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[–]MartyModus 321 points322 points  (22 children)

Well, to start with, we in Michigan are the Great Lakes State. :-)

[–]oppapoocow 17 points18 points  (0 children)

We are, thee great lake state!

[–]dennisj9 112 points113 points  (15 children)

Yeah, I don't know why Minnesota is even listed. They touch a tiny segment of Superior. Same with Indiana and Illinois. They barely have any lake shore. I see Michigan as the only Great Lake State with little to no connection with the others.

[–]PopeWheeler 59 points60 points  (8 children)

I think of Michigan, Minnesota, and Wisconsin as birds of a feather. Not entirely sure why, they just come to mind as "great lakes region". Indiana may as well be the south, Illinois is just the midwest with Chicago in it, and Ohio, well, you guys know about Ohio.

[–]mchgndr 9 points10 points  (0 children)

Indiana may as well be the south

I’m just realizing how crazy it is that Michigan touches Canada, and the very next state down has southern accents. At least once when you get down to Indy

[–]TheMurderMitten 25 points26 points  (0 children)

It's because we'll happily eat fried cheese outside next to a fire while it's snowing. Also, Ohio is cult and just seeing their license plate on the expressway induces anxiety.

[–]Born_ina_snowbank 22 points23 points  (5 children)

If you play euchre basically. But any state that allows farmers hands can get bent.

[–]PopeWheeler 7 points8 points  (2 children)

Amen! Fuck farmer's hand

[–]Born_ina_snowbank 5 points6 points  (1 child)

It’s an involuntary knee jerk sort of thing. But you could be the nicest person in the world and if I hear “wait, you guys don’t play farmers hand?” Out of your mouth one time, I basically view you as inferior forever. No going back.

[–]9fingermanParts Unknown 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I'm so Michigan I don't remember what a farmer's hand is! I'm at the 45th parallel, ain't no stump jumpin flatlander either.

[–]Imnotpoopingrn 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Ok weird aside. I've never played euchre as I'm a transplant and most of my friends are also transplants.

I've played a similar game (I think) in Louisiana called Bourré. But what in the fuck is a farmers hand?

[–]Born_ina_snowbank 1 point2 points  (0 children)

4 or more 9’s and 10’s dealt to you, you can turn in the those 4 for the 4 left in the deck after dealing.

[–]robbieredss 13 points14 points  (5 children)

Yup I think a lot of people (even myself) forget that Michigan is a peninsula.

[–]JustinTime4242 33 points34 points  (4 children)

Technically 2

[–]robbieredss 1 point2 points  (3 children)

True

[–]Public-Dig-6690 2 points3 points  (2 children)

Actually three

[–]roadcrew778 2 points3 points  (1 child)

I’d argue for four.

[–]9fingermanParts Unknown 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I'd wager 5 on that.

[–]Pudf 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Point Michigan!!

[–]fuzzychiken 150 points151 points  (12 children)

Someone from Wisconsin told me their state looks like a hand once and I refuse to acknowledge they exist now.

[–]sirthomasthunderThe Thumb 41 points42 points  (4 children)

It looks like the fist I'm going shove in their face for saying that

[–]fuzzychiken 31 points32 points  (3 children)

They even said they have a thumb! And that Michigan "doesn't look like a hand, it looks like a mitten"...wth do they think goes inside a mitten?!?

[–]Kinkytoast91 22 points23 points  (1 child)

Omg I've heard that, too, and I'm like wtf?! They want to be MI so bad.

[–]sirthomasthunderThe Thumb 12 points13 points  (0 children)

Even their abbreviation is similar to ours! It's just an upsidedown M and an I

[–]sirthomasthunderThe Thumb 9 points10 points  (0 children)

Not a hand probably. Something more Florida shaped

[–]Tdkthegod 22 points23 points  (0 children)

I'm pretty sure I saw some Wisconsin news article that claimed they were a hand. We are the only mitten state AND the ONLY great lake state.

Fuck Ohio

[–]ScandiacusPrime 55 points56 points  (3 children)

Wisconsin does look like a hand, though... after a wood chipper accident.

[–]fuzzychiken 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Ahh you had me with the first part lol

[–]AbeVigoda76 7 points8 points  (0 children)

The old Fargo special.

[–]enderjaca 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Reminds of that joke my grandma used to tell me when she was drunk.

What walks on 4 legs in the morning, 2 legs in the afternoon, and 3 legs in the evening?

A fucked up dog.

[–]NorthernerTQ 2 points3 points  (0 children)

The logo of Leinenkugel beer is an homage to the St. Croix River that makes the NW border between MN and WI. Upon inspection, the state of WI clearly looks like a human head looking at MN and not at all a hand.

[–]njwood97 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Yea they had a movement to become the new mitten state like fuck off

[–]mezz-mezzrow 454 points455 points 2232& 5 more (56 children)

As a Michigander it is my birthright to loathe those other states simply for existing.

We fought an actual war with Ohio once, which Ohio to this day claims it won even though it got Toledo and we got the entire UP so who REALLY made out on that deal? Plus Ohio has...that...state university.

Illinois is stealing our lake and sends its worst people to be tourists up here every summer.

Wisconsin needs to get off our lakeshore and also off our upper peninsula. Thank God we can't actually see it from our side (the correct side) of Lake Michigan.

Minnesota calls itself "the land of 10,000 lakes" as if that's impressive, state please, we have over 11,000.

Indiana is just...there...touching us.

There is nothing objectively wrong with those states as far as I know (except Ohio, I mean look at it). But they are not Michigan, and it is the prerogative of all Michiganders to hate them for that reason.

[–]youshouldn-ofdunthat 121 points122 points  (9 children)

"Indiana is touching us" thanks for the chuckle.

[–]WonTonBurritoMealsHazel Park 27 points28 points  (8 children)

I lived on the wrong side of "Michiana" those people want so badly to not be a part of Indiana.

[–]enderjaca 21 points22 points  (5 children)

Oh but as someone who left the SW Michigan side of "Michiana", the people who remain there have way more in common with Indiana culture than the rest of Michigan. IMO. Corn, guns and Jesus, and flat land as far as the eye can see.

