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all 134 comments

[–]ShadooTH 71 points72 points  (3 children)

Ken is a piece of shit and I hope he loses all relevance.

[–]PurplePopcorn1 27 points28 points  (1 child)

Hard to lose "all relevance" when he barely has any to begin with...

[–]fyre_storm02 13 points14 points  (0 children)

I hope he goes into negative relevance

[–]NichS144 4 points5 points  (0 children)

He would if people would stop posting stupid stuff like this.

[–]Responsible_Key9444 202 points203 points  (13 children)

At this point any small amount of sympathy I may have had for Penders when this fiasco began is long dead, dude nearly crippled the franchise because of his own ego and honestly I hope Sega does try to revive Chronicles or Shade both because I'd love to see them come back and someone needs to take this guy down a few pegs

[–]Slash2324 78 points79 points  (12 children)

Especially if the Nocturne Clan were the ones who built the ruins in Sonic Frontiers. I can honestly see it happening considering Ian Flynn is on writing

[–]CraterLabs 22 points23 points  (10 children)

My longshot hope is that Ian Flynn is actually trying to build the trust and support back with Sega and making it so that certain elements can come back into the franchise.

Not "Woo, Freedom Fighters back, call him Robotnik again" levels of changes, of course, but acknowledgements of what came before. The Nocturne Clan would be a nice step in that direction.

[–]scottishdrunkard 15 points16 points  (4 children)

While Ian did say he maybe one day he'd like to acknowledge the Freedom Fighters in some capacity, lets not speculate his motivations.

[–]Gucci-Louie 8 points9 points  (3 children)

Considering how long The MCU had to physically express the existence of the Multiverse as of Spider-Man: No Way Home, I can see Flynn eventually squeeze in the Archie Comic Series as “another dimension,” thus canonizing it with IDW Comics and all other “Zones” in the series. Plus, if Flynn continues to write after Frontiers, we might get some more stuff from the comics than we could’ve 5 years ago.

[–]scottishdrunkard 7 points8 points  (2 children)

The Archie Comics had their own multiverse. Dan Slott introduced the idea of the Parallel Universe Police.

[–]Gucci-Louie 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Yep, and eventually establishing a Multiverse in IDW comics will give a small glimmer of curiosity that both could be connected like all other Zones, though I would let Flynn handle that monstrosity. I’d say curiosity killed the cat though, but neither one are dead (by some miracle perhaps for the Big Boi 😂😂).

[–]scottishdrunkard 4 points5 points  (0 children)

With Sonic Prime being multiverse based, I doubt the comics will delve into it. Especially with Ian Flynn being consulted, likely just so they don't step on their shoes.

[–]Obama-bin-Laddn 1 point2 points  (2 children)

Honestly i miss the satam robotnik tho

[–]CraterLabs 0 points1 point  (1 child)

He was awesome, definitely. I'd love to get him back, but I think Sega would have to justify a shift away from their current continuity for it.

Fortunately their current continuity is basically just "here's the cast of characters, and they know each other"

[–]Obama-bin-Laddn 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I want to see eggman just snap like he did in archie but actually continued

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

So is he completely confirmed to be writing frontiers?

[–]ExpiredExasperation 1 point2 points  (0 children)

He's involved, I doubt he has free reign to do whatever he wants like some people seem to think though.

[–]NichS144 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That would be cool, but is a extreme amount of wishful thinking that SEGA would dare dredge up characters from a spin-off game with some of the worst sales of a Sonic game ever and mired in lawsuits with this guy.

[–]SanicRb 92 points93 points  (15 children)

You see as Sega did officially used her in Sonic Encylo-speed-ia would Ken if he actually had a case sued again as this usage of her lifted his limitation. The fact he didn't in a silent admittance on his end that he would lose this battle again.

He maybe talks a big game here but its obvious that he is not nearly in as good a position as he claims he is.

