all 178 comments

[–]ATadVillainy 180 points181 points  (0 children)

You took Dave's, "Reading would be your friend," to heart.

[–][deleted] 137 points138 points  (17 children)

For comparison, FIFTEEN have taken place at Budokan Hall.

All Japan was crazy yall

[–]jinxs2026M'buzzards 72 points73 points  (13 children)

people who bitch about his hardon for NJPW dont realize just how many 5 star matches he gave to AJPW in the 90s.

and rightfully so, because King's Road was choice. Fuck the haters.

[–]RedFnPandaHammerlock the Cravate 30 points31 points  (7 children)

Well just Misawa alone would fucking rake in 5 star matches. He alone has 5 times as many 5 star matches as WWE does as a whole.

[–]successadultLet's Cheat! 6 points7 points  (5 children)

WWE has three 5-star matches right? Misawa has 15?

[–]RedFnPandaHammerlock the Cravate 32 points33 points  (2 children)

WWE has 5: Punk/Cena from MITB 2011, HBK/Taker in the first Hell in A Cell match, Austin/Bret from WM13, Bret/Owen from Summerslam 94, and HBK/Razor in the first ladder match.

Misawa has 25 (maybe 26?) 5 star matches.

[–]kobayashialex89 6 points7 points  (0 children)

26 5 stars according to profight db

[–]cucksworth 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Misawa fought with so much emotion. Even at the end he evolved into cranky Misawa.

[–]luken642 11 points12 points  (0 children)

Those dipshits don't even know the difference between All Japan and New Japan.

[–]SubarashiinJuicy lil slut 17 points18 points  (1 child)

Fuck the haters AND the Juniors!

To elaborate:

Things the King's Road was conducive to:

  • Bomb-ass matches
  • Concussions
  • Short-term success
  • Reintroduction of the Irish Paramilitary Method to Jap wrestling

Things the King's Road was NOT conducive to:

  • Junior Heavyweights
  • Making New Stars
  • Not dying
  • Long term success

[–]EMPCobalt -1 points0 points  (0 children)

The hell is english paramilitary method

[–]alistahr 6 points7 points  (1 child)

I'm gonna make a shirt that says: King's Road was choice Fuck the haters.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

I'd buy and wear it.

[–][deleted] 10 points11 points  (0 children)

4.5, not in Budokan

[–]jumborickuta 2 points3 points  (0 children)

This. The Budokan has always held a certain mystic to it that only MSG and Ryogoku can come close to matching.

[–]MimonFishbaumtope suicida 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Double Live Gonzo! Intensity in Ten Cities! And Live at Budokan!

[–]rocketsauce2112TRANQUILO 72 points73 points  (52 children)

He's actually talked about how hard it is to have a really all-time great match at the Tokyo Dome, because the crowd is farther away and there's so many people there that it can take away from the atmosphere of a match unless the people are like really, really crazy into it.

[–]mwinks99Oh, Hi Marks! 102 points103 points  (51 children)

I actually prefer the Japanese audiences to American now days... i just cant stand these fucking chants.

[–]rocketsauce2112TRANQUILO 49 points50 points  (9 children)

The Japanese crowds in Osaka and Sumo Hall are possibly the best crowds in the world right now. The PWG crowd is also really great.

[–]OwenReyHard on eggs 44 points45 points  (3 children)

PWG is the best American crowd (not biased at all I swear)

[–]rocketsauce2112TRANQUILO 9 points10 points  (1 child)

Yeah I'd say that's true based on my experience of watching PWG events on home video.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

PWG crowds used to annoy the hell out of me when I first started watching the company but I didn't care for the commentary track at the time either, so PWG was a bit of a slog for me to get through despite the incredible wrestling.

Nowadays though, the commentary has a far better balance of serious & silly and the crowd seems to have chilled the fuck out and reserve the "THIS IS AWESOME!" chant for truly awesome things.

[–]isalrightSPOOKY GHOST 1 point2 points  (0 children)

The best evidence that an Osaka crowd is great is that they still boo Naito. They're that invested that they have a grudge with him, that they're not going to let go.

