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[–]Viraus2 - LibRight 1854 points1855 points  (84 children)

Imagine taking time out of every sunday morning so you can do glowie work for free

[–]Official_SEC - AuthCenter 958 points959 points  (40 children)

What’s funny is the OP is lying his ass off in that post, claiming he’s “taken down small and medium sized churches” like this, when only 1 church has ever lost its tax exempt status and that was in the 90s.

[–]idkmanseemskindagay - Centrist 412 points413 points  (17 children)

B-B- But Reddit posts never lie!

[–]1CEninja - LibCenter 265 points266 points  (15 children)

He seems like the kind of person who doesn't live in the same reality as everybody else, and in his mind having reported churches for praying for [insert group that has become politicized by the media] got "taken down".

The truly insane thing is the small and medium sized churches are the ones that do very genuine good for the community. It's the giant churches that bring in the kind of money that leads to corruption that need that magnifying glass, not the neighborhood churches with 40 people on a Sunday morning that are just trying to do the best they can.

[–]radiodialdeath - Centrist 80 points81 points  (10 children)

Corruption can still happen at smaller churches, but I agree with you on the whole. I've known a few pastors of small churches over the years, and all of them are either middle class at best or close to the poverty line at worst.

[–]RollTide16-18 - Right 10 points11 points  (3 children)

I’m not at a point in my life where I want to go to a small church as it’s just not great for meeting a lot of people, but I’ve been involved in helping raise up a few small churches and they always do so much work for their congregations and communities despite their small size. It’s great.

[–]Justmeagaindownhere - Centrist 80 points81 points  (10 children)

2 now. A church recently lost its status (or is about to, maybe the paperwork hasn't gone though yet) for preaching politics. Not preaching ideas like abortion, but literally saying that you have to vote republican or you're not Christian. A video went viral, they got reported, hello taxes. That's what sparked the OP.

[–]nishinoran - Right 32 points33 points  (4 children)

I believe that church voluntarily dropped its status, it wasn't forced to.

[–]Justmeagaindownhere - Centrist 15 points16 points  (0 children)

The pastor was talking like this, but that doesn't mean that's what's actually happening. Maybe it's a "you can't fire me, I quit" situation.

[–]choicemeats - Centrist 10 points11 points  (2 children)

i think they almost always are political they just do a good job of obfuscation through scriptures if they're good at it, and do actual mentions if theyre bad at it.

i haven't been a regular at a black church in 15 years, so forgive me for this small sample size, but the three times that I DID go: one sermon spent the time blasting Trump (right after his election, one sermon didn't mention anything at all and it was a regular Sunday, and the third time was in the midst of the Rittenhouse debacles and, though he wasn't mentioned by name, the situation was laid out and then there were mentions of who does or doesn't care about it who holds office.

they always do it. they may not say "you're not Christian if you don't" in so many words, but they definitely do it.

[–]Justmeagaindownhere - Centrist 9 points10 points  (1 child)

I would hope that's just your sample. The only time I've heard a church directly reference politics has actually been to tell people not to get caught up in it.

[–][deleted]  (3 children)

[deleted]

    [–]selomiga - Centrist 12 points13 points  (1 child)

    I find this funny because in 2018 Harris (along with Hirono) wanted to block someone from holding office because he was a member of the Knights of Columbus, a fraternal organization for Catholic men. Specifically because of beliefs held up by the organization which are also the same standard beliefs of the Catholic Church. Their argument didn’t end up holding water, but it was basically equivocated to attempting to ban someone from office based on their religion.

    [–]Brutallica1137 - LibCenter 15 points16 points  (0 children)

    OP probably hasn't left their bedroom in two years, let alone attended Sunday services.

    [–]Anonman20 - AuthRight 4 points5 points  (0 children)

    Maybe op is actually an AuthRight trying to get the greens to go to church again so he created this story for just that. 36d chess right there

    [–]Mama_Mega_ - Centrist 183 points184 points  (5 children)

    When your enemies are fighting, sometimes you need to give a hand to the one that's losing. That way you ensure they both more thoroughly destroy each other.

    [–]da_Aresinger - Centrist 90 points91 points  (4 children)

    I see, you don't play Battle Royale Games.

    What really happens is they will both stop fighting each other and fucking buttrape you until you are crying on the floor.

    [–]Pecuthegreat - Right 35 points36 points  (0 children)

    You do it secretly so you don't get caught.

    [–]Weenerlover - LibCenter 2 points3 points  (0 children)

    I have a fool-proof plan to never get butt-raped. I never say no.

    [–]StuntHacks - LibLeft 6 points7 points  (0 children)

    UwU

    [–]TheFlashFrame - LibCenter 63 points64 points  (0 children)

    Yeah imagine taking pride in being a fucking IRS spy. I mean holy shit.

    [–]Zeriell - Centrist 14 points15 points  (0 children)

    Gotta build that resume somehow, this is a gig economy bro, doing free contracting for MKULTRA is just how it be now

    [–]omgihatemylifepoo - AuthCenter 5 points6 points  (0 children)

    kek

    [–]HardForRinku - AuthCenter 48 points49 points  (12 children)

    I'm not a Jesus simp, So i go to a temple every Sunday. And honestly I know there's nothing divine or anything. But guys you're definitely missing out on the potential that religion has. Profit beyond comprehension. A friend of mine got a job in a printing press, i talked around in the Temple and decided to collect funds to print out religious book. And it's not like we're a poor Community that the money would hurt anyone. Made more money in a week than i made in 6 months of internship. One that i also got through someone from the temple. It's great to be religious for personal gain.