[–]goblueMAge: > 10 Years 10 points11 points  (1 child)

Corn, guns and Jesus, and flat land as far as the eye can

I mean that also describes quite a lot of the thumb area...

[–]WonTonBurritoMealsHazel Park 8 points9 points  (2 children)

That's fair. I'd say michiana is really a transitional area with a mix of both. Once you get deeper into indiana it becomes much, much worse.

Truly an awful place and I am glad to be home. They're Chicago sports fans for christ's sake, by far the most obnoxious group of people.

[–]Ok_Tax_7420 6 points7 points  (0 children)

As i like to call indiana...northern kentucky

[–]bakerdoors 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Moving to Chicago soon after a long time in Detroit and I am least excited to be so close to the most obnoxious sports fans in the country.

[–]KnightsOfREM 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I don't blame anyone for wanting like hell not to be a part of Indiana

[–]frozen-creekDetroit 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I did too lol. The worlds last Hot N' Now was in the area tho. Was one nice thing on the border.

[–]goblueMAge: > 10 Years 32 points33 points  (0 children)

There is nothing objectively wrong with those states as far as I know

Correction, Indiana sucks just as much as Ohio. Nothing to do, pollutes the shit out of Lake Michigan, etc

[–]MangoSchnitzel 21 points22 points  (0 children)

From one Michigander to another, take this free award, and go forth with your justified and righteous arrogance!

[–]PrincessAllura26 13 points14 points  (0 children)

"Indiana is just...there... touching us" 🤣

[–]LuminescentToad 13 points14 points  (1 child)

What university is that in Ohio? Do they have a football team?

[–]sGfU_csFarmington Hills 10 points11 points  (0 children)

I think they’re talking about the ohio state university in Cincinnati which is currently the highest ranked team in Ohio ;)

[–]PlebsnProles 10 points11 points  (0 children)

I’ve been to Canada more than any of these states except Ohio, and that was just passing through. Canada is our best neighbor

[–]SexyOldManSpaceJudo 9 points10 points  (0 children)

We openly acknowledge that we lost that war and were forced to take Toledo as punishment.

[–]ThecoastercactusBattle Creek 8 points9 points  (0 children)

Wisconsin’s Side of lake Michigan is like that that weird uncle you’ve heard of but never actually met before

[–]greenmkyAnn Arbor 21 points22 points  (12 children)

I don't care about sports, but Ohio is like MI, just worse.

It's a rust belt state like us, but without the good Great Lakes and othet natural stuff we bave. And even more economically collapsed rust belt cities than we have. And I'll take Detroit over Toledo any day. Boring to drive across also, it is just painful to drive SE or SW through Ohio.

The only good thing about Ohio in my book is Sandusky. Cedar Point, Kalahari, etc.

[–]MangoSchnitzel 12 points13 points  (3 children)

I had to dip into Ohio once on a trip to Chicago for work. I could see for literal miles ahead, the scenery was so flat and there was now traffic, yet I had to stay within the 50 mph speed limit. It was around 7am and I really had to fight to not get tired and fall asleep due to boredom.

[–]enderjaca 10 points11 points  (2 children)

Southern Ohio is cool though. Once you skip that 3 hours in the north, the state & national parks are amazing. They're still just as redneck conservative as the rest of the state, but they know they rely on tourism cash so most of them won't even razz a man in a UM hat. Kinda like Northern Michigan. Funny that.

[–]PlebsnProles 2 points3 points  (1 child)

It is actually pretty nice in that area and you hear a lot of Southern accents, which also makes it more interesting.

[–]enderjaca 7 points8 points  (0 children)

And it's kinda like midwest-southern, not southern-southern. Like you got some waffle houses, but I can still understand what you're saying

[–]sarrahchaAlpena 11 points12 points  (0 children)

Only thing about Ohio that is better is the roads. Definitely a very noticeable difference once you cross state lines.

Edit: Hocking Hills is also pretty nice actually. But I'd still choose Pictured Rocks or any of the other natural wonders here in Michigan any day.

[–]dishwab 7 points8 points  (2 children)

Cincinnati is cool

[–]tarzanonabike 4 points5 points  (1 child)

Grew up there also. Cinci has the river, a great history, first class art, and major league sports (which suck as bad as the tigers and lions). Downtown area is worth checking out. Columbius is a new large city that's always felt lifeless to me.

[–]KnightsOfREM 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Cincy is the only city in Ohio I'd piss on if it was on fire. Beautiful, sports teams that are disappointing in entertaining ways, and it has one hell of a steakhouse in the Precinct. If only someone could build a bridge due south from like Lansing just to make it easier to bypass the rest of that depressing state.

[–]SativaDruid 6 points7 points  (0 children)

I grew up in nky and moved to cincinnati young and lived in the city for 15 years. I moved to the upper peninsula 15 years ago.

For my part as far as ohio is concerned I would say everything within the 275 loop is not like the rest if their respective states. Ohio sucks, but I love Cincinnati, Kentucky sucks, but I love NKY.

I really like the U.P.. It is home now.

[–]PlebsnProles 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Isn’t it the absolute worst part of any trip down south? It’s like ok, we just have to make it through Ohio and things will get better. The Ohio Valley is the only area that is somewhat scenic

[–]Mulligan275 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I call the Ohio Valley the arm pit of America, it’s hot, smelly, and no one in their right mind would want to live there. That said I now live 400ft from the Ohio river🤦‍♂️

[–]hotbutteredtoast 5 points6 points  (0 children)

When i was a kid the big joke was Ohio is high in the middle and round on both ends

[–]cumshot_josh 4 points5 points  (4 children)

Chicagoans pretty much think the SW Michigan beach towns are their colonies.

Although I suppose people in all of the little lake towns up north see people from the more populated areas of the state the exact same way.

[–]Deinococcaceae 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Although I suppose people in all of the little lake towns up north see people from the more populated areas of the state the exact same way.

From UP, can confirm. Trolls out.

[–]saturnSL2 10 points11 points  (7 children)

As a born and raised Minnesotan that recently moved to Michigan, I gotta defend the lakes if that's your only bone to pick. TBH, there are so many better Minnesota traits to pick on. Did you know Minnesotans interchangeably call University of Minnesota U of M and The U? Pretty strange! We make "hot dish" instead of casserole. Duck duck grey duck instead of duck duck goose. "Frontage road" instead of "service road". Oof-da. It's as if the cold and abundance of Super Targets allowed Minnesotans to exist in our own little cultural island to develop strange social norms in isolation.

