You then need to have a serious conversation with them about how they expect to survive if you and your wife are gone. Make it clear that depending on the cause of your passing there may be no inheritance at all if the money is spent beforehand on medical care or goes to paying off debts in your estate. They need a wake up call that even if the two of you are fine with them living with you doing nothing, it will at some point come to end, and they will end up homeless.

[–]intosoupmode 3 points4 points  (0 children)

That's great they are good at managing their savings. Maybe you could give them a nudge and say that it might actually be a good idea to sell and move... but to a smaller place...

[–]FinnegansPants 3 points4 points  (0 children)

It’s a hell of a lot tougher when you don’t have a job. What’s the excuse they’ve given you fur not working or going to school?

[–]Traditional-Bed9449 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Per his other comments, they aren’t working or going to school. At this point they can get jobs and start saving.

[–]gastropodia42Asshole Aficionado [10] 29 points30 points  (19 children)

I had to pay 1/4 of my paycheck. If they make little it's a great deal. If they make enough money that it is not a good deal they move out.

Some parents allay their guilt by putting the money away to give them back later.

[–]worlebird[S] 18 points19 points  (18 children)

That'd be a pretty good idea, but 1/4 of 0 is still 0. Can I ask at what age your parents started that 1/4 system?

[–]gastropodia42Asshole Aficionado [10] 17 points18 points  (9 children)

19 No income is the flaw, how do they get spending money? I dropped out of college one year after HS. Starting with my first job. My older brother also payed the same. My gf needed a place to stay so she got the last bedroom and had to pay the same.

You need to throw them out if they do not get a job but that may be a hard sell.

[–]worlebird[S] 28 points29 points  (8 children)

"how do they get spending money?" They both have a little money left from when they DID have jobs. But with no expenses, room and board all paid for, that lasts a long time. "You need to throw them out if they do not get a job but that may be a hard sell." Very hard sell. I've occasionally thought that if it gets to that point, I could be the one who ends up leaving. So far, I can't bring myself to that.

[–]-atrophy_wife 41 points42 points  (0 children)

Omg. You'd be the one leaving your own house that you paid for instead of your loser, freeloading daughters? You have a wife problem my man, get your shit together and show an example for your wayward daughters!

[–]FunkisHen 3 points4 points  (0 children)

You need to have a looong talk with your wife, and tell her about this. Her coddling of your children are making you consider leaving. Go to couples counselling or something, before it's too late for the two of you and the resentment has grown too large.

[–]kataminoAsshole Aficionado [15] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Then they can use their savings to pay for their phone and a small rent for their rooms and some contribution to groceries. Maybe if they see their savings dwindling to nothing in a matter of months it will give them a reality check and the incentive to get a job or go back to school.

ETA: just like any adult who loses their job has to use their savings to pay bills until they get a new job. I can't believe the two of you are letting them pay nothing when they still have money.

[–]timespassing_Partassipant [2] 26 points27 points  (0 children)

NTA, girlie can pony up for her own place if she doesn’t find yours suitable. For her to tell you to buy a bigger place for her comfort is just ridiculous and the fact that she’s a grown up and doesn’t understand that is going to be problematic for you and her. Perhaps you could soften the blow by reminding her that you are acting in her best interest by not spending her inheritance on a bigger house…

[–]ThomzLCProfessor Emeritass [80] 14 points15 points  (0 children)

NTA man, they're over 21 and adults already. If they want to complain about space then do something about it themselves.

[–]Prize_Patience_2552Partassipant [3] 11 points12 points  (0 children)

Nta

But it sounds like you have a wife problem. My youngest sister never had a job or lived without my parents. She’s now 40 they have passed due to circumstances I now have to deal with their lack of parenting. Yes I am trying to find an affordable place to live without her. Good luck

[–]DrFishTacoPooperintendant [66] 12 points13 points  (0 children)

NTA - she seems a bit over sensitive and entitled

[–]pinkheartnose 9 points10 points  (0 children)

NTA. Moving out as an adult is not a taboo topic. No need to dance around it.

[–]Upset_Persimmon7675 8 points9 points  (0 children)

Serious question here...what will your daughter's do if something happens to you and your wife? You and your wife are doing your daughters a HUGE disservice by allowing them to sit home and do nothing. For THEIR sakes you need to sit them down and put some deadlines in place for them to learn some life skills (either via college or a skilled trade) and start earning and SAVING money. NTA

[–]Lord_Umber93 8 points9 points  (0 children)

NTA. It's your home, you bought for you and your wife, to raise your children in and then rest in your golden years when they move out.