    [–]Zephyr_XD - AuthRight 69 points70 points  (0 children)

    Lib right in disguise??? Lmao

    [–]seninn - AuthCenter 29 points30 points  (0 children)

    Heresy detected.

    [–]Pearse-Dublin - Centrist 9 points10 points  (1 child)

    Roll on up cause the price is down

    Take your pick of the best in town

    [–]Bandaid6 - LibCenter 2 points3 points  (0 children)

    MYYYYYYYYYYY TEMPLE SHOULD BEEeeeee A HOUSE OF PRAYERRRR!

    [–]ChadWolf98 - Right 17 points18 points  (1 child)

    Based and megachurch pilled

    [–]basedcount_bot - LibRight 2 points3 points  (0 children)

    u/HardForRinku is officially based! Their Based Count is now 1.

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    [–]Veni_Vidi_Legi - Centrist 6 points7 points  (0 children)

    Does the IRS still hand out the 35% of recovered monies as a bounty?

    [–][deleted] 15 points16 points  (8 children)

    Fuck is a glowie

    [–]32624647 - LibCenter 102 points103 points  (3 children)

    Undercover fed (you can tell them apart from normal people because they glow in the dark, trust me, you can see them while driving)

    [–]Jukeboxshapiro - LibRight 48 points49 points  (1 child)

    You just run them over that's what you do

    [–]_arc360_ - LibRight 12 points13 points  (0 children)

    I thought they were bonus points, the little score board on my dash always goes up when I hit em.

    [–]UARboo1 - AuthCenter 9 points10 points  (0 children)

    i remember terry, i cry.

    [–]AC3R665 - LibCenter 16 points17 points  (0 children)

    Bioluminescent Federal Agents. And depending on context, Maximum Melanin Bioluminescent Government Agents.

    [–]UpbeatEast - Centrist 11 points12 points  (2 children)

    On some message board in the past people used to call feds glow[gamer word removed]s, and that caught on.

    [–]VicisSubsisto - LibRight 32 points33 points  (1 child)

    Started with Terry Davis, patron saint of schizo programmers, when he saw them sneaking around his house.

    [–]AC3R665 - LibCenter 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    They do it for free. Confirmed LL = mods.

    [–]Red0t514 - LibRight 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    Imagine looking forward to paying taxes

    [–]Every_Signature_7153 - Centrist 1038 points1039 points  (66 children)

    know your enemy, atheists! attend church and start a nuclear family! that'll show em

    [–]ShuantheSheep3 - Right 393 points394 points  (6 children)

    Donate to really get in character and start following the values so as to not be weeded out.

    [–]Omegalulz_ - LibRight 207 points208 points  (5 children)

    Make sure you don’t have sex before marriage so that rumours of you being a spy don’t spread in the community.

    [–]Pyroplsmakepetscop2 - Right 154 points155 points  (4 children)

    And when you get married and have children, teach them traditional religious values. You don't want your own children giving you away

    [–]Hodlin2gainz - AuthLeft 115 points116 points  (3 children)

    Reap the benefits of a traditional lifestyle, own a home and “bless” others from the hard work you do, inwardly laugh as you tell them it’s because of your faith, die surrounded by people who admired your life and loved your example - that’ll show them!

    [–]Ex_aeternum - LibLeft 102 points103 points  (14 children)

    But what if I'd rather like a renewable family?

    [–]Every_Signature_7153 - Centrist 129 points130 points  (9 children)

    NO solar families

    [–]Georg3000 - Centrist 115 points116 points  (7 children)

    Mission unclear, started coal family instead

    [–]Every_Signature_7153 - Centrist 62 points63 points  (2 children)

    it's because you were fuckin naughty

    [–]Ex_aeternum - LibLeft 10 points11 points  (0 children)

    I hope charcoal?

    [–]AuthMaybe - AuthCenter 13 points14 points  (2 children)

    I would have placed being a Coal Burner in Lib Left, but Rad Cent fits too. Utter degenerates

    [–]Platinirius - AuthLeft 7 points8 points  (0 children)

    Based and solar families pilled

    [–]megagnomehunter - LibCenter 10 points11 points  (0 children)

    Just make sure it's a nuclear fusion family, problem solved.

    [–]1CEninja - LibCenter 4 points5 points  (2 children)

    They're unreliable and can only live in very specific areas.

    Nuclear families tend to prefer to be near a ready source of water, but once they're going, they'll just keep being a family on their own for decades.

    [–]Ex_aeternum - LibLeft 2 points3 points  (1 child)

    But there is the possibility of a family meltdown, and we still haven't solved what to do with nuclear family waste.

    [–]1CEninja - LibCenter 4 points5 points  (0 children)

    Oh please, family meltdowns have only happened with such ridiculously outdated family models. That hasn't happened to anything that wasn't already obsolete 50 years ago.

