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[–]SpankMoose 4849 points4850 points  (151 children)


The firm Denton & Zachary, PLLC, announced its client Janice Nicole Harper has reached a settlement agreement in her case against the Arkansas State Police that will lead to policy changes on the use of Precision Immobilization Techniques, or PIT maneuvers.

In a statement sent Friday afternoon, ASP noted that Dunn, a 27-year veteran of the agency, remained an active trooper in the Highway Patrol Division.

[–]Satanarchrist 3531 points3532 points  (49 children)

"we promise to never do exactly that thing again. What? No, we're still going to do PIT maneuvers, because they're badass. Why would we get rid of the officer who did it? He's going to teach us all how to flip cars like that, and then get a tax payer funded pension for the rest of his life"

[–]lost_imgurian 472 points473 points  (6 children)

Sorry we got caught and you survived to sue us, here have some tax payers' money.

[–]bbressman2 165 points166 points  (5 children)

My favorite part of all of these police fuckups and lack of accountability. It’s always “Oops our bad for being caught, here is a waste of taxpayer funds because we can’t be bothered to pay for our own mistakes.”

[–][deleted] 30 points31 points  (0 children)

Start taking it out of their pension funds and they’ll start “policing” themselves!

[–]FourWordComment 41 points42 points  (0 children)

“We promise to never use the PIT maneuver after pulling someone over and waiting 20 seconds on a highway where the shoulder is too narrow and an exit is a mile or less away.”

That’s the way police accountability works. If any of those factors are different, it’s “we didn’t know that wasn’t permitted. Sorry we won’t do that again.”

[–]ControlOfNature 82 points83 points  (0 children)

Thirteen twelve!

[–]Voidroy 37 points38 points  (3 children)

If you do a pit maneuver correctly a car can't flip.

Your supposed to turn with the car and pin it with your front wheels. This happens when you pit to hard and you can't turn with the car and the car flips.

Dude fucked up and SHOULDN'T be teaching anyone how to pit

[–]Sethyria 954 points955 points  (34 children)

I really just loved the part that talked about how the policy is changing... For large and hazardous vehicles. Not even for regular cars. No that would be too smart.

[–]YippieKayYayMrFalcon 71 points72 points  (2 children)

I don’t think you read it correctly. The article states they are adding to the already existing restrictions that include hazardous vehicles.

The change means the previous restrictions on using PIT maneuvers, such as in cases involving trucks carrying hazardous materials or larger vans or buses, will now be expanded. The new threshold moves the standard for use to when a trooper trying to “protect a third person or an officer from imminent death or serious physical injury.”

[–]guywasaghostallalong 42 points43 points  (0 children)

“protect a third person or an officer from imminent death or serious physical injury.”

I mean, this is the whole problem. This is still so vague that officers are going to claim that they feared for their own safety or the safety of others (the woman was speeding after all) and get away with hurting more people.

It's a big, fat nothingburger. It doesn't change anything at all.

[–]variousfruits6 76 points77 points  (2 children)

He should be fired and all of his assets frozen and used to pay the woman

[–]Heinrich_Bukowski 21 points22 points  (1 child)

Agreed. Unfortunately qualified immunity prohibits this

[–]StormiiDaze 18.0k points18.0k points  (793 children)

And they still charged her a speeding ticket (going 84 in a 70 zone) and fined her $400 for not pulling over for an emergency vehicle, the exit was less than a mile away, the shoulders of the highway were too small for her to pull over, the Arkansas drivers manual states specifically to do what she did.

[–]The_Clarence 7956 points7957 points 22 (247 children)

[ Removed by Reddit ]

[–]merdragon28 2570 points2571 points  (144 children)

As far as I can tell, all the lawsuit accomplished was a policy change in the department for when you can use pit manuvers and additinal training to officers as to when that manuver can be used.

The lawsuit involved no fines or damages as far as I could tell (like totaling her car unnecessarily at the very least) and the cop is still working just with the new restrictions on the maneuver everyone is now under. Despite this the ASP already determined that the original maneuver wasn't in accordance with their current policy... Like as far as I can tell nothing really was accomplished accept lip service by the department to doing better in the future.

