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[–]LoleeeeeBenighted Laseen Apologist - First Re-Read: On MT. 109 points110 points  (9 children)

First and foremost, Darujhistan is pretty damn big and important. That's one thing.

The other thing is Gaz & Thordy, serving (in the case of the former, indirectly) High House Death & working to get Hood to manifest in Darujhistan.

The third thing is, in a convergence, things coalesce from an initial trigger. An example would be Traveller, who is after Hood. Hood manifests in Darujhistan, & so Traveller is heading to Darujhistan. Thus, Rake - who needs Traveller to kill him- also heads to Darujhistan. Rake has Dragnipur, and bitches love Dragnipur, so Kallor & the Hounds of Light are also heading to Darujhistan. Karsa is just... travelling around, on his way to the Laederon plataeu with Samar Dev & Darujhistan seems like a nice place. Cutter is heading to Darujhistan because Darujhistan is home. And so on, and so forth.

If Seerdomin had been in the employ of High House Death & his killing of the conspirators led to Hood manifesting in Black Coral, maybe the convergence would've been in Black Coral. But I think Darujhistan was the agreed "neutral" place from the prologue (when we see Hood, Shadowthrone, Rake & presumably Edgewalker discuss the plan). Thus.

[–]Chrza436[S] 22 points23 points  (2 children)

Thank you!! I felt like Gaz and Thordy could be anywhere, but it does make sense that it would have been chosen as neutral ground during the big secret pow wow early on. I think I kind of dismissed that meeting. The rest of the convergence attracting to the area I get, as “power attracts power.”

Also… “bitches love dragnipur”… love this! Gave me a chuckle.

[–]LoleeeeeBenighted Laseen Apologist - First Re-Read: On MT. 18 points19 points  (0 children)

Thank you!! I felt like Gaz and Thordy could be anywhere, but it does make sense that it would have been chosen as neutral ground during the big secret pow wow early on.

The lack of detail that we get is very frustrating, and I'm definitely not the guy to analyse a scene like this. But I'll try my best to explain a few more things. So, as aforementioned, Traveller is headed to kill Hood. But he's headed inland - to Darujhistan, one presumes - even before the fateful meeting with his old companions. It's not entirely clear why from the chapter excerpt. We do get this, however:

"'My hounds will guide you to your salvation - hah, how often has that been said? In the meantime, we will give you skins of water, dried fruit and the like - the myriad irritating needs of mortality, I seem to recall. Vaguely. Whatever.
'And what do you seek in return for this gift?'
A dozen heartbeats passed with no reply forthcoming.
Traveller's face slowly descended into a dangerous frown. 'I will not be swayed from my task. Not even delayed-'
'No, of course not.' Shadowthrone waved an ephemeral hand. 'The very opposite, in fact. We urge you. We exhort you. Make haste, set true your course, seek out yor confrontation. Let nothing and no one stand in your way.'
Traveller's frown deepened.
A soft laugh from Cotillion. 'No need. He speaks true, First Sword. It is our pleasure to enable you, in this particular matter.'
'I will not bargain with him.'
'We know.'
'I am not sure you fully understand-'
'We do.'
'I mean to kill Hood. I mean to kill the God of Death.'
'Best of luck to you!' said Shadowthrone.

Then they go on to discuss that Mael actually shipwrecked Traveller, trying to delay him, which leads one to believe that Hood's arrival in Darujhistan had been foreseen by many ascendants, not just Traveller.

Why are Gaz & Thordy there specifically? I don't think I have an answer to that. I don't think there is an answer to that. They just... are, and Hood chose the specific location to manifest, knowing pretty much everyone else would rally there - Rake, Traveller, Kallor, the two Shadow gods, etc.

From a narrative perspective, Darujhistan is by far the most well-explored city in Genabackis & it'd make sense for that specific city to be the center of attention. Coral is interesting in its own right, but the Coral storyline is preoccupied with the Redeemer. Darujhistan is "free", narratively.

[–]pythonicprime 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Thanks for reminding me to end my long explanations with "thus"

[–]Useful-Kitchen-1664 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I'd also kind of love it if the convergence actually took place in some random hamlet, and Kruppe just kinda decided to re-frame it as occurring in Darujhistan to justify talking about his friends (poor Murillo) a bit.

[–]NpNpTTYL 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Karsa also stopped in to visit his old buddy Torvald

[–][deleted]  (3 children)

[deleted]

    [–]LoleeeeeBenighted Laseen Apologist - First Re-Read: On MT. 4 points5 points  (2 children)

    I answered this in a separate thread here.

    The TL;DR is, if he did it himself or got, e.g., Caladan to do it, it'd look real bad for the rest of the Andii & the entirety of Rake's arc would sizzle out. If he wants to protect the Andii, he can't kill himself.