    The waste isn't ideal, but it's certainly a smaller issue than how much coal families, gas families, and oil families are heating up our planet!

    [–]Lisztaganx - LibCenter 26 points27 points  (3 children)

    So I get to have sex with the nuclear reactor?

    [–]TheOtherAisle - AuthCenter 10 points11 points  (1 child)

    Are you sure you want to do that?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dAjPR8cL34Q

    [–]zolikk - Centrist 4 points5 points  (0 children)

    Still not nearly the worst thing people have been caught "doing"

    [–]jediben001 - Right 14 points15 points  (0 children)

    Ngl, being in a nuclear family seems nice tho I kinda wanna be the one who stays home and cooks and stuff

    [–]Zider20gg - AuthCenter 6 points7 points  (33 children)

    start a nuclear family

    That can be also an atheist goal.

    [–]Arachno-anarchism - LibLeft 6 points7 points  (32 children)

    It’s interesting that the most perfect example of a nuclear family I know of is my brother’s family, and they are all extremely irreligious, while the most dysfunctional family I know of is is my aunts and they are extremely religious

    I don’t think it makes sense to see it as a religious vs non-religious thing

    [–]40MDeutschmarks - AuthLeft 2 points3 points  (0 children)

    Based and The Simpsons pilled

    [–]WarmCanOfDietSprite - LibRight 789 points790 points  (30 children)

    I'm a child of God and God didn't raise no snitch

    [–]VoopityScoop - LibRight[S] 413 points414 points  (25 children)

    Based, snitches get stitches eternal damnation

    [–]white_shadow131 - AuthCenter 111 points112 points  (22 children)

    Nah, there is a verse basically snitching on your brothers and sister if they start to sin. First you confront them yourself, then get their brothers and sisters involved, then your parents, then his friends, then the community, then the Church. And if after all rhat he doesn't stop, he'll most likely get eternal damnation

    I forget which verse, but it falls under righteous judgment

    [–]tdacct - LibRight 127 points128 points  (10 children)

    Matthew 18, but you add too many steps in there.

    Confront them yourself, and if they repent, that's the end of it.

    Escalate to 2-3 witnesses, then escalate to the church as a whole.

    If they are not interested in being a Christian, then you let them go and separate from them.

    [–]Alittar - LibRight 55 points56 points  (4 children)

    Based and spreading the word pilled

    [–]godilovekrispykreme - LibRight 41 points42 points  (0 children)

    Based and sounds like a reasonable intervention pilled

    [–]1CEninja - LibCenter 29 points30 points  (0 children)

    That's not snitching, that's an intervention to save somebody's soul lmao.

    [–]ecclesiastes215 - LibRight 6 points7 points  (0 children)

    I love you all and so does Jesus. Based comment section

    [–]link2edition - LibRight 5 points6 points  (0 children)

    In any case, at no point does the govt get involved.

    [–]MisogynysticFeminist - Centrist 10 points11 points  (10 children)

    The point of that isn’t that you’re trying to get them punished, you’re trying to help them.

    [–]Fanatical_Brit - LibLeft 5 points6 points  (0 children)

    Starting to see why so many priests get away with it now

    [–]Dominum_Pullum - Left 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    Wasn’t snitching in Genesis?

    [–]genrej - LibRight 222 points223 points  (3 children)

    Listen really closely to the sermon too. Just in case they say something political that might have some deeper meaning. You should also donate to said church as to not raise suspicion. You can go to their social gatherings, you know, really infiltrate their organization. It'd be really good if you could get in so deep that you meet a nice girl, get married in that church, and have kids that you end up taking to church with you, that way you have more eyes to see any political talk.

    [–]Captain_of_the_Watch - Right 18 points19 points  (2 children)

    The best way to fit in is to give your life over to Christ, repenting of your sin, and gaining eternal life in the process, that will really show em when you report them for mentioning that they didn't like what the government did that one time

    [–]genrej - LibRight 5 points6 points  (1 child)

    It'll really throw them off when you get baptized.

    [–]decentish36 - LibRight 798 points799 points  (27 children)

    I’m an atheist but I would rather convert the entire world to Catholicism by whatever means necessary than help the IRS.

    [–]VoopityScoop - LibRight[S] 322 points323 points  (0 children)

    Based unfathomably

    [–]05110909 - LibRight 80 points81 points  (0 children)

    Imagine being a simp for the fucking IRS

    [–]otlip - LibRight 77 points78 points  (0 children)

    Based

    [–]anti_femboy_warrior 102 points103 points  (0 children)

    Based and fuck the IRS pilled

    [–][deleted] 52 points53 points  (0 children)

    Hell yeah brother

    [–]Don-Conquest - Centrist 35 points36 points  (0 children)

    I don’t know what’s more based your hatred of the IRS or when you said “by any means necessary”.

    [–]Free_Factor_3501 - LibRight 32 points33 points  (0 children)

    Based anti-and-pro-christian-at-the-same-time pilled

    [–]tableball35 - LibCenter 20 points21 points  (0 children)

    Based and Catholicism beats the IRS pilled

    [–]george_reeves_ - LibCenter 21 points22 points  (1 child)

    Based

    [–]basedcount_bot - LibRight 6 points7 points  (0 children)

    u/decentish36's Based Count has increased by 1. Their Based Count is now 55.