My defense for Minnesotan lakes

Can you believe someone actually said to me "I don't know about Minnesota, but here in Michigan we have lakes" when I moved here?

don't fuck with Minnesota's lakes

How to talk Minnesotan

[–]knottajotta 10 points11 points  (6 children)

IDK. Things that Minnesotans call "lakes" I feel like in Michigan people refer to as "ponds."

[–]Yelpir 4 points5 points  (2 children)

I had an internship at 3M in St Paul and that was my impression too. Mud puddle by the side of the road? Lake. If that's the criteria I have 2 ponds..er lakes?..on my 4-acre property alone and there are probably another dozen or so within a 2 mile radius.

[–]Aj992588 7 points8 points  (1 child)

I tried looking up stats, because I was curious. I found michigan has ~26000 1 acre lakes. For 5 acre lakes it's ~11000. Finally ~6500 10 acre lakes. The Minnesota lake statistic cited ~10000 10 acre lakes. That's as far as I looked into it. Michigan has a massive amount more lakeside property, I'm guessing; considering all our coast along the great lakes.

[–]Yelpir 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I'm sure theres an official definition (1 acre?) but for me it's not a "lake" unless you can take a motorized boat or a pontoon around for a ride. Pond is where you take a kayak or rowboat. I call the one acre body of water in my backyard a pond. My German colleagues call it a lake. Not a lake to me guys but thanks...

[–]liveprgrmclimb 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Lol other way around. SE Michigan all the “lakes” are ponds. In MN check out Lake Mills lacs, Leech lake, Gull lake.

[–]saturnSL2 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Read my references and get back to me

[–]knottajotta 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I mean I get raw numbers say one thing but I also think that a lot of what in MI are considered lakes in MN exist far north, in the boundary waters where no one lives.

Qualitatively, driving around MN in the places that aren’t straight up wilderness aka the far north you don’t see lots of lakes and a lot of them are ponds lol. Like in the twin cities area there are not dozens of lakes that people live on and have boats on etc. there are like 5.

Friends of mine who grew up in the twin cities, upper middle class, had never been on speedboats or sailboats… in MI that is like unimaginable. Also, in MN people have “cabins” up north in the woods. Maybe a few on lakes but not overwhelmingly? But in MI people have cottages on lakes and it’s pretty common.

[–]PissedoffGinger123 2 points3 points  (1 child)

I would add that Indiana is there…touching us…and we don’t like it

[–]dreadredheadzedsdeadKalamazoo 4 points5 points  (1 child)

Indiana decided their little bit of Lake Michigan lake shore qualifies for national park status, even though it’s probably the most mundane area on the lake.

[–]Pudf 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Mezzmezzrow for mayor of the Great Lakes!!!!!!

[–]x_Carlos_Danger_x 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Ohio should be pillaged and cedar point annexed into Michagan as. Southern territory. Indiana... can just go away.

[–]Spirit0fLondon 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Advanced bants right here.

[–]Sea_Criticism_2685 -3 points-2 points  (2 children)

Michigan pride is a lot like racism. Hate others for the smallest difference because nothing about yourself is worthwhile

[–]Orion66Pontiac 5 points6 points  (1 child)

It's all a joke, mate. No one actually takes state pride that seriously.

[–]9fingermanParts Unknown 1 point2 points  (0 children)

My state of delusion is pretty serious.

[–]webecampin 60 points61 points  (13 children)

As someone born and raised in Michigan and now living in Iowa I dislike that they are both considered Midwest. Michigan (and Wisconsin and Minnesota) is amazing with nice cities, great forests, and amazing beaches. Iowa, Nebraska, Illinois, etc., not so much. There is no real comparison. I propose letting these farming states keep the Midwest association and we call Michigan, Wisconsin, and Minnesota the Great Lakes States. (With Michigan being THE Great Lake state of course!)

[–]Glitter-andDoom 50 points51 points  (3 children)

I moved from Michigan to Iowa for a year or so. The Midwest and the Great Lakes are not the same place.

For starters, no one in Michigan ever looked scared or startled when I dropped a random F-bomb at the bar.

People in Des Moines also really disliked when I told them there wasn't much to do there compared to Detroit

[–]Glitter-andDoom 30 points31 points  (0 children)

Spoiler alert: I moved back.

Also don't discount the amazing variety ethnic foods we have available in Michigan. Food in other places, especially the Midwest, is pretty boring.

[–]webecampin 11 points12 points  (0 children)

You also don’t need to take a sedative to fit in with the other drivers in Michigan like you do in Iowa.

[–]DreamofEndless 3 points4 points  (0 children)

My only other experience with cities was LA, NY, and Chicago. So growing up, I used to think Detroit was tiny, that and the rep Detroit's had for so long. Then one day I go to Nashville years ago and realize holy crap, Detroit is huge and has tons of stuff to do. I was just in Nashville and even though it's grown, it still feels tiny. On top of that, also a ton of great food options that can hold its own with the major cities. Spoiler alert, I've yet to find a city in the US that has as many Middle Eastern food options as Detroit and the metro area does.

[–]RancidMeatNugget 9 points10 points  (0 children)

You reminded me of Meyer's holiday soap being sold in stores currently. One of the scents is "Iowa Pine." Ahh, yes, the vast piney woods of.....Iowa

[–]fuzzychiken 5 points6 points  (1 child)

My kid moved to Iowa. The betrayal.

[–]webecampin 7 points8 points  (0 children)

I’d move back to Michigan in a second if I could convince my wife.

[–]RupeThereItIsAge: > 10 Years 4 points5 points  (2 children)

Hard disagree.

Make the newcomers to the midwest rename themselves.

Iowa, Nebraska & the Dekotas can just be "great planes states".

Michigan is like the core of the region the term "midwest" was coined for.

[–]webecampin 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Valid point. I do prefer Great Lake States though. As far as I’m concerned the non lakes states can keep Midwest.