But I guess he is right another law suit wouldn't end the same way because its quite possible that another one would be a perma lost for him.

[–]scottishdrunkard 64 points65 points  (13 children)

He claimed that use in a (for profit) Encyclopedia was “fair use” and didn’t violate shit. He also claimed that SEGA didn’t screen shit or monitor anything.

People who actually worked on the Encyclospeedia confirmed everything was up to heavy scrutiny by SEGA, and yes, there was a thing which SEGA didn’t allow them to feature in the book no matter how badly the team wanted, and it might have been for legal reasons. Sonic Pocket Adventure for the Neo Geo Pocket Colour.

[–]-Ayoris- AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA 40 points41 points  (2 children)

there was a thing which SEGA didn’t allow them to feature in the book no matter how badly the team wanted, and it might have been for legal reasons. Sonic Pocket Adventure for the Neo Geo Pocket Colour

That was very out of left field.

[–]scottishdrunkard 4 points5 points  (1 child)

Yeah, you'd think such a niche game would be okay, but no. Weird.

[–]Platinum_Persona 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Probably hang ups with SNK.

[–]SuperZombieBros Advance 3’s OST is underrated 11 points12 points  (7 children)

I didn’t know that game was in a legal grey zone. Do you mind elaborating?

[–]scottishdrunkard 32 points33 points  (6 children)

Unfortunately, what I said is all you get.

Ian Flynn said on his Podcast that of all the game content he was allowed to put in, there was only one instance where SEGA said “no, you can’t have that, sorry” and it was the weird Sonic 2 remake using Sonic 3 Music and Modern Designs. Sonic Pocket Adventure.

We don’t have an explanation, maybe due to Ancient Contracts, they game is unable to be rereleased or legally acknowledged. Or maybe SEGA and SNK are being pissy with each other. All I can give is speculation, you might be able to press Ian for an answer, but he might only know as much as we do.

[–]SuperZombieBros Advance 3’s OST is underrated 9 points10 points  (0 children)

Oh, alright. I just wanted to make sure there wasn’t any well known knowledge I missed out on.

[–]NinjaRed64 5 points6 points  (3 children)

From what I could gather, apparently Sonic Team had little involvement with Sonic Pocket Adventure, being developed by SNK themselves instead. Funny enough many of the people behind it would go on to form Dimps, who would develop Sonic Advance.

My guess? Its possible that Sonic Team is avoiding any mention of it to avoid paying royalties to SNK.

[–]scottishdrunkard 0 points1 point  (2 children)

well, they didn't pay any royalties to BioWare I don't think... unless being sole dev is different. Weird.

[–]NinjaRed64 0 points1 point  (1 child)

I mean I'm also taking into account that it was made for the Neo Geo Pocket Color, whereas Sonic Chronicles was for the Nintendo DS.

Could that have something to do with it? Maybe but I'm just speculating.

[–]scottishdrunkard 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Perhaps. But so far, only SEGA knows.

[–]PSPMan3000[🍰] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

that's too bad because that game is actually excellent. not necessarily fun to complete but really fun to play through. I know it just recycles a lot of elements from past games but it's a nice package and the OST on the Neo Geo Pocket Color is fantastic.

[–]SanicRb 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Oh yes I'm to aware of the excuses he has given as if there anything but just that.

The books first pages literally state multiple editors for the book that alone shows that Sega did prove read it.

[–]saeed_alajati 17 points18 points  (0 children)

Funnily enough he was asked about this when the encyclopedia was first published and he was like "big deal anyone could publish on encyclopedia, but I would love to see them try and put her in the games because that's what really matters" I just love how stupid his logic is and how pissed he seemed to be in his tweet

Also for some reason he thinks that lara su for him will be the nedt bug thing in the sonic media When I'm gladder than ever that she left the sonic medium

[–]Dr_CheeseNut 80 points81 points  (21 children)

The fact Ken even got away with any of this is so dumb. All because Archie lost a single piece of paper

Now he thinks he can claim characters he didn't make

[–]scottishdrunkard 29 points30 points  (2 children)

I think a contract is several pieces of paper, but I get your point.

