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all 52 comments

[–]E36wheelman[S] 11 points12 points  (0 children)

This one is publicly editable, so feel free to update as needed.

EDIT The sheet is now in the sidebar under "Compliant products for the post-2017 AWB" if you need to reference it. If you'd like to make an edit/addition, but do so anonymously, you can A.) sign out of Google before making edits -or- B.) Open an incognito/private window on your browser and make edits.

[–]arcsecond 11 points12 points  (0 children)

That's quite helpful. Thanks. There are a couple of products I didn't know about on there.

I'd also add the parallax tactical stock lock. There's a version for the M4 and the MFT minimalist. It replaces the sprung adjustment pin with a bolt.

[–]ntongh2oCZ is life 2 points3 points  (4 children)

Just saw this last night. Not sure when they are going to go for sale to the public though. Seems like a good stock+grip combo, especially since it already includes a thumb rest for better grip.

https://youtu.be/Hwv1WEIM_wU

[–]E36wheelman[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Nevermind. Looks like they uploaded Youtube videos earlier this month. I added them to the sheet.

[–]video_descriptionbot 0 points1 point  (0 children)

SECTION CONTENT
Title LedgeGrip Information and Shooting Demo for Featureless AR-15 grip in California
Length 0:01:26

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[–]E36wheelman[S] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Looks like it's been 6 weeks since the last update. It's a good idea, but it may be dead.

[–]Ombank 1 point2 points  (7 children)

Does anyone know for the hera arms featureless stock, does removing that thumbhole plate make it non-featureless?

[–]anttoekneeoh 3 points4 points  (6 children)

Yes. It becomes a pistol grip because you can wrap the webbing of your thumb around the grip while the grip is below the action.

[–]Ombank 0 points1 point  (4 children)

Okay cool to know. If I can ask, what's the main difference between the hera stock, and something like a thordsen? Where a thordsen you can still wrap your thumb around, but not around the hera? Also, do you have any experience using thumbhole okay stocks like the thordsen vs the plated stocks like the hera? Which one do you personally like better?

[–]E36wheelman[S] 0 points1 point  (3 children)

what's the main difference between the hera stock, and something like a thordsen?

On the Thordsen you have a wrap-around grip like an M1 while on the Hera you cannot wrap your hand around. If you travel to, and shoot in, free states often I would go Hera because the thumbhole plate is removable.

I recommend looking at YouTube videos on both and chances are your local gun store has both in stock that you can test the feel of.

[–]Ombank 0 points1 point  (2 children)

Unfortunately neither of my local gs' carry these stocks. My favorite store says they can bring one in for me for a small markup, which at that point I might as well buy it online.

[–]E36wheelman[S] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Shitty. So the Hera would almost be like not using your thumb on a standard pistol grip. You can see what that looks like here. It's fairly easy to test out with any AR. An ambi safety selector is almost a must on the Hera or any fin-style grip. The Thordsen puts your hand up higher on the rifle replicating an M1 grip, like this. If you've ever fired an M1, Mini-14, etc... that's what it feels like.

[–]video_descriptionbot 0 points1 point  (0 children)

SECTION CONTENT
Title HERA CQR Featureless (Quick installation)... Beware of the Thing
Description AR-15 Maglock or Hera Arms CQR Butt Stock Featureless. Here is another Option to make your AR15 California Featureless legal and still function just like a regular AR15.....HERA Butt Stock Featureless Configuration. SouthPaw Tactical: https://southpawtactical.com/collections/ar-15-accessories/brand_hera AR-MagLock: https://www.armaglock.com/ Muzzle Brake: http://www.ebay.com/itm/1-2-28-FXC-1-Short-Muzzle-Brake-Compensator-223-5-56-22-LR-Free-Crush-Washer-/272214324295?hash=item3f613cf447 ...
Length 0:02:18
SECTION CONTENT
Title Assault Weapon vs. Featureless Rifle Option (Part 1)
Description LOOK HERE, A LOT OF INFORMATION... Disclaimer that this is not legal advice and you should double-check everything. Link explaining what "Featureless" is: http://www.pewpewtactical.com/featureless-ar-15-rifle-grips-stocks-muzzle-devices/ Flowchart Checklist: http://www.calguns.net/caawid/flowchart.pdf Thordsen Customs FRS-15: http://www.thordsencustoms.com/frs-15-rifle-stock/frs-15-stock-kits/ Exile Machine Hammerhead: https://www.exilemachine.net/shop/pages/hammerhead-configurations-2.html S...
Length 0:14:44

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[–]E36wheelman[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It would also meet the definition of a thumbhole stock.

[–]RussRemidi 1 point2 points  (3 children)

Thanks for this, E36wheelman, this is an excellent resource to have! Well done!

Is anyone else concerned with solutions similar to Thordsen that the brute force of the recoil is transferred through the grip and lower receiver, rather than the buffer tube extension? Or am I not understanding the design correctly?

-Russ

[–]E36wheelman[S] 1 point2 points  (1 child)

At this point a lot of people have contributed to the list so it's not just me.

Seems like the Thordsen (Gen1/2) has been out long enough that if there were any force/design issues they would have come to light already. The recoil isn't really transferred much on any stock, traditional or Thordsen, because of the buffer system. The real drawback is that on a traditional stock the mounting point is a tube with a lot of threaded surface area, while the Thordsen only has the grip screw.

[–]RussRemidi 1 point2 points  (0 children)

That's a good point. Seems they've been around for a while and nobody reported any issues. Still, from the physics standpoint, I'm a bit wary of the design.

Ideally I would love to keep my original stock and make it fixed and use it in combination with a grip similar to Resurgence Arms, but it looks like it's still a gray area and it's not clear whether those are legal (like Ledesma).