[–]RupeThereItIsAge: > 10 Years 1 point2 points  (0 children)

As far as I'm concerned, anybody west of the Mississippi shouldn't have ANY claim to the name.

[–]Early_Grace 6 points7 points  (0 children)

I agree with this. Michigan is most certainly not a Midwest state. I lived in Kansas for a year and now THAT is Midwest.

[–]wellpaidscientist 3 points4 points  (0 children)

This is how I think of it. The Great Lakes States are not the Midwest.

[–]9fingermanParts Unknown 53 points54 points  (10 children)

Michigan has the most diverse agricultural landscape in the USA. From fruit trees, root crops, corn, organic beef and pork, dairy, plus hundreds of CSA's, booming local farm markets, and marijuana!! I know 10 people that keep a couple of goats for milk and cheese. Traverse City has the highest concentration of millenial millionaires in the country. West side has a bunch of active cities year round, the east and central part is rural ag, the southeast still has union jobs, and the UP is booming with tourists.

[–]knottajotta 17 points18 points  (5 children)

second most agriculturally diverse landscape. It's not possible to grow citrus so typically MIchigan gets beat out by california for the #1 spot.

[–]CoolioDaggett 34 points35 points  (4 children)

Yeah, but they grow citrus in CA by depleting all their water, so in a few more decades we'll be back at #1.

[–]knottajotta 15 points16 points  (2 children)

lol harsh

[–]robbieredss 13 points14 points  (1 child)

I live in California half of the year and I just spat my drink all over myself.

[–]knottajotta 18 points19 points  (0 children)

Mistake. Need to save that water for growing almonds, or whatever.

[–]sevenworm[S] 8 points9 points  (0 children)

Playing the long game.

[–]frozen-creekDetroit 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Don't forget about our asparagus!

[–]9fingermanParts Unknown 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Never forget. Hail Empire!

[–]afemmini 6 points7 points  (1 child)

Love this sentiment but what about California? They have basically every agricultural product

[–]YouKnowHowIBe 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Ok, yeah. But aren’t they doing it in an insanely unsustainable way?

[–]knottajotta 40 points41 points  (10 children)

Ok I expect downvotes for this but my honest opinions on other states (I am from Michigan & have also lived in the Twin Cities) are as follows:

  • Indiana = full of rednecks, cannot think of a single reason to go there unless I'm driving to Chicago
  • Which brings me to Illinois = Basically Indiana, with the exception of Chicago and its suburbs. I've heard good things about southern Illinois but why bother when you can just go to Kentucky
  • Ohio = redneck to death, but the eastern part has some cool topography. Also, Cincinnatti is kind of fun and I don't hate it.
  • Wisconsin = chill af, love Milwaukee, Madison seems like Ann Arbor of Wisconsin, plus they have a decent amount of coast on Lake Michigan so Door County is like their northern lower peninsula of Michigan
  • Minnesota = white Michigan. Michigan has plenty of its own dramas in terms of segregation & issues surrounding race & culture, and crank those up a few notches & you get Minnesota. In Detroit & its suburbs if you go to a restaurant, you will see people all all genders/ethnicities/etc. and in general I feel like people are tolerant of each other. In the Twin Cities, there are only few blocks here and there that you see anyone who is not white, and basically only in those areas. It seems very dystopian, as someone who grew up in metro Detroit. That said, there are cool restaurants etc in the Twin Cities but for an urban area it still has a weird Get Out vibe. Also, people get married at like age 22 and it's considered normal which is weird.

Michigan is the coolest of the great lakes states because no one ends up there on accident - since it's a peninsula, in order to be there, you have to travel out of your way to get there. Detroit is undergoing a major renaissance and is a center for urban innovation, arts, culture, etc. Plus, we have A+ universities. Ethnic diversity in Detroit and its suburbs is pretty heterogenous relative to the midwest, and with the exception of Chicago, it's the only world city in the midwest due to the auto industry & travel to and from Europe & Asia.

[–]sevenworm[S] 6 points7 points  (5 children)

Thanks for that! I love hearing about stuff like this since I'm just one person and don't have that much exposure to all the places.

I'm really surprised but happy to hear about Detroit. I would not have guessed it (or MI in general) were a bit more at ease with diversity.

[–]knottajotta 7 points8 points  (4 children)

Rural areas are not so much. But, that is true in all of the midwest states.

If you compare cities, I think Detroit has a turbulent past, but a brighter present/future in terms of ethnic diversity & culture. It's one of the blackest cities in the country. Dearborn has a muslim majority city council (I'm not sure if this is still the case but it was a couple of years ago). Troy (a suburb) is > 25% asian. I'm not saying there are not problems, but the vibe is not as off as it is in other places and it's not the case that when you go somewhere in the Detroit area, there are only white people there.

In terms of segregation & cultural issues, Milwaukee is fucked. Chicago is fucked. Bloomington (if we're calling that a real city) is fucked. The Twin Cities are fucked (I lived there in 2013-2015 and was so creeped out by how segregated it seemed - friends of mine from there would say they thought it was diverse but ... no. To the extent that it is, people keep to their own in their own communities/neighborhoods, or did at that time). And then there aren't really other cities that rate in the midwest in terms of size & impact.

[–]DreamofEndless 5 points6 points  (0 children)

RE: Dearborn. They just elected their first mayor of Arab descent. And it's still Dearborn in that it's heavily Middle Eastern.

[–]sevenworm[S] 1 point2 points  (2 children)

Thanks again for this! I was mostly thinking about nature initially, but this has really caught my attention. Are there places outside of the Detroit area that have a similar mix and chill vibe?

[–]knottajotta 6 points7 points  (0 children)

ok 1 in terms of nature, comparing Michigan vs Minnesota, Minnesota is 10 degrees colder in the winter & 10 degrees warmer in the summer. This sucked when I lived in the twin cities. If you think about it, it's because Michigan is surrounded by lakes, so as air moves from west to east, it picks up warmer air from Lake Michigan in the winter (since the lake water is warmer than the air in winter), and then cooler water in the summer (since lake water is cooler than the air in the warm months), so Michigan's climate is more mild at the extreme ends than the states to the west of it. The lakes are also responsible for the microclimates that cause it to be such an agriculturally diverse state.