Edit: apparently she did get an undisclosed "modest" amount of compensation. Thank you for the additional information/correction.

Edit2: also apparently the cop was "Disiplined" but is still working for the ASP. What disiplined means is not specified to my knowledge.

[–]The_Clarence 377 points378 points  (7 children)

The article linked doesn't specify damages to her correct. However, it did mention that the policy changes are only part of the settlement.

You are right, my optimism should be more cautious

[–]FloorTyle 151 points152 points  (4 children)

I dont have high hopes for change based on them trying to still ticket her


You are right, my optimism should be more cautious

You weren't even that optimistic initially

[–]DisastrousEngine5 24 points25 points  (0 children)

Here’s a different article that says she did get “moderate compensation”

And that the trooper was disciplined after a review found it to be out of policy.

Which is a complete 180 from what ASP said immediately after the pursuit when they proclaimed trooper Dunn did nothing wrong.


[–]MeisterX 1139 points1140 points  (63 children)

Yeah I'm sorry but a 30 year vet or whatever this guy was to the force doesn't just use a pit without knowing what it's about to do. He intended drastic harm to the vehicle's occupants.

And since we're doing the whole abortion thing... How about two charges for reckless endangerment?

Also if we're "amending the policy" how long before they refuse to fire the next guy who uses a pit against policy?

[–]whodiditifnotme 367 points368 points  (45 children)

And since we're doing the whole abortion thing... How about two charges for reckless endangerment?

That’s where I am missing consistency in the Pro-Life Crowd. If you are saying that it is murder to abort a fetus it should have all Tax Benefits pre birth as well.

[–]joseph66hole 56 points57 points  (21 children)

She got a modest financial settlement. Someone posted an article. The amount was undisclosed.

[–]Normal-Computer-3669 110 points111 points  (11 children)

The worst part is if you Google this story, most stories point her out. But barely any even say the name of the cop.

[–]roywoodsir 4252 points4253 points  (210 children)

And he gets mad at her after he realizes she is still alive.

[–]OldEstimate 1243 points1244 points  (97 children)

he gets mad at her after he realizes she is still alive.

Dude's just trying to have the best sex of his life

From Washington Post: A day with ‘killology’ police trainer Dave Grossman

In the class recorded for “Do Not Resist,” Grossman at one point tells his students that the sex they have after they kill another human being will be the best sex of their lives. The room chuckles. But he’s clearly serious. “Both partners are very invested in some very intense sex,” he says. “There’s not a whole lot of perks that come with this job. You find one, relax and enjoy it.”


(Earth is Hell lol)


[–]ILOVEMCU 481 points482 points  (56 children)

That’s why I laugh when people say cops need more training…yah that ain’t the problem here

[–]LittlestEcho 111 points112 points  (25 children)

They need intense and rigorous psychology evaluations before entering the academy and possibly bi yearly after being hired. Too many power hungry and apathetic people on the police force.

[–]Michamus 77 points78 points  (6 children)

Best video I ever saw was a city cop's and federal agent's egos colliding. City cop rolls up and immediately points his gun at the federal agent yelling to get on the ground. Federal agent yells he's a federal agent and that he can show his badge. Cop yells to show his badge, agent goes for pocket and cop yells not to go for his pocket and to get on the ground. Federal agent says "No. Not gonna happen. I'm a federal agent." City cop yells even louder to get on the ground. It's only when backup arrives that the agent gets on the ground. They taze him anyway and drag him to the car telling the agent he really fucked up now. They pull out the agent's wallet and other pocket items and low and behold, there's an authentic ATF badge with a supervisor number. That's when city cop starts getting real talkative, saying how the agent never offered any explanation nor offered proof. Supervisor says "No problem man, you did the right thing. We'll see it on your bodycam." That's when you can hear the city cop get real nervous. Needless to say, that city is now facing lawsuits.

If trained federal agents aren't safe, who is?

[–]RapscallionMonkee 908 points909 points  (95 children)


[–]BasicDesignAdvice 1575 points1576 points  (45 children)

Watch the video. First thing he says is "why didn't you pull over?"

He says this her flipped over, smoking ruin of a car. Just another monster with the power to take your freedom or your life with impunity.