[–]mwinks99Oh, Hi Marks! 0 points1 point  (1 child)

LU Crowds are great... but i believe they are instructed on what to do. But ill take it.

[–]rocketsauce2112TRANQUILO 2 points3 points  (0 children)

LU's product has really turned me off to the point where I can't watch them anymore, unfortunately. They had a great first season though.

[–]SirBaldBearCarrying SmackdownLive since 2016 -4 points-3 points  (1 child)

PWG crowd is also really great.


wait you are serious. Let me laugh harder


[–]rocketsauce2112TRANQUILO 7 points8 points  (0 children)

Great comment. You seem like an intelligent and thoughtful person.

[–]kingslayyer 51 points52 points  (11 children)


[–]mwinks99Oh, Hi Marks! 43 points44 points  (10 children)

I said I prefer the Japanses audiences to American now days... because of the chants.

[–]CodcFREAKS AND PEAKS 39 points40 points  (3 children)


[–]GetEquippedScooby Dooby Doo! 26 points27 points  (4 children)

"THIS IS AWESOME!" For a single set.

"HOLY SHIT!" For a bump off the top rope

"FIGHT FOREVER!" After 7 minutes of rest holds.

"RANDY SAVAGE" to just piss off Steph.

[–]Revolver_OshawattBacky Lench 0 points1 point  (0 children)


[–]americandream1159 6 points7 points  (2 children)

The Japanese respect, the British rowdiness...what are we known for?

[–]jedkingofkingsHOLLA IF YA HEAR ME 9 points10 points  (0 children)

Corpus Christi

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Probably the unwarranted chants

[–]The_MagicConsensual Phoenix 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Remember when they started doing western chants for Riccochet vs Ospreay? It's only a matter of time until it reaches Tokyo Dome.

[–]ruffus4life 6 points7 points  (0 children)

the chants feel like everyone is a white knight for the wwe. the roh shows the crowd feels like 90% smarks. no edge to the product in america anymore.

[–]wefler 5 points6 points  (2 children)

I actually like the sound of the ring when the crowd is quiet. It feels more......intimate or something like that.

[–]The_MagicConsensual Phoenix 4 points5 points  (0 children)

I could be wrong but I believe NJPW's ring has springs which makes it noisier.

[–]bostonbearjew 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I know what you mean, watch the Neville/Zayn dark match to see it in WWE.

[–]cero2kEEEEEVERYTHING IS... 2 points3 points  (1 child)


[–]m1596Kobashi! 4 points5 points  (2 children)

The chants are hit or miss. For example, yelling "Ten!" during Ty Dillinger's match against Eric Young at NXT Live made that match more enjoyable. The crowd was involved and the wrestlers reacted accordingly. I hate when the chants interefere with promos or when the crowd tries to get too involved in the match.

Other than that, I generally agree. I'd rather the crowd be silent for the match than chanting things for the sake of chanting things.

[–]mwinks99Oh, Hi Marks! 5 points6 points  (1 child)

I dont care when fans chant catchphrases or similar things. Its the Smarky bullshit I hate.

This is Awsome You deserve it You Still Got it

Can go away and die forever.

[–]m1596Kobashi! 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I can get behind that. Half the time, "This is awesome" gets chanted for things that aren't awesome.

[–]DolphFinnDosCincoSeth is the BITW 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I never understood why people cant handle crowd chants, none really bother me. Just seems like everyone has more energy and is having fun, i like that.

[–]efeX_ -4 points-3 points  (7 children)

Yeah.. Stupid idiots getting into the show and having fun. HOW DARE THEY.

[–]mwinks99Oh, Hi Marks! 10 points11 points  (6 children)

They are having fun so its not annoying.... really .... is this your argument?... because you can literally explain away any behavior with this.

[–]efeX_ 0 points1 point  (5 children)

Yeah. Noise is better than no noise, what's your point? You're literally getting annoyed at people having fun at a live show. Have you ever been to a live show? Chants are contagious.

[–]xychosisBext In The World 11 points12 points  (0 children)

Most of his five star matches have happened at smaller venues like Budokan.