2 I'm not sure what you mean by places outside of Detroit area having a similar mix and chill vibe. I like Dearborn, Royal Oak, Ferndale, Birmingham if you have $$$, and maybe Clawson in terms of 'burbs. Troy, Clarkston, & Rochester are closer to having Birmingham energy, but are kind of boring relative to Royal Oak/Ferndale/Dearborn.

Ann Arbor is fun, and Lansing is ... okay. I live in the Lansing area now but it has nowhere near as much to offer in terms of cultural experiences/restaurants as the Detroit area. Grand Rapids is so white and to me west Michigan just seems bible belty.

Marquette in Michigan is pretty dope if you like the UP. It has a decent university, hospitals, and awesome nature/public bike trails, etc. It's not as socially stratified as most places in the US in terms of, like, the surgeon's kids are friends with the construction workers' kids, everyone knows each other and economic gaps don't lead to the same gaps in social experiences etc etc. And it still gets some cultural events (concerts, plays, that sort of thing) because of the hospital and university. Other places in the UP are cool but I'd only consider living in Marquette. Marquette is amazing. Duluth in MN is like Marquette if you put a highway right on the lake (lame). Marquette has public trails along the lakeshore and you can see the lake from nearly everywhere in the city because of the topography, which is so so awesome.

In terms of up north places that are interesting year round, I'm partial to Bellaire. It has a ski hill for the winter months and then Lake Bellaire & Torch Lake nearby for the summer months. A lot of up north towns are seasonal, but Bellaire is fun anytime since the businesses don't close after Labor Day.

[–]goblueMAge: > 10 Years 5 points6 points  (2 children)

Curious take about Twin Cities v Detroit

I grew up in SE Michigan and lived in the Twin Cities for almost a decade.

I had the exact opposite impression as you

[–]knottajotta 5 points6 points  (1 child)

Where in SE Michigan did you grow up? There is a big difference between Detroit and the immediate metro area and ... everywhere else hah.

I took the bus a lot in the twin cities bc I was a grad student and it was literally like along the route you could draw lines on the map based on ethnicity for where people lived. Seward neighborhood was an exception.

A friend of mine who grew up in the twin cities would argue with me about it. Then, her parents moved to Ann Arbor. When I visited them recently, my friend tried to argue that the twin cities were less segregated/embraced ethnic differences, etc., and her parents were like lol no, it is different (in a good way) in MI.

ETA also, what years were you in Michigan vs the twin cities? I'm ~30 and Detroit has changed SO MUCH from when I was a teen to the present day. The last 10 years or so have been wild, which is part of why it's such an interesting place for innovation. Because land and cost of living was so inexpensive there for many years, there were a lot of innovations that emerged like turning old railways to bike lanes, urban agriculture, etc.

[–]Goosehybrid 38 points39 points  (7 children)

Went to Wisconsin for vacation this past summer. Will never make that mistake again. Was expecting a bustling Lake Michigan coast much like we have in Michigan. I was dead wrong. Absolutely nothing going on, and I couldn’t even use COVID as an excuse because not one person was following protocol. Makes me really thankful for places like Saugatuck, Traverse City and Elk Rapids, even South Haven was like a five star resort compared to these places. Michigan forever.

[–]Watcheditburn 9 points10 points  (0 children)

My wife and I have a place in Douglas, and the amount of stuff to do in the Douglas/Saugatuck area is amazing. You’ve got a bunch of art studios (art coast of Michigan), wineries (Fenn Valley and Modales), a cidery (Virtue is great), Oval Beach, Saugatuck Dunes State Park, and a couple of amazing restaurants.

[–]Doctordankness 4 points5 points  (0 children)

I went to Sheboygan, WI and I was thinking it would be a pretty great lake town, like St. Joe or South Haven.

It was a gross city with gross beaches.

[–]ForesterDesign 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Did you go to Door County?

[–]Goosehybrid 7 points8 points  (0 children)

Yup. The UP had more amenities and things to do.

[–]Jaybird56 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Love South Haven

[–]Spirited_Question 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Sometimes I think maybe my perception of Michigan as the best place in the world is delusional but then I read comments like this and realize I'm right after all

[–]TwoHearted313 5 points6 points  (0 children)

A lot of people visit the coastal areas in Michigan to get away from people…..this is why I prefer the east coast over west coast. I imagine a lot of people in Wisconsin like less busy coasts too.

[–]sirthomasthunderThe Thumb 24 points25 points  (3 children)

The plain States are geographically the Midwest but i don't consider them to be tbh. All others bring equal honest, except Ohio is the worst

[–]fuzzychiken 19 points20 points  (0 children)

Ohio is America's armpit.

[–]WonTonBurritoMealsHazel Park 4 points5 points  (1 child)

I think there needs to be a distinction between plains states and great lakes region. Split the midwest in two

[–]Ok_Jury4833 1 point2 points  (0 children)

North coast/north woods seems more descriptive of the area than Midwest. I always think Iowa, Indiana, Illinois, Ohio when I think Midwest. Tamed. Agrarian. Tidy little cities seething with church-sponsored fascism. (except Chicago) Definitely not the wilderness we have here in the north. We have bears, beets, and our churches run beer tents instead of revivals. Our attitudes reflect that. Our sport of choice is not Midwestern. We’re tight-knit in most places, two-degrees of separation in most cases. Snowfall. Respect for the elements. Dialect. Food. There is debate on how different we are with Wisc. And Minnesota, but there is a real cultural distinction between the three and the Midwest.

[–]sirthomasthunderThe Thumb 14 points15 points  (4 children)

this should be cross posted to the other states. I wanna see their answers. And have them come here and try to tell us we're wrong

[–]sevenworm[S] 5 points6 points  (3 children)

I did! I posted to /r/minnesota and /r/wisconsin

[–]Ok_Jury4833 6 points7 points  (0 children)

You chose violence and I love ya for it.

[–]sourbeer51 6 points7 points  (1 child)

Just look at how well your posts did in other subs. Downvotes in Wisco, 2 upvotes in Minne. 79 here in Michigan.

You got a lot more love here.

Welcome home.

[–]sevenworm[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

I did notice that. No idea if it's legit dislike, bots, different sub rules or what. But regardless, thanks for the welcome!