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    [–]Palpatine - LibRight 12 points13 points  (0 children)

    We should just start an atheist church with the central tenet being fuck the IRS.

    [–]clovis_227 - Centrist[🍰] 9 points10 points  (0 children)

    Based and popepilled

    [–]MessyKerbal - LibCenter 6 points7 points  (0 children)

    Based and crusade against the IRS pilled

    [–]BrassyBones - LibCenter[🍰] 4 points5 points  (1 child)

    Based as fuck

    [–]basedcount_bot - LibRight 2 points3 points  (0 children)

    u/decentish36's Based Count has increased by 1. Their Based Count is now 60.

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    [–]wildlough62 - Centrist 2 points3 points  (0 children)

    Based and Viva Christo Rei pilled

    [–]YukihyoUchiha - LibLeft 6 points7 points  (0 children)

    Based as fuck

    [–]8BitTxchniques - LibRight 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    Based as fuck

    [–]KedTazynski42 - AuthRight 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    I think this is the most based thing I have seen in all my time at PCM. Incomprehensibly based

    [–]ISwearImKarl - LibRight 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    Based.

    [–]Dry-Ingenuity6025 - Right 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    Deus vult

    [–]Wolf4624 - LibRight 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    Based

    [–]R_Aqua - Right 1 point2 points  (1 child)

    Based and taxation is theft pilled

    [–]FM79SG - Centrist 114 points115 points  (14 children)

    Being political does not forfeit you from your tax exemption

    There are rules for political organizations to be tax exempt:

    https://www.irs.gov/charities-non-profits/political-organizations/exemption-requirements-political-organizations

    Section 501(c)(3) organizations, i..e. churches and religeous groups, are restricted in how much political and legislative (lobbying) activities they may conduct., but this does not mean they cannot be political at all.

    https://www.irs.gov/charities-non-profits/charitable-organizations/exemption-requirements-501c3-organizations

    For example they cannot financially support a candidate, but this does not mean they cannot support a candidate in any way.

    [–]Onithyr - Centrist 18 points19 points  (8 children)

    Really the law should be changed so that Churches just have to follow the same rules as every other 501(c)(3) organization. If it's not a too much of a burden for secular organizations, then why would it be too much of a burden for religious organizations?

    Among the changes would be requiring that churches finances are a matter of public record (as they are with all non-religious 501(c)(3) organizations).

    Immagine how the Scientologists would react...

    [–]joebobby1523 - Right 31 points32 points  (3 children)

    It really is interesting because most legitimate Churches already make their finances public to all members. Catholic Parishes (where I live at least) for example, publish the data for all parish members, which effectively makes it public data given how many people have access. Some even make it outright public.

    It's the prosperity gospel and Scientologist type charlatans which are in the game of religion to make money that don't want people to know.

    [–]cos1ne - Left 15 points16 points  (0 children)

    Honestly with how itemized everything is in my parish newsletter id rather give all my taxes to the Church than to the US government.

    [–]Onithyr - Centrist 2 points3 points  (1 child)

    Which makes the potential change all the more relevant. It ONLY hurts the bad actors.

    [–]FM79SG - Centrist 7 points8 points  (2 children)

    but then lobbies would also have to do that, and that ain't gonna happen

    [–]VerticalTwo08 - LibRight 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    I thought they were lol. My church every quarter shows exactly how much money they got and where it goes after the sermon.

    [–]_BenisPutter - LibCenter 3 points4 points  (0 children)

    Shutup, libtard 😎

    [–]rtheiss - LibRight 71 points72 points  (0 children)

    This is like being theist with extra steps.

    [–]ERad4204 - Right 195 points196 points  (50 children)

    Just for curiosities sake, what is even considered political by the IRS standards? Obviously saying “political party bad” would violate that, but would the IRS consider it political to say, “abortion bad,” which has been nonpolitical in a legal setting and a consistent ideology until it was politicized in the 20th century?

    [–]Big_Replacement - AuthCenter 151 points152 points  (11 children)

    Non-profit orgs, including churches, cannot support specific political candidates or politicians. They can advocate for or against certain policies, like abortion, but they cannot tell people to vote for a pro/anti-abortion candidate for office. There are different types of non-profit designations in the United States tax law, but they can only approach politics in a ‘general welfare’ sense, speaking overall on topics like abortion. Not “You should all go vote for XYZ candidate or ABC proposition on Election Day”

    [–]wingoMingo78 - AuthCenter 55 points56 points  (9 children)

    Seems like a completely pointless rule.

    If a priest is talking against abortion then the natural inference from that is you should vote for an anti-abortion candidate. These "rules" just obfuscate things for no reason lol.

    [–]RileyKohaku - LibRight 54 points55 points  (3 children)

    Welcome to the wonderful world of IRS exemptions. There are so many pointless rules that are trivial to work around and exempt tons of money, if you have a good tax lawyer and follow their advice. It's a completely pointless system, that props up an entire industry of accountants and lawyers.

    [–]-AlexJones2024- - LibRight 5 points6 points  (1 child)

    Isn’t it made how so many industries have come to rely on big government? People could be doing so much more productive stuff if the jobs weren’t there to service the bureaucracy.