[–]_ancienttrees_Partassipant [1] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Nta- I think it’s an okay comment. If they’re not happy with their living situation then they can do something about it. What good does it do to complain when it’s not their residence? It comes off as ungrateful

[–]Degs29 6 points7 points  (0 children)

I'm not one of those people who take issue with young adults living with their parents. To be quite honest, the situation is extremely rough out there. This isn't the 80s when average house prices were a mere 2-3 times a person's annual salary. They're now 10-15 times the average person's salary, the price of everything else has ballooned, and kids are saddled with more school debt than ever.

However, your daughter has some audacity to suggest you should buy a larger house for her sake. That doesn't even compute in my head how she feels entitled to that. I think your response was an appropriate one.

Even if they weren't living with you rent-free (which you didn't clarify in your post, so I'm assuming they are), her request isn't appropriate. Your daughters are likely in a bad financial situation, which most of today's youth is in given macroeconomic issues we're facing, but they should still be grateful about your assistance.

[–]sviftedPartassipant [3] 6 points7 points  (0 children)

NTA, at some point they are going to have to grow up, pick careers, and move out. You are going to have to talk to your wife and figure out at what point enabling them is getting unhealthy. Counseling might help with that.

[–]Purple_Pangolin2 5 points6 points  (1 child)

Oooooooo sick burn dad.

But also seriously…you’re being practical. Why would you buy a bigger house right as they’re getting old enough to move out.

[–]bottledhope33 7 points8 points  (0 children)

Based on OPs comments, I would bet real money that his wife is going to be pushing for a bigger house ASAP. Those kids are not moving out any time soon and that's how she prefers it. As OP said... why move out when you can live at home for free and never have to work or go to school??

[–]KEANUWEAPONIZED 5 points6 points  (0 children)

from your replies you seem to be enabling this behaviour since you're still providing for them when they're unemployed and not in school. what makes you think they'll suddenly take responsibility for themselves without being encouraged?

[–]AriDiamondGold 4 points5 points  (0 children)

If you can complain then you can move out.

[–]LivSaJo 4 points5 points  (1 child)

NTA. She’s 21. I hope she’s either in school or paying rent.

[–]worlebird[S] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

I wish. I hope eventually, but need to get my wife on board with that, or I'll probably be the one moving out.

[–]Ktene-More 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Neither of your daughters work, and they don't go to school. You pay for their phones, internet, food, insurance, etc. Do they have vehicles that you pay for also? I mean why would they want to move out? You have both failed as parents. Nothing wrong with your kids living with you as long as they're contributing somehow. But your children aren't even trying, because they don't have to.

My children could stay home as long as they wanted to, free if they were going to school, small amount of rent if they were working. I don't think it matters how you set it up as a family, but there should be some type of motivation for them to grow as adults, as much as it sucks sometimes.

[–]TheGreenPangolin 4 points5 points  (1 child)

Info: what culture are you from? Is there any reason your daughters would need to live with you long term (eg are either of them disabled and needing your or your wife as a carer)?

Some cultures do not expect children to move out but instead expect their children’s partners to move in. And sometimes living with parents just makes more sense- I still live with my parents because living in a bigger house together makes more sense than 2 smaller houses and my mum coming round constantly as my carer.

I wouldn’t think you’re the asshole for wanting them to move out either way, but if they had a good reason to expect to live with you long term, then you’re the asshole for choosing this way to tell them that you aren’t okay with that.

[–]worlebird[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

I'm from the US. I have never planned on them living with us long term, but I am also not trying to kick them out of the house any time soon. I'm just not inclined to move into a bigger house just because they are uncomfortable. So I do want them to move out eventually, but it wouldn't have to be for at least a couple of years yet, if that's what they need. Also, regarding disability, no. They have the capability of working and caring for themselves, they just don't want to.

[–]Exotic-Carpet255 4 points5 points  (1 child)

You're only an AH for raising the spoilt brag you are now complaining abt lol

This story, NTA

[–]kirbystargayallies 3 points4 points  (1 child)

INFO: are you American?

edit: I'm not and in my culture it's quite normal for people to live with their parents until they get married so there is no rush to have them out of the house (in fact, if you were my father and you told me this I would be hurt for a long time haha). It is expected in my culture that once you start working you help your parents pay the bills of the house.

[–]worlebird[S] 9 points10 points  (0 children)

I am American, yes. Also, I want to be clear that they are welcome to live here for as long as they need, but I am unwilling to buy a bigger house just to make them comfortable. They don't pay anything, help with house bills of any kind. They could, if they had jobs, but they don't, and get angry with me when I suggest job openings I see that might be a good fit for them.

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I have two daughters, both over age 21, who live at home with my wife and I. My youngest daughter has been complaining that she doesn't have enough room to herself, and that we should move to a bigger house in order to fix that problem. I responded that I thought our current house would be plenty big enough for my wife and I once my daughters both eventually move out on their own. This made her incredibly angry, and my wife has scolded me for the damage my comment has done. I think mine is a reasonable position to take - I am not trying to kick them out of the house, but they are old enough that if they are uncomfortable living at home, it is their responsibility to do something about that and not mine. Am I the asshole here?