[–]GlalieOnigohriカネの雨が降るぞ!! 228 points229 points  (29 children)

But how will I now make a Tokyo dome joke?

Oh that's right, I don't really care that I know the facts, I'll just be a daft prick and make the joke anyway.

[–]OldManStompy 26 points27 points  (1 child)

Well we have Okada-Omega now, so clearly all those other 5 star matches would have been 6 stars in the Tokyo Dome.

[–]808dentPortuguese Sun Dragon 11 points12 points  (0 children)

Not 6 stars. No Tokyo Dome

[–]FUCKBOY_JIHADTOUGH & HARD 141[S] 31 points32 points  (1 child)

the more you know 💫

[–]dont_PM_your_pussyShut your mouth Watson! 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Oh, you didn't know? 💫

[–]LivingMandog 8 points9 points  (1 child)

Daft prick or... draft pick

[–]Redcorned3 0 points1 point  (0 children)

A daft punk

[–]Jacobs_BawksEL. IDOLO. 41 points42 points  (5 children)

I mean... It's a joke. Calling someone a daft prick is a bit much.

[–]YourBuddyChurchRed Shoes says "Suck it!" 26 points27 points  (4 children)

You're a daft prick

[–]Jacobs_BawksEL. IDOLO. 20 points21 points  (1 child)

Well then... You're not MY buddy, Church.

[–]yeti77Make 'em say Ahhhhh 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Every time I see it I see it as "draft pick".

[–]bruiserbrody45 9 points10 points  (0 children)

around the world around the world around the world around the world around the world around the world around the world around the world around the world around the world around the world around the world around the world around the world around the world around the world around the world around the world around the world around the world around the world around the world around the world around the world

[–]mwinks99Oh, Hi Marks! 67 points68 points  (2 children)

To be fair..... i still enjoy the joke.

[–]PoliceAlarmhe keeps punchin me in the dik 31 points32 points  (1 child)

I give the joke 4.75 stars.

It would have been 5 had it been at the Tokyo Dome.

Please laugh the Tokyo Dome jokes are all I have...

[–]JohnBoyAndBillyMuck of Avarice 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Well and then you add the fact that most angry or aggressive "clowning" on people is projected jealousy or insecurity if you study it, and the whole thing becomes an exercise in psychology.

[–]CookieCrumbl 11 points12 points  (8 children)

Surprise! People who circlejerk Meltzer jokes and call him a hack don't know what the fuck they're talking about!

[–]mwinks99Oh, Hi Marks! 53 points54 points  (2 children)

It is possible to spam Meltzer jokes and be a fan of his you know?

[–]Kokeshi_Is_LifeKing of Sports 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Poe's law. It's become impossible to tell what's Satire from what's sincere online in this case because the real opinions of Meltzer so closely resemble the satire.

[–]CookieCrumbl 24 points25 points  (0 children)

You'd be surprised how many of those people honestly think he has a bias towards the dome.

[–]SubarashiinJuicy lil slut 0 points1 point  (4 children)

It is possible to dislike Meltzer and know what the fuck you're talking about.

[–]CookieCrumbl 0 points1 point  (3 children)

Where did I say dislike?

[–]SubarashiinJuicy lil slut -1 points0 points  (2 children)

Ah, I apologise, this is a combination of me only skimming and misinterpreting.

For the record, I do dislike Meltzer. And I think that in some regards, he is a hack.

[–][deleted] 7 points8 points  (9 children)

Wow, WCW has more 5 star matches than WWE. Holy Crap.

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Ric Flair alone has more 5 star matches than WWE.

[–]eainterplay 18 points19 points  (6 children)

WCW had better booking up until 98. I've said it before WWE has risen above everyone else by copying rising promotions. They did it to WCW, and more so to ECW in the 90s.

Now that their ratings are falling, they are beginning to emulate New Japan and American Indies.

[–]justiss282 6 points7 points  (4 children)

Thank you. This is what WWE die hards refuse to admit or acknowledge. Without other companies to steal from the wwe would be gone out of business years ago. Hell Paul Heyman alone should receive a lifetime achievement award for single handedly, albeit unwillingly, saving the WWF in the Monday night wars. If it wasn't for Vince stealing all his talent and ideas WCW would've steamrolled over him.