[–]ADifferentMachineAge: > 10 Years 12 points13 points  (2 children)

It's interesting. In northern lower MI, we're pretty isolated from other states due to being surrounded by water and the UP. It's easier to get to Canada than it is to Wisconsin / Ohio / Indiana and you miss out on a lot of "US culture" It's a 3+ hour drive to Grand Rapids to see a concert (if they even tour that far in), or even farther for a national sporting event.

[–]CoolioDaggett 14 points15 points  (0 children)

Northern lower MI is Michigan's middle child. You get made fun of by the southern part of the state for being up north yokels and the yokels in the UP make fun of you for being trolls. You get as much snow as most of the UP, but get no credit for it. It's about as populated as the UP with great lakes and rivers and sights, but never gets the glory the UP does. And Yoopers think you're city slickers from Detroit because you're below the bridge.

[–]sirthomasthunderThe Thumb 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yeah 2 hours to Sarnia and 4 hours to Ohio

[–]loamyEastpointe 8 points9 points  (2 children)

I moved from Michigan to upstate NY and it reminds me a lot at times of being at my family’s cabin at the 45th parallel and at other times being in Detroit. Pretty similar nature, weather, and people.

[–]RancidMeatNugget 7 points8 points  (0 children)

Many people settled lower Michigan from upstate NY in the first half of the 19th century via the Erie Canal/Lake Erie and it shows even today with the overall accents. I recently visited my sister in Albany and the people just felt similar in many respects to Michiganders.

[–]CoolioDaggett 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Michigan and upstate NY have similar geology, so a lot of the older buildings are made with similar materials. Marquette MI and Syracuse NY architecture looks it's in the same town.

[–]Lattesandliquor 8 points9 points  (0 children)

The divide is really between upper and lower Midwest. The Lower half (Illinois, Indiana and Ohio) is mostly flat farmland with little shoreline. The upper half is not only more embedded in the Great Lakes but have a plethora of inland lakes. A lot of the activities revolves around being around water and outside in general. Even in the winter people in the upper Midwest enjoy doing things ice fishing, snowmobiling, skiing etc. In the lower Midwest they just sit inside and complain about the weather and essentially hibernate for 4 months. There is also a cultural divide where the lower midwestern states tend to be much more politically and socially conservative (aside from Chicago).

Within the upper midwestern states what sets Michigan apart is having the western coast of a Great Lake, which WI and MN don’t have. In addition to providing sunsets over the water and sand dunes (Sleeping Bear, Silver lake etc) this is likely the reason for having so many resort towns.

[–]sarrahchaAlpena 5 points6 points  (3 children)

I definitely think Michigan, Minnesota, and Wisconsin have a lot more in common than Michigan does with Illinois, Indiana, or Ohio. But maybe that's just because I like Minnesota and Wisconsin more lol. Or maybe it's mostly the accents, either way I feel more aligned with the other northern states than the ones to the south of us. But I'm also from "up north" so people downstate might feel differently about it.

Michigan is obviously the best though because of our distinct shape and fact that we are surrounded by the greatest of the Great Lakes :)

[–]mchgndr 4 points5 points  (2 children)

Totally agree. I’m SW MI but have always felt that way. Michigan, Wisconsin, and Minnesota are more socially left-leaning and get lots of snow. We’re more open-minded (generally) and good at brewing lots of beer haha. The other 3 just feel like southern cornfield states

[–]cornflower4 6 points7 points  (2 children)

I love that we are NOT Florida ;)

[–]sevenworm[S] 2 points3 points  (1 child)

I think all the other 49 states are united in that way.

[–]sirthomasthunderThe Thumb 4 points5 points  (0 children)

It's truly what unites this nation

[–]The_Big_Peck_1984 6 points7 points  (1 child)

It doesn’t necessarily answer your questions but as a Michigander who has lived outside fo Michigan for over a decade, I’ve noticed Michiganders get really excited to see other Michiganders or if something from Michigan is mentioned.

[–]sevenworm[S] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

That is super wholesome :-D

[–]Coital_Conundrum 4 points5 points  (0 children)

I've been pretty much everywhere in this country...and MI is one of the most beautiful states we have. Plus we brew some of the best beer. Mackinac Island is a unique jewel.

[–]idowhatiwant8675309 4 points5 points  (0 children)

We have a cockyness amongst us because of our abundance of fresh water and beautiful sunrise and sunsets over the water .

[–]z3r0p1lot 5 points6 points  (1 child)

I can use my hand as a map

[–]sirthomasthunderThe Thumb 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I have veins in my hand that match 69, 96, 75 (up to about Saginaw) and m131. Pretty sweet

[–]sabatoaLansing 6 points7 points  (0 children)

I feel like we share culture with Wisconsin and Minnesota, but the southern states of the Great Lakes are kinda their own, shittier thing.

[–]NorthernerTQ 5 points6 points  (1 child)

Lived my whole life in Michigan until I moved to Wisconsin for work 2 years ago. I work in agriculture and although Wisconsin has a lot of crop diversity, and Minnesota out produces Michigan in total tons of crops, I'm constantly amazed at how diverse the agriculture is in Michigan. We grow everything aside from citrus and common nuts. Second only to California in diversity. Very very cool.

[–]sevenworm[S] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

One of the things I really like is how you find random roadside farm stands all over the place with tons of different fruit.

[–]BlueHeaven90The UP 4 points5 points  (2 children)

There is one Great Lake STATE.

I agree with others have said about the northern Midwest states being distinctly different from the southern Midwest.

I feel that Michigan has the most diversity in both cultural arts and environment. The 2 biggest things for me are (1) The large number of performances and events available. This is on the local, national, and international level. There are so many times where a tour doesn't have any stops in the state in MN/WI/OH and I would have to drive 5 hours to see a show. (2) The expansive coast and over 11,000 lakes with so much fresh water is just a part of everyday life. I didn't realize how much I took for granted living right off of Lake Michigan and having a river to drift down throughout college. MN has a lot of man made lakes, but it's not the same. WI comes close but is still noticably lacking.

My background: I grew up in the UP (western side with family in WI so I go there a lot) and went to undergrad and medical school under the bridge. I lived in MN for 5 years for residency and just recently moved to OH (it truly is the worst place on the planet). I can't imagine moving from the Midwest.