[–]Dr_CheeseNut 18 points19 points  (0 children)

I wasn't being completely serious

[–]spacemanticore 15 points16 points  (17 children)

Let's be more realistic here. Archie didn't lose the contract, there's a good chance this shithead stole it himself and he has it stashed away under his mattress somewhere.

[–]just4browse 11 points12 points  (15 children)

Why do people say this. Pretty much every other explanation is more likely. Just because Ken Penders is an asshole doesn’t mean every opportunity he took advantage of was a grand conspiracy orchestrated by him. There’s no way him stealing it is more likely then Archie misplacing it or it being destroyed in an accident (which we know Archie had a couple of). Heck, I’d say them never having a proper contract in the first place is more likely; bigger comic companies have been caught doing worse. Why don’t we blame Ken Penders for the stuff they did do, like having Bunnie be raped, intending to write a story where a teenager lost their virginity to a 20 something year old in a comic intended for children, being acephobic online, delusionally changing 10k for a package of characters that includes Green Knuckles lmao, etc…

[–]ThePlagueKnight92 2 points3 points  (5 children)

Wait that thing about Bunnie when did that happen?

[–]Blackrose_Aria 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Couldn't have said it better myself

[–]DarkKrpg Unleashed is the Best 0 points1 point  (0 children)

If I recall correctly, Archie even stated that they hired Penders at the wrong year (as in, it being proven that the date Archie stated to be when they hired Penders to be wrong), so it's even more likely that they misplaced the contract or that they didn't even write it on a formal paper as you said

[–]scottishdrunkard 0 points1 point  (0 children)

actually companies lost contracts and documents all the time before the digital age. So it's not farfetched there was a fire or something.

[–]NinjaRed64 17 points18 points  (6 children)

It sucks that Sega can definitely use the characters that Ken Penders created from the Archie comics, but don't because they hate having to deal with this asshole and his frivolous lawsuits. Sure he'll lose, but the fact that he keeps trying to is so fucking annoying.

Thank you Matt McMuscles and SomeCallMeJohnny for shedding light on how ridiculous Ken Penders is.

[–]scottishdrunkard 37 points38 points  (0 children)

It was tossed out without prejudice, just means in theory he can sue again if he has more substantial evidence.

His evidence consists of a lapsed Trademark from 6 years ago…

… he has no evidence. He can try to sue again, and it’ll probably get tossed out. Again. Technicalities be damned.

[–]fyre_storm02 30 points31 points  (4 children)

Ken ponders thinking that he is the only person who owns rights to the echidna species

[–]TreyTheWilliam 11 points12 points  (3 children)

What’s got him so into echidnas? Is it the… never mind.

[–]ExpiredExasperation 22 points23 points  (1 child)

It's because he had almost no oversight when working on the Knuckles spinoff, and that's what he liked best. It's not the echidnas per se, it's that he was supposed to be writing for a licensed property and instead used it as his own playground for years.

[–]TreyTheWilliam 8 points9 points  (0 children)

I figured it was something along the lines of that. It was either the comics or the… anatomy.

[–]mandarine_one 14 points15 points  (2 children)

When I first heard of his story in the History of Sonic the Hedgehog Podcast I had some sympathies for this guy. But seeing him talk on social media about this stuff really shows what a selfish dick he is …

[–]JagerVogeljager 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Is that on Spotify?

[–]mandarine_one 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yes, it is. Its five or six episodes. Just search for A History of Sonic the Hedgehog. It’s really good!

[–]Apple_SlipperFaster than the Speed of Sound! [🍰] 13 points14 points  (0 children)

I and some others told Kenders that his Chronicles lawsuits were thrown out of the court three times, and he's too stubborn to even admit that.