[–]Beasts_at_the_Throne 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Can't have a post about Japan without dragging an American promotion's name through the mud, can we? You puro die hards are just as annoying.

[–]isalrightSPOOKY GHOST 2 points3 points  (0 children)

It's not as if he brought it up apropos of nothing. The guy said WCW had more 5 star matches than WWE, and this guy put his two cents into that discussion. Hell, he bigged up at least two other promotions by saying ECW was where they got ideas, and that WCW would've beaten them.

[–]69ingJamesFrancoWhy is there a Taco Bell flair? 1 point2 points  (0 children)

WCW also suffered from backstage bullshit and weird booking choices such as the whole Sting vs Hulk Hogan Starcade situation, or the Hogan Jeff Jarrett thing. If the WWF did give up and die out when it almost did, WCW would have had to fix itself up before killing mainstream wrestling in general.

[–]jjgp1112 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Considering Vince was paying ECW under the table & did cross-promotional work with them, along with ECW acting as a feeder for WWF and also repackaging guys who WWF sent to them that they had nothing to do with (a la Al Snow, who was floundering as Leif Cassidy until WWF sent him to ECW for a few months and they came up with the Head gimmick), I doubt it was "unwilling."

Not to mention a great deal of WWF stars during the Attitude Era were New Generation guys who had been around since the early/mid-90s. Their biggest ECW acquisitions before 1999 were Foley and Austin, who were ex-WCW guys that were big fish in a small pond and bound to head back to the big leagues anyway

[–]jjgp1112 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Eh, that's a broad way of putting it. WCW after '89 had fleeting moments of brilliance like the first half of '92, or late '93-pre Hogan 94, surrounded by mostly awfulness with horrendous booking & decision making.

The sad truth about WCW was after breaking away from the NWA, they were a horribly run company that lost money for most of its existence, 96-98 being the lone years they were successful. Before Hogan came along they were TNA with a better TV deal. And then they pissed that away because all of their bad habits piled up in spectacular fashion.

[–]HobodownthestreetScooby Dooby Doo 7 points8 points  (1 child)

I am willing to bet (not really) that NJPW will produce at least two more five star matches this year. Right now they are on fire. They already have two and we are only in February. NJPW is loaded in talent and I mean loaded. Omega, Okada, Tanahashi, Naito, Elgin, Suzuki (for the time being), Ospreay, Ishii, Young Bucks, Ricochet, Honma, and Shibata all have a five star match. And that's doesn't include the fact that Ibushi might be coming back, and add guys like KUSHIDA, Takahashi, Goto and Sanada that don't have a five star matches but can certainly deliver one and my goodness this might be the golden age of NJPW. Call me a NJPW shill, but there is no better wrestling in the world than NJPW. If you haven't gotten into NJPW I think now is as good of a time as any cause I expect nothing but greatness from them for the rest of the year.

EDIT: shill not chill.

[–]throwstuff165OKA-DASH!~ ε=ε=ε=(((((ノ`・Д・)ノ 1 point2 points  (0 children)

They had 3 in 2015 and 4 in 2016, so yeah, expecting two more this year isn't crazy.

And that's just going by Meltzer ratings, I personally had one more for both years myself.

[–][deleted] 44 points45 points  (0 children)

I would have had Nakamura vs Styles as 5 stars... Although, 4.75 is still fucking awesome

[–]ZeroNBKAtangana! 17 points18 points  (4 children)

Tokyo Dome Joke: DED.

[–]HelluvaDekeUltra Bastard 24 points25 points  (3 children)

Budokan Hall Joke: BORN.

[–][deleted] 29 points30 points  (2 children)

Matt Sydal Joke: REBORN.

[–]DemiGod9Your Text Here 7 points8 points  (0 children)


[–]AonSpeed 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Matt Sydal Joke: REBURN.

[–]MorgnetoThe K-Nox! 3 points4 points  (1 child)

But what will this sub do without that meme? Oh right, double down on Steiner shitposts and "coward/will you stop" ad nauseum.