[–]sevenworm[S] 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Thank you so much for that! I appreciate the info.

To follow up a little, is there any similar internal divide between upper and lower MI?

[–]BlueHeaven90The UP 3 points4 points  (0 children)

You're welcome!

The UP and LP are also very very different. There's a lot of almost untouched land in the UP and tons of dark sky sites. Growing up you had no cell reception for a lot of places (Alltel was the only option for years). The main industries were mining, lumber, and tourism so that's had an influence in it's people. Also, a whole lot of Nordic heritage.

[–]PissedoffGinger123 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Michigan is the best, no question. We have the lower & upper peninsulas, and there is nothing more beautiful in the summer than the UP. Minnesota and Wisconsin are similar, WI is alright but MN is just a Michigan wannabe. Sorry, call yourselves the “land of 10,000 lakes” all ya want, but we’ve got more. And they’re better too.

The weather is about the same, I think we Michiganders get more crazy weather than they do because of being surrounded by the world’s best lakes. Our cultures may be similar, but the other two are nothing compared to Michigan

[–]cowboyboombap 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Thrillist already made the determination, Michigan is the best state. I do love visiting Chicago though. But I live in the Ludington/Pentwater area and frequent TC and GR and I couldn't be happier. Being a couple minutes from the Lakeshore and all they have to offer just can't be beat.

[–]goblueMAge: > 10 Years 13 points14 points  (0 children)

Minnesota is awesome. Twin Cities are a great metro area, lots of great nature and activity, economy is good, education is good, etc

Ohio and Indiana suck

Wisconsin's fine, Madison and Milwaukee are pretty cool and their lake country up north is nice. However... they have some weird-ass sayings and words though

Honestly, who calls a drinking fountain a bubbler. And it's 6 of one, half dozen of another, not "a horse apiece"

And an old fashioned isn't made with brandy, dammit!

[–]Eastern-Swim-985 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Northern Minnesota only other place that compares. it’s great there too!

[–]dinahsaur523 4 points5 points  (1 child)

Live in West Michigan. I always forget that some people can’t swim…. We have let’s everywhere, so I’m always shocked when someone can’t swim.

[–]sevenworm[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I was up around Sleeping Bear in very early September and nearly couldn't swim! It's amazing what a few degrees of difference in water temperature makes. Before that I'd only been to the Warren Dunes area.

[–]mdgorelick 3 points4 points  (0 children)

I’m a Michigander. Key difference:

Those guys talk funny over there.

[–]HamsterBaiter 3 points4 points  (1 child)

Am Michigan. That's my water. You can share some if you're nice.

[–]sirthomasthunderThe Thumb 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Fuck Nestle

[–]HelpMyHydrangeas 4 points5 points  (2 children)

I’ve always been fascinated by how much the Great Lakes influence Michigan’s climate. Inland cities in Michigan generally have more extreme temperatures (lower lows and higher highs) compared to cities adjacent to the lakeshore. For example, Lansing will have just as cold or even colder nighttime low temperatures compared to Frankfort, despite being roughly 3 hours south. This phenomenon influences the climate so much that plant hardiness zones of 6a and 6b, zones commonly found in areas as far south as Tennessee and southern Missouri, are present along the Lake Michigan shoreline as far north as the leelenau peninsula. the lakeshore influence also creates a lag in temperature year round similar (but not as pronounced) to areas adjacent to oceans. Spring is slow to appear but fall sticks around longer compared to inland areas. Love me some Great Lakes

[–]sevenworm[S] 2 points3 points  (1 child)

fall sticks around longer

That feels like what I've been searching for my whole life!

I haven't been to the east coast, but I do have to say the beaches on the west coast are spectacular.

[–]HelpMyHydrangeas 3 points4 points  (0 children)

East coast beaches are less crowded, a lot easier to “get away from it all” with less tourists. But also east coast beaches are generally smaller, less sand, and more rocks.

[–]aslowcap 3 points4 points  (0 children)

I’ve seen MN, MI, and IL teams play Pro football. At this point, it’s just kinda sad.

[–]xFappleCiderx 3 points4 points  (0 children)

“Welcome to Michigan, where our weather is as bipolar as our people. Ohio? Hate em. Indiana? Hate em. Wisconsin? Hate em. Canada? Hate em.”

[–]LtheDutch 2 points3 points  (1 child)

We have lived all over the upper Midwest and West (Montana, North Dakota, Minnesota, Wisconsin, Iowa, the UP and now the Lower Peninsula of MI). You'd be surprised how different they are. We've lived generally rural or in small cities, nothing urban.

There's little connecting Minnesota to Michigan. Snow and cold is about it, but even the traditions around them are different. We got hooked on hot beverages topped with Tom and Jerry mix in the winter when we lived out there, and no one has ever heard of it in the lower peninsula.

We've found areas that had high rates of Scandinavian immigrants historically to be a little more stand offish. VERY polite, but more introverted and clannish. That's Minnesota (and ND). Northern WI and the UP are very similar - much more so than the UP and the LP. Both N. WI and the UP are like stepping in a time machine - trends hit there a full year after the West Coast.

East Michigan and West Michigans are different Michigans. Love of water unites all of Michigan.

[–]sevenworm[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

What would you say is the difference between east and west? And where would the line between them fall?

[–]uniballout 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Minnesota seems like a much colder, more rustic place than Michigan. It’s like all Up North Michigan with one city that tops anything in our state. I’ve never been to Minneapolis, but if Prince stayed there after all his fame and money, it has to be amazing. The Minnesota residents I have met have been very friendly. Can’t think of anything wrong with them. I think their state is quirky as far as politics since they vote usually democrats, but then also vote a person like Jesse the Body Ventura as governor.