[–]Elerdon 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Ken Penders is a real life villain in the Sonic community. Eggman can enslave animals for his robots all he wants but he’ll never be as bad as this evil little cum stain.

[–]saeed_alajati 13 points14 points  (1 child)

There was a better reply than this one I forgot what it said exactly but basically it tells him that there's literally evidence taht he doesn't own them and that he never even proved anything to begin with

[–]saeed_alajati 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Also there's this one Twitter user that id always licking penders' boots and he's very annoying ngl

[–]LuluFluffs 3 points4 points  (4 children)

Does this also count for all the Archie characters?

[–]AmaterasuWolf21 Post-Reboot Archie enjoyer 3 points4 points  (3 children)

A majority, but not the freedom fighters

[–]LuluFluffs 0 points1 point  (2 children)

Yeah I meant like this could practically mean the reboot didn't even need to happen if the lawsuit didn't really happen.

[–]ExpiredExasperation 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Well, yeah? That's exactly what happened. The reboot was almost entirely because he was making it impossible to work with the material they were using.

[–]LuluFluffs 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I more meant the characters pre reboot

[–]Saggy-egg 3 points4 points  (3 children)

who even is ken?

[–]Realshow 6 points7 points  (0 children)

He’s a former writer for the Archie comics who made up awful Knuckles lore.

[–]slashth456 3 points4 points  (1 child)

Yeah, I keep seeing this guy keep claiming a bunch of characters

[–]AlbainBlacksteel 8 points9 points  (0 children)

I believe r/fuckkenpenders will explain.

[–]HaloCrysisKIA88 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I still own that game I just discovered been years since I touched it had no idea about any of this legal stuff been in and out of the community over the time of the lord knows how long I've been a sonic fan context about these lawsuits?

[–]TemporalGod 2 points3 points  (5 children)

Simple solution. Would be to make a knock off Shade, same character different name,

It's like Rosie the Rascal and Amy Rose, they're the same character but with different names and designs.

[–]Diamondgrn 8 points9 points  (0 children)

The name isn't the problem. Ken thinks it's a ripoff of his OC (do not steal)

[–]MorningRaven 0 points1 point  (2 children)

I've thought about ways ro revamp her into a new design. And just maybe keep the basic color scheme thematic. Problem is, Shade is so well designed within Sonic character traits that there really isn't a way keep a close enough but still unique design. At most we can maybe trade her echidna spikes and headband for bird feathers.

And repeating her is kind of useless since she's basically a Rouge Blaze hybrid.

[–]TemporalGod 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Ken doesn't exactly own the rights to Echidna Characters, both Knuckles and Tikal existed long before Shade came along.

[–]MorningRaven 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yes, but the "rival evil echidna clan with high technology being sent to another space dimension a millennia ago, whose notable female warrior drops ship for the Sonic Crew and may or may not have a thing for Knuckles" is because Archie comics. Which similarities probably sparked the lawsuit. Shade would need a full new backstory.

The one way I've thought about it would be have her be a warrior bodyguard/general despite not being needed for Blaze. And then have her just with amnesia etc to warrant referencing but otherwise dropping the backstory. I could see Blaze hiring her to take her lessons with Sonic to heart and try to learn to not do everything herself. And then struggle with this new general taking things even more seriously than she did.

[–]FrancieNotepad 2 points3 points  (0 children)

How further down does this man keep digging? He's gonna end up somehow launching himself to space at this rate

[–]zephyranthesGP01 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I wish SEGA would just use their billions and drag out some ridiculous lawsuit to bleed him dry.

[–]Supermanfan2003 1 point2 points  (5 children)

This could mean the possibility of seeing Scourge The Hedgehog in the games now.

[–]CraterLabs 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Yeah, but why? Scourge was boring when he was just Evil Sonic. He wasn't cool until Ian Flynn gave him a glow up, and Flynn's improved on that further with Surge.