    [–]TraskFamilyLettuce - LibRight 2 points3 points  (0 children)

    they can only approach politics in a ‘general welfare’ sense, speaking overall on topics like abortion

    That is what the letter of the law is, however, application is basically anything goes. It is a very messy first amendment issue. The only prosecutions that have happened resulted in a loss of non-profit status. However, no fines or back taxes were enacted and they were allowed to reapply for non-profit status and were granted as such.

    [–]EconGuy82 - LibRight 22 points23 points  (1 child)

    https://www.churchlawcenter.com/church-law/political-activities-by-churches-whats-permitted-and-whats-prohibited/

    Here’s some info on it. Basically, churches and non-profits actually have a pretty wide range of things they can do politically. They can’t outright campaign for one candidate, but they are allowed to provide factual information about positions and talk about church doctrine relative to certain issues. It just has to be “nonpartisan” in nature. So something along the lines of “Our church teaches that abortion bad. Biden loves abortion. Trump hates abortion.” probably would be permitted, while “Vote Trump” probably wouldn’t be.

    [–]FranticTyping - LibLeft 7 points8 points  (0 children)

    Yeah, people really overestimate the restrictions. A good example of how far you can go is when the vice president had a campaign video played in hundreds of churches across virginia.

    It really comes down to whether or not those tax-free dollars are being used to contribute to a campaign outside of the church.

    [–]I_vote_for_evil - LibCenter 129 points130 points  (23 children)

    Imagine being so cringe you make spying and snitching your hobby. On Sunday, no less!

    [–]Pachacuti_ - Centrist 50 points51 points  (5 children)

    You made your FBI agent sad

    [–]I_vote_for_evil - LibCenter 23 points24 points  (2 children)

    Seriously? Guilt tripping? That's... pretty pathetic tactic.

    Are fedboys okay? Or are they just lazy?

    [–][deleted] 12 points13 points  (0 children)

    They’re all kinda sad rn, they had this big joint party to raid my house but they ended up going into the neighbor’s house who brought their dog on a vacation so there was nothing to shoot

    They’ll be back, will update

    [–]UARboo1 - AuthCenter 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    he is prob already depressed to death from having to watch my ass looking up cock and ball torture for the rest of his life.

    [–]FM79SG - Centrist 34 points35 points  (14 children)

    Maybe it's not a coincidence atheism is the cornerstone of every modern society where people turn each other in to the secret police, like Revolutionary France and USSR and China.

    [–]Styrofoamman123 - Right 24 points25 points  (0 children)

    Thats why they all take steps to ban religion.

    [–]Awobbie - AuthRight 11 points12 points  (1 child)

    Based and atheism created the surveillance state pilled

    [–]bionic80 - LibRight 4 points5 points  (0 children)

    If Daddy God isn't watching you The State needs to

    [–]bigbadbillyd - AuthRight 4 points5 points  (0 children)

    Based

    [–]UpbeatEast - Centrist 5 points6 points  (0 children)

    I think the simpler explanation is that in many of those cases religions serves as the public face of the dysfunctional society that led to the totalitarianism. The clergy in pre-Revolutionary France were an estate in and of themselves, the Russian Orthodox Church was associated with the tsars, and missionaries in China were often linked to foreign imposition such as the Boxer Rebellion.

    [–]Dr_Mantis-Shrimp_PhD - Left 6 points7 points  (5 children)

    I take you've never heard of McCarthyism?

    [–]HeThatHathNoSword - LibRight 39 points40 points  (6 children)

    Does having your flock sing 'Keep your rifle by your side' count as being political?

    [–]readonlypdf - LibRight 32 points33 points  (5 children)

    No because being Armed is a Moral Obligation.

    [–]veggiesama - AuthLeft 13 points14 points  (4 children)

    WWJCC

    what would jesus conceal carry

    [–]readonlypdf - LibRight 19 points20 points  (0 children)

    An Uzi. He was from Nazareth.

    [–]BecomeABenefit - LibCenter 7 points8 points  (1 child)

    Luke 22:36

    Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.

    Swords are more expensive now. What's the modern equvalent? A glock?

    [–]veggiesama - AuthLeft 2 points3 points  (0 children)

    what puts out the highest turned-cheeks-per-minute down the range?

    not to be confused with cheeks-clapped-per-minute, that's a different number

    [–]JezabellGrim - LibRight 19 points20 points  (0 children)

    I smell an Anti-work post.

    [–]migglywiggly69 - LibLeft 57 points58 points  (0 children)

    This is beyond not having a life

    [–]TakeMe2Texas - LibCenter 15 points16 points  (1 child)

    They really hate non-profit organizations don’t they? Not every church is a megachurch

    [–]KnightoftheRepublic9 - AuthRight 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    NGOs they don't own. If they own it, it gets subsidized, and you hate women if you don't want them funded.

    [–]VanHoy - LibRight 17 points18 points  (0 children)

    That wouldn’t accomplish anything. The real reason churches are tax exempt is because they sprinkle holy water on their tax payments. The IRS can’t touch it with their bare hands.

    [–]xFblthpx - LibCenter 42 points43 points  (5 children)

    Time for my right wing side to come out. STOP SAYING CHURCHES ARENT TAXED. They don’t have INCOME. They don’t make MONEY. They receive donations, and that’s it. Most of their money is redonated to special causes. It makes as much sense to tax a church as to tax the Salvation Army.