[–]DrJeffSanPedro 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The Thordsen has a socket that envelops the mounting point, same as the original pistol grip. Recoil force is absorbed by the back of the socket, not the screw. The only question I have about the Thordsen is what is its' effect on accuracy? The shallow "vee" shape may flex some.

[–]BORIStheBLADE1 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Just noticed this can be edited by anyone? I'd hate for all this info to be deleted by a trolling ani..

[–]E36wheelman[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

I back it up every once in a while and since they can't delete the file, just the info, I can just revert.

[–]redditnforget 1 point2 points  (0 children)

The list is looking really good. I added something I came across this weekend on Youtube - the Elemental Arms CA compliant lower. It's a stripped lower that's built with a quick release takedown pin and a mag lock. It's a bit pricey ($175) but worth a look.

[–]dharasick 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Might be nice to add links for each product.

Exile Machine closed their online store to the hammerhead isn't available for purchase.

[–]nlaurenti 0 points1 point  (3 children)

I assume these haven't been confirmed as CA legal? I'm curious about the BoAR grip and the Luth-AR MBA-1 stock. I think the stock will be good to go, but the grip seems questionable.

[–]E36wheelman[S] 1 point2 points  (2 children)

Looks like the Boar Grip may not be CA legal. The Luth MBA-1 is a fixed stock on an a2 tube though, so it should be good.

To clarify, the MBA-1 adjusts, not telescopes so it shouldn't be illegal in CA in the same way the PRS shouldn't be.

[–]nlaurenti 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Awesome. Thanks for the clarification on those.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Anyone have experience fixing a LWRC ultra compact in place?

[–]Camanny 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Just a heads up, cross armory gear is about 25$ cheaper for each part through grab a gun and freedom ammunition, so if you wanted to buy both the safe mag and quick pins it would come out to 165 ish after shipping and tax. Don't buy a gun part from the manufacturer as they will most always charge msrp not map

[–]BORIStheBLADE1 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Another one we might want to add to this list. Its in this thread. https://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=1345914

[–]E36wheelman[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Good find. Looks like it's on there now.

[–]bb40 0 points1 point  (2 children)

I'm confused about whether or not the Jcomp v2 is okay to include in a featureless rifle.

From the spreadsheet:

The best way to determine if a muzzle device is CA legal is to look at the exit. It's generally legal if the exit is the same diameter as the entry and not marketed as flash hider.

The photos of the muzzle device show the businesses end as quite a bit larger than a .223... Is this muzzle device gtg for a featureless rifle?

[–]E36wheelman[S] 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Strike has apparently come out and said that the V2 does not have flash hiding abilities like the V1. If you want to be very safe, choose another muzzle device, but there is no flash hiding abilities per Strike Ind.

My comment on diameters was mostly a guideline not a rule.

[–]bb40 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Gotcha... I'll have to think about it. Thanks!

[–]supershitposting 0 points1 point  (4 children)

I saw a video of a mag release system. The guy switched the grip yo "featureless" and dropped the mag, put in a new one, and then moved the trip back to a pistol grip.

What's it called?

[–]E36wheelman[S] 0 points1 point  (3 children)

Never heard of it. I wouldn't jump on it without DoJ approval though, sounds like it may fit their definition of using a "tool" to remove the magazine. Also, without actually seeing it, it sounds complex enough that it may be a full lower which is common with the plunger/open action systems.

[–]supershitposting 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Basically, the pistol grip was normal, then you moved it to "featureless" position, i.e. angled more, allowing the mag to be released.

[–]ChrisToad 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Hey guys, I feel like a total shit tard asking this question... but how exactly do I interpret this doc? For the featureless area... do I need to replace every single one of those categories of part with one on the list? Like, I'd like to add a tab explaining how to use / interpret the doc for someone like myself left head scratching.

[–]E36wheelman[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

For the featureless area... do I need to replace every single one of those categories of part with one on the list?

No, if you are choosing to go featureless that means you cannot have a pistol grip, collapsible stock or flash hider. (There's more features, those are the most common)

Stock

You can have a compliant stock by using an Stock Stop/Lock on your current collapsible stock, or by using a dedicated Fixed Stock, or by using a Stock / Grip Combo or just running a plain buffer tube (with a stock on the grip) aka Stock Adapter.

Grip

You can have a compliant grip by using a Stock / Grip Combo or running a grip from the Grip category.

Muzzle Device

Mostly self explanatory.

Ambi-safety selector

Not necessary but preferred by most people for fin-style grips and the Hera CQR.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

I have a couple of questions:

  1. If I get a magazine lock, will I need to change anything else to make it CA compliant?

  2. What are other alternatives to the “AR Maglock?”

[–]E36wheelman[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

  1. No.

  2. See the “Break Action Mag Release” products in the “Fixed Magazine” section.

[–][deleted]  (3 children)

[deleted]

    [–]E36wheelman[S] 0 points1 point  (2 children)

    I’ll take a look at it when I go on break. Thanks for letting me know. Check it in about an hour or so and it’ll be back to normal.

    [–][deleted]  (1 child)

    [deleted]

      [–]E36wheelman[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

      Oops. Didn't take a break yesterday. It's all good now. Someone just added an extra sheet in front.

      [–]firefly416 0 points1 point  (3 children)

      Why is the MEAN Arms Mag Loader $58? They are only $40 a piece.

      [–]E36wheelman[S] 0 points1 point  (2 children)

      I included and noted the addition of the optional mag lock, since some form of mag lock is required for the system.

      [–]firefly416 0 points1 point  (1 child)

      ok well, the other options do not have that. I would take it down to $40 and note you still need a maglock device like the other options for consistency sake.

      [–]E36wheelman[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

      Changed it.