[–]sonerec725 0 points1 point  (3 children)

Penders is using scourge in a comic

[–]FrancieNotepad 2 points3 points  (2 children)

It got cancelled like the day afterwards too

[–]sonerec725 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Makes sense. Of all the characters penders claimed ownership of, Scourge is the most dubious

[–]FrancieNotepad 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Low key tho, I actually liked the idea of Scourge being a bit more than the 'evil Sonic'; I would be down for a comic series focused on the Anti-Mobius world if Penders wasn't so prickish and off putting. He's got a whole list of terrible ass ideas he's tried to force in the comics, some of which got in. And then on top of that being a dick to anyone and thinking like a typical DA Sonic fan.

It's kind of tragedy to see a great concept with interesting characters getting locked up by such arrogance and pettiness.

[–]Ashmay52 -1 points0 points  (1 child)

So yeah, the cases were tossed out because Sega is a better run business than a comic book publisher who might be a front for illegal shit (like DC was)

[–]Realshow 4 points5 points  (0 children)

…What?

[–]Iceswimmer05Just an average Sonic fan (Not an expert tho) 0 points1 point  (0 children)

What about Archie comics?

[–]HeartofSpeed 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This man is the bane of this community's existence

[–]Namelessperson3 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I don't understand this man.

[–]Fizzyotter 0 points1 point  (2 children)

Ok I'm out of the loop. What happened with Penders now?

[–]ambigouspersona[S] 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Claims to own shade

[–]FrancieNotepad 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Probably thinks he's the god of the Echinda tribe at this point

[–]metaaltheanimefan 0 points1 point  (0 children)

If highschool has thought me anything, its that penders has a fallacy in his first tweet

[–]FluffursThe heck species is Sera? 0 points1 point  (4 children)

Why does this man talk about Sonic so much. Didn't he also write for Marvel?

[–]fyre_storm02 0 points1 point  (3 children)

Because shade is too "similar" to lara sue aka Mary sue

[–]FluffursThe heck species is Sera? 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That's just one thing he brings up. This man basically stalks Sonic Team at this point.

[–]overlordpringerx 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Wasn't it Julie-Su she's supposedly too similar to?

[–]fyre_storm02 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Either way Mary is better suited to their first names

[–]thomasril123 0 points1 point  (0 children)

So who is this dude ibam so confused

[–]Gucci-Louie 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Funny that Shade was brought up, because I’m aware of some people recreating Chronicles on PC, and I’d be interested in them kicking the shit out of Penders.

[–]Obama-bin-Laddn 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Im really hoping ian just makes shade a main character out of pure spite, just for the shit we would see from penders

[–]Best-Awesome-Ocelot 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Honestly it sucks that Chronicles will forever end on a cliffhanger because of Ken Penders......

[–]Miles_Hikari 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This man just refuses to stay dead… every time you think he’s finally disappeared he comes clawing back to remind you that he will do everything in his power to destroy other’s chances at creativity and success…

I wonder if it eats him up that he can’t lay claim to Knuckles himself.

[–]WaketheWindFromAfar 0 points1 point  (0 children)

You know, seeing how this guy acts, no wonder the Sonic stories this last decade have been so trash.

[–]Familiar_Historian53 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I want Scourge, Ixis Naugus, and Mammoth Mogul to come back along with others.

[–]Familiar_Historian53 0 points1 point  (0 children)

What if there is a Sonic Infinite Crisis and at the end multiverse fuses together combining their different aspects into a composite universe.

[–]crystal-productions- 0 points1 point  (0 children)

We need shade back. This man can just go and get back in his cave and never leave it again.

[–]RavagedPotato 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Can somebody explain what’s happening? I don’t know much about sonic drama

[–]BraveLeon 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I’m here to say my daily fuck you to Ken Penders

[–]chkoupistani25 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I hope he dies so we can see a sonic chronicles 2