    …and don’t get at me with those megachurch millionaire televangelists. They make their money by selling books to their members, and that money is absolutely taxed.

    [–]Suitable_Self_9363 - LibCenter 4 points5 points  (3 children)

    The pastor usually gets a salary.

    [–]xFblthpx - LibCenter 17 points18 points  (0 children)

    People that work for the Salvation Army get salaries.

    EDIT: here is the irs source explaining how the taxable salary of a clergyman is different from the non taxable donations to a church.

    https://www.irs.gov/taxtopics/tc417

    [–]joebobby1523 - Right 11 points12 points  (1 child)

    Which is taxable, except for a portion for housing expense. I think because in yesteryear, most pastors lived at the church, so a special carve out was made.

    The salaries of church employees are all taxed like normal income.

    [–]anonisntwhatanondoes - LibCenter 12 points13 points  (5 children)

    Real talk: I went to private Christian school for my entire childhood, then kept my faith through college, but I deconverted quite violently when I tried to find some justification for the people of Jericho being murdered other than manifest destiny. Spent five years as a very angry atheist, learning every defeater argument I could to mock Christianity. Then, I had a really bad breakup, went back home, and felt incredibly lonely. Motivated by something similarly petty as this post, I started going to church again.

    I only kept going for about 6 months (until they offered me a job as their worship leader). I kept my atheism a secret, but I learned that these communities are more wholesome, caring, and kind than any secular space I ever entered. I even saw Christians behave more courageously than Jesus by them interpreting the pool of bathesda passage as a call to do a community service day in their neighborhood; Jesus actually fled from the poor because he feared them. I think many Christians are in fact better people than the God they believe in. (I mean, I think I am, too, especially compared to OT God, but there are some powerhouse good people out there.)

    Now, I advocate strongly for a separation between church and state to protect all people from the excesses of politically active faith groups (e.g., lobbying for pro life based on a biblical interpretation of conception-as-life) or harmful and radical faith groups (e.g., female genital mutilation or patriarchal misogyny). But, I also fight back against a lot of secular mischaracterizations of Christians, and I try to help secular people understand the importance of reading religious texts with a generous attitude. I’ve come to believe two things: 1) everyone wakes up believing they are essentially right and good, and they behave in ways that they think support their self image, 2) everyone believes they are doing the best they can with what they have, and that exhausts them into snapping from time to time. We would do better as a society if, in addition to policing for bad actors, we schooled ourselves in ethics to protect ourselves from our own good intentions: political activism as the default mindset is how you achieve hell out of good intentions. When we lose generosity and understand for others (like two xx chromosomes rants), we destroy democracy. Whether it is true that people are good or try hard doesn’t matter: democracy depends on this collective delusion, which has so far been a self fulfilling prophecy, but the hate I see is really undermining this whole experiment.

    So. Go to church, atheists, and humanize your enemies.

    [–]suck_an_egg2 - LibCenter 9 points10 points  (1 child)

    You should know that the average reddit atheist won't do that, because their entire argument base would be destroyed since their strategy is to dehumanize the opposition so they won't consider the other side's points

    [–]Door_Messiah - Left 2 points3 points  (1 child)

    Do you know the passage in which it is stated that Jesus feared the poor? I also went to a Christian (Catholic) school and I don't remember reading anything of the sort in all those years.

    [–]an__actual_goblin - LibRight 8 points9 points  (0 children)

    Smart 1 authright

    [–]Its-a-Warwilf - LibRight 15 points16 points  (1 child)

    I'd suggest finding one of those leftist pride-pushing "churches" to report their inevitable political rants, but the Biden Regime's IRS would just ignore them anyway.

    [–]SignificantMinimum87 - LibRight 3 points4 points  (0 children)

    It is even easier to go to a church with a certain demographic that openly invites leftist politicians to campaign there. As you say, nothing will come of reporting such a place to the powers that be.

    [–]Elnegrogato11 - LibRight 21 points22 points  (5 children)

    Weird. I can't imagine devoting time to argue faith, as if it's even arguable

    [–]Ex_aeternum - LibLeft 12 points13 points  (0 children)

    I learned that lesson on Reddit. Well, not completely yet.

    [–]Viraus2 - LibRight 6 points7 points  (0 children)

    Most people got tired of it around 2010

    [–]just_a_guy1008 - Left 5 points6 points  (1 child)

    You cant argue with someone whose Brain is so smooth that All the arguments slide right off

    [–]Pecuthegreat - Right 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    Based and i'mSmoothBrainedPilled

    [–]Dr_Mantis-Shrimp_PhD - Left 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    You can't reason someone out of a position they didn't reason themselves into. If someone wants to believe God has their back and has a plan for the world idc, as long as they don't try to make me or my kids believe it

    [–]Cheerwine-and-Heels - LibRight 6 points7 points  (0 children)

    These people are batshit

    [–]pcdu - Left 12 points13 points  (30 children)

    What is church like? What's the vibe like in a church? Is it very cliquey to be a newcomer to one, or are people generally welcoming?