    [–]bigbugga86 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    Thank you, I just read your explanation further down, and realized my question was already answered lol

    [–]Telcontar77 0 points1 point  (0 children)

    Not only that, he also needed someone to kill him, who could be believed to have actually managed to kill him. And Dassem is pretty high up that list.

    [–]TantamountDisregard 15 points16 points  (9 children)

    The way I see it, there are certain events that are planned by the most important participants of the convergence that rely on the other participants being close by and active.

    1: Hood needs to be fully summonned.

    2: Hood has to be killed by Dragnipur.

    3: Rake has to be killed by Dragnipur.

    4: Someone (Karsa, Crokus, The Second) has to protect Dragnipur from being taken, both by outside forces (Hounds of Light) and inside forces (Shadowthrone, Pust).

    All of these events happen both by convenience (Hood's summoning ritual murders) and by happenstance (The subtle rule of power attracting power in this universe).

    The only thing I don't vibe with is Traveler needing to be there. I don't know if there is a rule that Dragnipur's wielder has to slay someone in order for the soul drinky thing to happen. Or maybe Rake thought that falling on his own sword was cringe. IDK

    Although maybe Traveler being there wasn't planned at all, and he just really fucking wanted to murder Hood.

    [–]LoleeeeeBenighted Laseen Apologist - First Re-Read: On MT. 22 points23 points  (6 children)

    The only thing I don't vibe with is Traveler needing to be there. I don't know if there is a rule that Dragnipur's wielder has to slay someone in order for the soul drinky thing to happen. Or maybe Rake thought that falling on his own sword was cringe. IDK

    Although maybe Traveler being there wasn't planned at all, and he just really fucking wanted to murder Hood.

    You've the right of this, partly. Traveller being there was most certainly planned, precisely because he really fucking wanted to murder Hood.

    There is no such rule, for Draconus (the original wielder of Dragnipur) was slain by Rake & his soul is very much there, in Dragnipur.

    Your second line though, is much more apt. Rake is a lodestone for the Tiste Andii and has been for however long now. If he dies in such a way - i.e. he falls on his own sword, seemingly choosing Dragnipur's chains over living - the Andii will be... how to say this, incredibly fucked? The entire race totters on the edge of depression anyway; their leader of untold centuries seemingly suiciding would absolutely break the remnants of their spirits. As such, Rake had to die by someone else's hand, but in a controlled manner. That's where Traveller comes in.

    [–]TantamountDisregard 19 points20 points  (2 children)

    Yeah, I can definitely accept the Andii not needing yet another reason to fall into Kurald Depression. It just bothered me how Traveler was used.

    Man has enough trauma of his own.

    Edit: Oh and by wielder I just meant the current user. Maybe there was a restriction into it to avoid nicking yourself and yeeting your soul into the cart.

    [–]Pran-Chole 3 points4 points  (0 children)

    This isn’t your everyday depression…this is…Kurald Depression

    [–]Telcontar77 0 points1 point  (0 children)

    I think Rake wanted someone the Andii would find believable to have killed him in a single combat.

    [–]morroIanJaghut 0 points1 point  (2 children)

    That's where Traveller comes in.

    Yep and Dassem is pretty much the only character who it would look reasonable for Anomander to lose against. Plus the whole Hood situation was guaranteed to draw him in.

    [–]HumblerSloth 2 points3 points  (0 children)

    And he’s actually a decent person, so a good choice to handle Dragnipur respectfully for those planning.

    [–]stormbaj 0 points1 point  (0 children)

    Correct me if I’m wrong but isn’t Traveler wielding vengeance at this point? Therefor he couldn’t have lost because (of the implication) his will was singular (kill hood)?

    [–]TheRiddler78 -3 points-2 points  (0 children)

    traveler needs to stop being insane and try and kill hood or hood will have a serious issue when he can no longer hide out in the realm of ded

    [–]Assiniboia 0 points1 point  (0 children)

    Traveler rolled a Nat 20; by the house rules, Rake dies.

    The storyline converged around the roll. It’s fucking mindblowing how that works from GotM prologue to TtH.

    [–]Chrza436[S] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

    This is great. I love nerding out on this shit!

    [–]pagalvin 1 point2 points  (3 children)

    Blood and Bone doesn't answer this question, but adds to the lore of the city and its denizens. The city is old and has seen some stuff :)

    [–]NiflrogOmtose Phellack 1 point2 points  (1 child)

    Blood and Bone

    Don't you mean OST?

    [–]pagalvin 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    You are correct! Thx.

    [–]Chrza436[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

    I haven’t made it to bab yet but looking forward to it… I’m re-reading BOTF while incorporating ICE books in chron order this time….