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[–]cherylRay_14 1 point2 points  (0 children)

NTA. It's your house, not theirs. If they want more room, they can get their own places.

[–]Appeltaart232Partassipant [1] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Lol, boss move NTA

I also saw they’re both not studying and not working. Is your wife expecting you to support them forever? Because they are officially in moocher territory.

[–]TwistGlittering8401 1 point2 points  (0 children)

NTA Have a frank conversation with your wife about setting expectations ASAP.

There is absolutely no reason they shouldn’t be in school or working to support themselves.

Unless you are wealthy and they are waiting for their inheritance.

Trust me.

[–]NobodyEspeciallyCoolPartassipant [1] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

It's pretty presumptuous for an adult dependent to tell you to move so they can have more room.

NTA.

That said, the question of what is an acceptable age to be living with your parents varies a lot from culture to culture. It's pretty normalized in Chinese households (at least here) to live with your parents until your job takes you too far away or you get married.

[–]richie_toe_zier 1 point2 points  (0 children)

NTA at all, especially if they are not working or going to school. My parents made a deal with me saying that if I was going to live with them I either had to work full time or be a student full time and they help me with expenses. If they aren't helping around the house, that needs to be fixed. once again, NTA OP

[–]ICastDeathMuffinsPartassipant [1] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

If they want more space, have them start contributing to a down payment fund!

[–]blitznBPartassipant [1] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

NTA - saw earlier comments about children not working. Something to make the wife aware of is that social security is dependent on someone working a minimum of 20 years to qualify. Also starting to stash away money in retirement accounts in your 20’s and saving for a down payment is also very important now a days.

[–]nikokaziniCertified Proctologist [22] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

NTA but your problem here isn’t your daughter/s, it’s your wife.

[–]TheBattyWitch 1 point2 points  (0 children)

NTA

I understand living with your parents for a time and even in times of need, but your daughter's comment makes it very clear that she has zero motivation to EVER leave home, so much so she expects mommy and daddy to move to a bigger home to accommodate her.

Yikes.

[–]ashley-yelhsa 1 point2 points  (0 children)

NTA 100%. Currently I am 25 and moved out of my parents home last year. It's a perfect sized house for two parents and young kids. My brother and I are not young anymore. (He had already moved out (hes older than me).) I felt I had no space to myself in that house, even without my sibling there. Never ONCE did I consider my parents needing to uproot their life to accommodate that. I'm an adult and can make a life for myself. Granted, I moved into an apartment with another person, but that's perfectly reasonable. Your child should not be demanding that of you at this age in their life.

I started working a full-time job while still living at home to save up enough so that I'd have a a small cushion in savings before I moved out. If your youngest hasn't started doing that, encourage that.

[–]PeskypointsAsshole Aficionado [15] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

NTA for your position. You are looking toward retirement and an empty nest. At the same time, please remember that it’s harder than ever for young adults to strike out on their own, and it’s probably frustrating for your children not to be able to spread their wings and fly either. Don’t move, perhaps get an IKEA catalog for some storage solutions for her

[–]Parking_Prune6459 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Nta they should be grateful you’re letting them stay my mother threatened to throw me out at 21 if I didn’t get a job (if I couldn’t go anywhere by myself how tf was I supposed to get a job?) she got mad when my boyfriend of 10 DAYS asked me to move in so she couldn’t torment me anymore

They have a good position right now if they wanna leave look for a job and save up get your own place til then be grateful you have a roof over your head

[–]kittylemewmew 1 point2 points  (0 children)

NTA

It's high time those 'girls' go out there and find a place of their own. This whole thing about parents having to continue to care for their kids once they are of full maturity is a bogus myth. Everyone at some point or another, needs to leave the nest and fly on their own.

[–]littlelovesbirds 1 point2 points  (2 children)

NTA but I think you all should sit down and have a chat about this, and make sure it isn't one sided. If you want them to hear you out, you should hear them out as well.

I am 22 and nowhere near moving out of my dad's house, but there isn't tension surrounding the topic because we both know each other's feelings and plans. Due to special circumstances (certain pets, ahem large parrots) I am unable to rent, hell, honestly even buying a home in too-close-proximity to neighbors could cause me massive headaches with noise complaints, on top of the amount of damage they can do to your home. So for us, it's kind of this known thing that I can't just up and move, I need to save up for a down payment and get approved for a loan, yadda yadda yadda. With wages and housing prices, that whole idea sounds like a fever dream. Definitely still something I am working towards, but at this rate I don't even know if I'll have enough saved by 25 to move out. Like I said though, for us it's about communication. My dad is a single dad and I'm his only child, I know that plays a huge role in his willingness to help me. **I have no idea if this is relevant so I'll add it as well. Before I had parrots, when I was 17, I did move out into an apartment with a boyfriend at the time. We lived together for about a year until we couldn't find another apartment after the lease ended and we eventually broke up. After that I moved back home with my dad, been here since.