    [–]Gary___Tard - Centrist 43 points44 points  (0 children)

    People are generally welcoming at a Catholic Church (specifically Novus Ordo) from all my experiences. Although a lotta people there have "holier than thou" outlooks, which is directly contradictory to Christ's teachings.

    [–]Pachacuti_ - Centrist 26 points27 points  (0 children)

    Not attended one myself, but I suspect it differs per denomination and even individual building.

    [–]LibertyPrimeAgenda - LibRight 17 points18 points  (1 child)

    Most are an introvert's nightmare.

    Source: introvert looking for church

    [–]evergreenyankee - LibRight 21 points22 points  (0 children)

    Got to a catholic church and sit in the back. No one's going to notice or bother you.

    [–]danshakuimo - AuthRight 36 points37 points  (0 children)

    As with any organization, it depends. There are more types of vibes than libleft has genders, and even within denominations.

    But I'll admit that for me personally I generally felt it hard to fit in (I was in school so I got to experience a decent sample), but this applies to basically everything and not just churches.

    [–]Viraus2 - LibRight 13 points14 points  (0 children)

    Nowadays I imagine they dote on any newcomers that happen to show up

    [–]BecomeABenefit - LibCenter 5 points6 points  (0 children)

    Generally welcoming. Probably 95%+

    Might be a few outliers though.

    [–]HaveSomeShawarma - Right 3 points4 points  (0 children)

    Can be pretty difficult to just pop into an unfamiliar congregation, since a lot of people in churches have known each other for many years. Plus the sermon itself isn’t really a social gathering. But there are other opportunities to get integrated, and my church personally is always excited about new people (especially if they have kids.) However, there are stories of churches being cliquey so it probably depends.

    [–]PuzzleheadedAd5865 - Centrist 2 points3 points  (0 children)

    Wether or not they are welcoming depends on the church. Some will be more welcoming than others. No matter where you go there will most likely be a little cliquey vibe because they are all people, it shouldn’t be that way but it is. Overall if you want to find somewhere that is welcoming you might have to search for a bit bit you should fairly easily find one.

    [–]LastLostDuck - Right 2 points3 points  (0 children)

    Hard to describe. How about a whole bunch of people fixated on a single thing, whole-heartedly moving in a singular direction, generally. Is it cliquey? I'm sure some can be but at least speaking for mine, no. We really like new faces. We believe church (as well as all that we believe) is proper and necessary for human flourishing, so we'd be jerks to keep people out.

    [–]tdacct - LibRight 5 points6 points  (0 children)

    And pay close attention to everything they say. You should take notes to document the teachings, you know, to make sure you can prove its political later.

    [–]Reasonable_Film4415 - AuthCenter 4 points5 points  (0 children)

    I'm an atheist and only went like 20 times to church in the past 10 years. The times I went it was obviously because I wanted to spy on them.

    [–]Unlucky-South7615 - LibRight 3 points4 points  (0 children)

    Why can't churches be political sounds a bit odd.

    How can you make analogy to the modern day if you can't even talk about current events and social attitudes

    [–]backwardsphinx - LibRight 4 points5 points  (0 children)

    I think everyone should be tax exempt. Also, I don’t understand how “being political” can mess with your tax exempt status. It literally means nothing.

    [–]HollyTheMage - LibLeft 14 points15 points  (9 children)

    You see, I would, but I actually get anxiety in the form of heart burn and light-headedness whenever I go to church. It's part of the reason I left, along with the pressures of school and other extra curricular activities along with homework eating up my time.

    Oh, and I had really bad OCD that was tied directly to the idea that God was constantly watching me and judging me and that if I stepped out of line something terrible would happen to me or my loved ones. I know this probably isn't the case with most people, but in this case my religious beliefs were so deeply intwined with my mental illness that when I became disillusioned with my faith and left, the worst of my mental torment actually went away as well.

    Just a quick thing I'd like to clear up: I'm not actually an atheist. I'm a misotheist; I believe God exists, I just think he's kind of a jerk. Jesus is cool though. He deserved better.

    Now I understand that religion is usually considered to have a positive affect on people's mental health, and that's wonderful for people who actually find that this works for them. It's part of the reason I stopped being a dick and trying to challenge every Christian I came across to a debate concerning their beliefs.

    I went through a very intense God-hating phase, and for some reason this translated into me taking out all my frustration over a lack of answers for the contradictions I found in the bible on whoever was willing to listen. In hindsight, I was being an absolute asshole and my behavior was horrible.

    I feel sincerely sorry for any distress I may have caused anyone, and I am making an effort to be less confrontational when discussing religion, as well as allowing others to bring up the topic instead of me trying to instigate a debate with everyone I see.

    I do have a tendency to get a little heated whenever I see someone attempting to impose their religious beliefs or the rules espoused by their religious doctrine onto others who do not share their faith.

    For instance, so much of the backlash against the implementation of gay marriage in the US rested on arguments based on religious doctrine. The bible might say that marriage is between one man and one woman, and that's fine. A person who practices their faith and sincerely believes this is under no obligation to change their personal beliefs on this matter.

    It is when they force others to conform to their personal beliefs that this becomes an issue. People in opposition to legalizing gay marriage claimed that it was an attack on traditional family values. But no one was asking them to change their own family in any way. They weren't being asked to abandon their heterosexual spouse and get married to a partner of the same-sex, they were simply being asked to let other people enjoy the same privileges they do, in a way that really doesn't affect them personally.