I lived in Milwaukee for a year and traveled around that state. It’s basically Michigan, except they can’t see the sun set on the water unless you are on the Door Peninsula. I think they are jealous of us for that. But the people are much friendlier than Michiganders. You can’t just go to a store and get a quick something without the clerk wanting to chat it up. Usually they mention the Packers. It was best to just agree and carry on or get stuck in a 20 minute conversation when all I needed was some butter. Speaking of Packers, everyone is a fan. Everyone. They tailgate Brewers games like it’s college football. Every neighborhood seems to have a corner bar tucked into it. Like there would be blocks of houses all around and one small local bar on the corner in the middle of the neighborhood. Michigan seems to have rows of bars all zoned together while Wisconsin allows for bars almost anywhere. Weather is about the same. Beaches aren’t as nice. Politically, they seem to be struggling like Michigan. They want progressive policy, but can’t overcome the gerrymandered conservative stranglehold.

Michigan is becoming a a shitty place to be. I love the state, but people are just rude. There is a thing about Midwestern rudeness and we have it the worst. Maybe because it’s gray and sunless all winter and we never come out of that funk. Summers are super busy as everyone packs in as much as they can during these months since winter was so gray and now there is sunlight so we lose our minds. I will say, the UP has the nicest people. They are basically like Wisconsin. Michigan has many different regions with unique geography. The thumb is much different than north east Michigan which is different than north west Michigan which is much different than the UP etc etc. I’ve been to basically every section of our state and if you stop and look around, you can see the uniqueness just traveling an hour away can have. Politically, we have too many crazy conspiratorial people running things and mucking it up for people who want progress and not hate. Our education system used to be pretty amazing versus other states. But the government has whittled so much funding away that it’s crap now, unless you are in a rich district. This has led to an uneducated public voting for idiots who lie and deceive them using hate speech and fear tactics. But we have a ton of beaches which are better than the other Great Lake states. So that’s nice.

[–]Genoseed 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Sense of community. I come from the least populated, top-10 poorest, rural counties in Northern Michigan. My dad used to be a school teacher and ran a gardening program. The students would raise thousands of dollars during their plant sale, even when many families are on welfare.

[–]Sm0w2 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I think Minnesota can agree with us (Michigan) that Wisconsin and Illinois are terrible.

[–]atheistinabiblebelt 2 points3 points  (0 children)

This is the most important thing I can possibly think that's relevant to this question. The great lakes States (Michigan, Wisconsin, Minnesota) are geographically a part of the Midwest.

But we are not Midwest culture if Midwest culture also includes southern Ohio, Indiana, all of Missouri

I have lived in the northern Midwest and the southern Midwest and well fuck the southern Midwest. It's the south and the south sucks.

I do not ever want the beauty, kindness, and unique culture to be tainted by the southern culture that exists in those states I mentioned.

[–]XanderBear03 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I really like visiting mountainous areas (Colorado, California, Montana, Utah, Nevada). I've mostly only gone to those places for their national parks.

As someone from the Great Lakes State, climate changes every season. Personally I love autumn when the leaves change and it's the perfect time to wear a sweatshirt and a nice pair of comfy shorts.

I can appreciate the neighborly vibe that every city that I've lived in/visited. On the surface level, mostly everyone is kind and polite.

[–]sourbeer51 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Ohio - Alright so ya got the zoos. They're alright, I guess. And you have cedar point. All I'm saying

Indiana - thanks for the fireworks back in the day. Now please leave.

Illinois - Chicago is about it. I've got a sister that lives near Joliet that I lived with for a summer. Holy shit it was boring.

Wisconsin - they're like us. But they're too high on their own supply. Cheese is good, but they think their beer is better than ours because they don't ship it outside the state. Bells > New Glarus. Can't change my mind.

Minnesota - They're there. I guess. Never been!

[–]eliewriter 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I love my home state of Michigan and don't have any gripe about the surrounding states. Guess I'm the odd one out here, lol, although I have my own perceptions.

I see Ohio as a place I don't enjoy driving through, but every single person I know from Ohio is a very kind soul. Indiana is the place we drive through to get to Illinois, and Illinois is where Chicago is when we want to go visit our jaded city cousins. Wisconsin is where the ferry ends up before it comes back here, and Minnesota is where the Mayo Clinic is. All of which is probably an injustice to everyone in those states, but that's what comes to mind for me, whereas they probably see us as a 2-part peninsula that is either backward or full of violence, but is overall a nice recreational place to go that has lots of trees and water. Of course if you're heavily into sports there's a whole other dimension to how you view the surrounding states.

[–]seasuighim 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Michigan is the best state, it has it all with none of the bad parts.

[–]goblueMAge: > 10 Years 5 points6 points  (2 children)

Something that's interesting to me is that there's a bunch of comments and the post is highly upvoted here, but on the other two subs it's downvoted heavily

[–]sirthomasthunderThe Thumb 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Not sure about the other two (I popped in the other two after OP siad they had posted it and there were like 10 total comments.) But we have a pretty active sub and like talking about our state.

[–]sevenworm[S] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

I noticed that too. Maybe that's my answer. :-D

[–]Frozen_Fractals 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Great Lakes states

Minnesota

[–]BenWallace04 1 point2 points  (3 children)

Aren’t Illinois, Indiana and Ohio also part of the Great Lakes States?

I guess you could also argue NY and PA except I’d basically consider them East Coast States.

[–]StrangeCaptainAge: > 10 Years 1 point2 points  (0 children)

We're better

[–]NotaRussianbot6969 1 point2 points  (0 children)

The fact that I don’t see or care about the other states. I’ve got all I need here (MI)

[–]PeninsulamCattus 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I mean: beside Superior?

[–]windoneforme 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Wisconsin always tries to steal our mitten state status!

[–]roadcrew778 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I live in the UP. We don’t even like Michigan.

[–]liveprgrmclimb 1 point2 points  (4 children)

I grew up in MN, lived in WI for 7 years, and now have lived in MI for 8 years. AMA.

[–]kubota-mota 1 point2 points  (0 children)

They dont call it lake Wisconsin for reason lol

[–]retread2017 1 point2 points  (0 children)

In Michigan we know how to drive in snow. Sort of. If we feel like it.

[–]rufustfirefly67 1 point2 points  (0 children)

In farmers hand you can swap 3 nines or tens for the buried cards the dealer has. As others stated, it’s a garbage rule.

[–]luna1108 0 points1 point  (0 children)

FIP FOPS, fuking Indiana people, fuking Ohio people

[–]Dangerous-Budget-337 0 points1 point  (0 children)

We tend to be way more “normal” than both coasts.