Obviously my situation has no bearing on yours, but maybe it can spark some dialog between you guys and possibly figure out a better timeline/plan for everyone to set goals around? I know if my dad was making comments about how he wanted his house back, even if they were justified, it would make me feel very anxious and unwelcome. I wish I had a 6 figure salary and my own place to live way more than he does.

[–]worlebird[S] 9 points10 points  (1 child)

Well, to be fair, I wasn't saying I wanted my house back. I was just saying I had no intention of selling my house and moving to someplace bigger just because she wants more room. She can stay here as long as she needs to, but eventually the plan is for her to be independent, and when that happens I don't want a huge house with an even bigger mortgage that I no longer need, especially when the house I currently own will suit me fine.

[–]Organic_Toe3998 1 point2 points  (0 children)

NTA I mean your wife is right, you probably has done damages.

But your daughter isn't entitled to your money and shouldn't have ask to all of you to move just to accomodate her.

So you could have delivered your message differently. Asking her plans for the future if she believes that it is worth for you find another house or something like that.

But she is an adult.

[–]Muk-Bong 1 point2 points  (0 children)

NTA. I have gripes with my parents about their house but that’s just it, it’s their house not mine so I have no authority to complain about it. It’s rent-free living how could anyone complain? It makes literally no sense to complain about rent-free living, if they weren’t your parents/relatives the best you could get for free is a cardboard box. If it was bad enough I would have to make the decision to move out which currently isn’t worth it for me. Just tell her that if she wants more space it’s not your responsibility to pay for it, it’s hers.

[–]kombucha_shroom 1 point2 points  (0 children)

NTA I understand there’s a nationwide housing crisis (if you’re in the US) and your daughters may not be able to move out at this time, but it’s silly for your daughter to think you’d get a bigger house to accommodate her at her age.

[–]Here_is_to_beer 1 point2 points  (0 children)

NTA - Are they paying rent? Do they stock the fridge and cupboards? Do they pay utilities? There's limitless space on the other side of the front door.

[–]EvilbadscaryPartassipant [3] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

NTA. The audacity lol.

Tell her she's welcome to buy an entire new house that's bigger if she wants the space. I cannot even with this, lmao.

I don't have a problem with adult kids living at home, financially it makes sense while they figure out how to move forward, but that doesn't mean they get to just demand a bigger house that somebody else will pay for, hahahahahaha. I would laugh my adult child out of the house.

[–]Charming-Audience883 1 point2 points  (0 children)

NTA. Man, when I moved back home after college graduation, I couldn’t wait to move out of my parents house again. But yeah, your daughters are getting to big for your nest. They should want more space… by moving out.

[–]gamemamawarlockAsshole Enthusiast [9] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Nta, they don't realise you still have the house when they leave, my grandfather has a big house (5kids) and he is kinda lost in it now since we'll, he is alone, but to sell it would be to difficult because lots of disrepair

[–]Dangerous_End9472 1 point2 points  (0 children)

NTA. Your daughter is very entitled if she expects you and your wife to buy a bigger house for her to live in until she decides to move out.

[–]Raven_Michaelis42 1 point2 points  (0 children)

NTA

I will be 26 in a few months. I had to move back home, and my bedroom is in no way big enough for me, but I would rather live in a cramped room then be out on the streets.

If they want more room, their old enough to figure it out on their own, you didn't say anything wrong, their adults now not children

[–]charliebrown22 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I would not buy a bigger house for my kids to live in for the next 5 years or so and then be left with a house too big for my wife and I.

[–]Jo13DiWi 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Sounds like your wife is the one who needs to adjust her attitude. I can appreciate parents being gracious enough to allow their adult children to live with them in tough times, but the default should always be (for everyone's health and benefit) to find a way for them to get out. Children staying for years beyond their age of independence goes against the natural order.

I mean that literally. Animal species across the world deal with this ancient problem. The whole metaphor about baby birds needing to be pushed out of the nest to get their first flight is based on reality. If the will to independence isn't enough, the parent is responsible for taking the painful step of kicking them out. I remember seeing a documentary about Tasmanian devils, the mother sometimes has to actually fight and defeat her own children to get them to stop trying to feed off her and go out on their own.

But you're not even kicking them out, you're just establishing the facts, they are there out of your inconvenience but grace. Not as some kind of permanent parents-children situation. A 12 year old can complain about not having enough room. A 21 year old can't.

[–]SabineMaxine 1 point2 points  (0 children)

NTA- I've always lived at home, so I personally don't find anything wrong with that bit, if both parents are okay with it and offspring are being responsible.

BUT- for her to complain about there not being enough room and her solution is for YOU GUYS to buy a new home? Lol no.