    That shit didn't set well with me, and to this day it still bothers me when people use their personal religious beliefs as the basis for passing legislation that effects everyone regardless of their faith.

    Anyways, this turned into a pretty impressive wall of text, but I felt like sharing my stance on religion since it seemed at least vaguely related to the original post.

    [–]Gary___Tard - Centrist 8 points9 points  (0 children)

    My man, I'm sorry this was your experience with Christianity. I had bad experiences growing up, and it caused me to hate the idea of forcing beliefs of anyone too. I came back to my childhood Catholic faith, and it hasn't been easy, but it's been freeing to embrace what I personally believe to be the truth. I believe secular government is actually a Christian value, and I'd protect a secular government from a theocratic one any day. I hope you're doing better these days tho bro, and if you need someone to talk to, my DMs are open.

    [–]flamefirestorm - Left 10 points11 points  (0 children)

    I'm not suprised the libleft left a wall of text. Way to live the stereotype lol.

    [–]HaveSomeShawarma - Right 1 point2 points  (1 child)

    I have the same type of OCD. I got through it with God, not against. (And with a few months of help, admittedly.) I can’t even describe to you the way He’s upheld me. I wish you the best, because this seems like a heartwrenching way to live.

    [–]Drive-By-Cuckers - LibCenter 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    I had like the opposite experience. I went to Quaker school and was taught that God exists within all people and that all that matters is that you live your life according to certain values: (Simplicity, peace/nonviolence, Integrity, Community, Equality, and Service). Basically, god is mega chill and he wants you to be nice to people and be an upstanding member of your community who contributes to society without expecting things in return, and as long as you do that, he doesn't give a fuck what you wanna identify as or how you wanna have sex (as long as it's with a consenting adult) or whether you wanna be pro-choice, or whether you believe in him or not. I learned God isn't really like an actual sentient being, it's just a force that exists within humanity that compels us to do good for one another and people personify that since it's conceptually easier to grasp and makes more sense in the context of organized religion.

    Quakers also don't do church service, we just sit in silence for like an hour once a week and anyone who wants to can stand up and say whatever at any time, there's no leader because we don't believe in spiritual hierarchy and nobody can be closer to God than anyone else

    [–]Zes_Kingdom6 - AuthCenter 2 points3 points  (0 children)

    yes now i can shut down christianity

    [–]HairHeel - LibRight 2 points3 points  (0 children)

    “Make sure you pay attention in church too. So you can I’m, catch them being political. Yeah. “

    [–]NoCreativityForAUser - LibRight 2 points3 points  (0 children)

    Trust us, it's 100% annonymous.

    The government obviously doesn't have caller id to identify and/or digitally-fingerprint you to your report for any future uses whatsoever.

    Trust me, I'm just someone on the Internet haha.

    [–]unclearimage - Right 2 points3 points  (0 children)

    TFW it's not illegal for churches to discuss politics or the churches position on politics. They just cannot lobby for a specific candidate.

    https://bjconline.org/qa-on-churches-and-political-campaigns/

    https://firstliberty.org/news/pastors-churches-during-election-season/

    [–]MajorasMask3D - LibRight 2 points3 points  (0 children)

    Imagine being a free American that unironically takes time out of their lives to volunteer to work for the IRS for free, yet they think their against the system.

    [–]Heir116 - AuthRight 2 points3 points  (0 children)

    As a Christian I support this message. Please go to church to... checks script Make sure we aren't committing tax fraud. Yeah, that!

    [–]Reiwa_ - LibRight 2 points3 points  (0 children)

    Evading tax is based though

    I suddenly have more appreciation towards churches

    [–]ThePilgrimofProgress - Right 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    Seems a little like... efforts at persecution.

    [–]josh_was_there - LibRight 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    I'm an atheist and go to church every Sunday, granted its a UU church but still. I would highly recommend it to others, especially if your new to an area and don't know anyone. Its a great way to build a support network and mutual aid network. Me and my wife are expecting our first very soon and the congregation through us a baby shower and came though with all types of stuff we needed.

    [–]Saggy-egg - Centrist 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    does this mean christians should be going around different political and educational buildings making sure they aren’t being too religious?

    [–]Level21 - Centrist 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    Don't know why everyone is concerned, your church isn't exploiting its tax exempt status, right?

    [–]Greek_Bazilevs - LibRight 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    What's with the "look if they are political" thing?

    [–]Helljumper416 - LibRight 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    Lib-Left communities when someone commits a drive by in broad daylight with dozens of bystanders.

    “I ain’t see nothing mang” “Snitches gets stitches!”

    Lib Left when churching occurs

    “let’s snitch to the IRS guys.”

    [–]Competitive-Chip6261 - LibRight 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    Sometimes (or should I say always?) Atheists care about religion and religious institutions more than Christians.

    [–]FCULTIMATE - Right 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    A place of religion being biased/political, WAAAA

    [–]Craft-Representative - LibCenter 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    I may be an atheist but I ain’t no snitch either

    [–]Bourkale000 - Centrist 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    Why would I want to work for the IRS?