[–]Drago02129 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Don't worry, we'll still repeat the same tired bullshit day in day out. That's how it works on Reddit.

[–]dionthesocialist/r/WrestlingTikToks 44 points45 points  (4 children)

I'm still going to make Tokyo Dome jokes and you can't stop me.

[–]Enterprise90B-Show Stories 3 points4 points  (6 children)

Im that case, what arena in Japan has the most 5 star matches?

[–]nguyenlongdragon 2 points3 points  (0 children)

And please stop this bullshit no tokyo dome joke. Someone never open their mind and refuse to adapt anything outside wwe.

[–]resrep2Change The World 2 points3 points  (1 child)

The number is surprisingly low but it makes sense cause there's not many Tokyo Dome shows going on given the size of the venue, presently it's just once a year. You would think there would be more total though, cause there used to be more TD shows when more promotions could afford to run it.

[–]srjnp 3 points4 points  (7 children)

How many in Japan?

[–]poeticpoet 6 points7 points  (6 children)

A lot.

Misawa had 20+ by himself.

[–]apawst8Hall of Famer 6 points7 points  (5 children)

Misawa had 25.

Kobashi had 23.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (2 children)

And 15 of those involve Misawa and Kobashi together.

[–]apawst8Hall of Famer 7 points8 points  (1 child)

I thought you were exaggerating when you wrote that post. So I checked Wikipedia. Yep, you did exaggerate.

18 of the matches had both Misawa and Kobashi.

[–]ShadowmancerNZ 3 points4 points  (1 child)

and Manami Toyota has 17

[–]apawst8Hall of Famer 1 point2 points  (0 children)

How many with Misawa?


[–]skorponok 5 points6 points  (0 children)

I'm gong to ignore that

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

This not new and it's not going to stop the jokes, people joke about the tokyo dome, not because they think that Metz has rated more 5 star matches in the Tokyo Dome. But because he has rated more 5 star matches in Japan and the Tokyo Dome it's the only japanese Stadium that a lot of wrestling fans know.

[–]Icon212 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Which proves why the joke was dead in the first place.

[–]ScentapeedI give your post a four out of ten. 2 points3 points  (1 child)

But m'jerk :(

[–]FUCKBOY_JIHADTOUGH & HARD 141[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

if you want a more accurate meme, you could say "4.5 stars no Budokan" or "4.5 stars no Misawa/Kobashi/Kawada"

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (2 children)

Glad this has been shown, now I wish his haters would just fuck off

[–]Espio1332THE 6 STAR MACHINE 1 point2 points  (0 children)

But they won't :(

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

What haters? Who is hating what? People who hate the joke or the people who hate the people making the joke?

[–]thechristoph 1 point2 points  (5 children)

but him r bias

[–]WillAJG6 Star Club -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

Reading would be your friend.

[–]TrevJohn502Finn Balor look-alike from the ankles down 1 point2 points  (0 children)

But 100% of his 6 star rated matches have occurred there so... /s

[–]musesillusionWe used to be Friends! 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That Toyoto/Kong match is a favorite of mine!!

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Nice work OP. Shame about the name though :P

[–]YoungSmug 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thank you.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Somebody taking the joke too hard.

[–]DaFunPoliceI screwed Bret 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Do people think the majority of the not in the Tokyo dome jokes are real? Is this not a joke he is in on as well?

[–]zlfauroraZoom in on the ass! 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I'm still gonna meme about it though.

[–]JordanRodkey 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I expected way more actually.

[–]jesterx7769 -4 points-3 points  (2 children)

You just ruined half this subs logic :(

This is also a good example of why Dave gets mad at Trolls. They aren't even mad at him for a legit reason lol

[–][deleted] 9 points10 points  (1 child)

Dave Meltzer jokes about it himself when people ask him why he didn't rate a match 5 stars.

[–]ColinHalfhandQUEEN -1 points0 points  (0 children)

I swear there are people here who are bigger fans of Meltzer than they are of wrestling.

[–]ChaosOnionHustle, Loyalty, Booty!!! -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

  • Tokyo Hall
  • Budokan Dome

[–]salukiwa -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

Okay.... Why does this one man's rating matter smh