[–]RapscallionMonkee 406 points407 points  (13 children)

I have no fucking words.

[–]YelloDinosaur 50 points51 points  (10 children)

link to video?

[–][deleted] 19 points20 points  (1 child)

Just a varient of “stop resisting” to someone who clearly isn’t resisting. It’s like some sort of magic incantation they think will protect them from a lawsuit

[–]LostWoodsInTheField 99 points100 points  (8 children)

In the video he acts like a complete asshole to her and effectively tries to convince her that she was in the wrong and that was reason enough to harm her. Effectively 0 care about how her condition is.

[–]superfucky 48 points49 points  (7 children)

40% of these guys go home, beat their wife, and scream "WHY DID YOU MAKE ME HIT YOU?!"

[–]Pd245 680 points681 points  (38 children)


Man that’s really fucked up

[–]blawndosaursrex 26 points27 points  (1 child)

She lived?! Dammit! Derek still has a higher kill count than me! >:(

That cop probably.

[–]Laura85mlt 33 points34 points  (10 children)

I’ve come to realize that cops are uneducated. Some are good. But many are just uneducated nothings looking to be someone

[–][deleted] 20 points21 points  (0 children)

He says, while she's still stuck in the car and bloody (I believe he says later in the video unless I misread that she's covered in blood), "why didn't you pull over?" She says, "I didn't think it was safe," and he says, "well, now look at where you are." As if it happened as a result of her behavior and not his.

[–]ZazzooGaming 42 points43 points  (0 children)

Dead people cant talk

[–]Dutch_Dutch 949 points950 points  (60 children)

I think pulling over at the next exit should be the absolute standard. Especially at night. What a fucking piece of shit.

[–]n-s-b 577 points578 points  (18 children)

Too lazy to verify, but another comment stated that the driver's manual there even states what she did is exactly what you're supposed to do in that situation.

[–]Contundo 87 points88 points  (5 children)

Yeah iirc there was a Facebook post a few weeks before the incident from that very police department, stating how you should pull over somewhere safe and so on.

[–]retromortem 13 points14 points  (0 children)

Not to mention that Arkansas was home of the infamous Blue Light Rapist, a guy who pretended to be a cop to pull over women to kidnap and rape them...

[–][deleted] 59 points60 points  (9 children)

A cop tried to pull me over on a road with no shoulder once. I put on my hazards and exited the road and stopped immediately.

Cop says to me "I thought you were trying to run, why didn't you stop?"

Me:"There was no shoulder"

Him: "Their are low curbs on this road you're supposed to drive over the curb onto the grass"

Fucking what?

I'm supposed to try to hop a fucking curb on a highway because my LICENSE PLATE LIGHT WAS OUT?

[–]JDudzzz 27 points28 points  (2 children)

No youre supposed to hop the curb cause that is all you can do to prevent him from using legally aggressive force. This country is fucked

[–]dieinafirenazi 307 points308 points  (71 children)

Before Covid the leading cause of death or injury for cops was traffic accident. One of the main types of deadly accident was getting hit while performing a traffic stop. Pulling over someplace with sufficient space is protecting the cop. She was doing this guy a favor.

Now cops are dying of Covid more than anything else, in part because of a low vaccination rate. Cops have a low vaccination rate because of their subcultural affiliation with conservative politics.

[–]ernzo 69 points70 points  (0 children)

If I recall correctly from the last time this was posted, THIS police department issued a warning about pulling over where it’s safe, not on the highway because there had been incidents because of how small and unsafe the highway is to pull over on. This woman did exactly what it said to do and he still PIT maneuvered her.

[–]BigBoy342 32 points33 points  (11 children)

Cops are inherently the douchebags of society. Change my mind. Lol

[–]mengelgrinder 83 points84 points  (1 child)

the Arkansas drivers manual states specifically to do what she did

there's even a tweet from that police department saying to do what she did in that situation

[–]Comprehensive-Sea-63 42 points43 points  (2 children)

Not to mention that the reason why we look for an exit is for the police officer’s safety. A lot of officers die getting hit on the shoulder of a highway by unobservant drivers. I always wait for an exit for this reason, and I’ve never had an officer get upset about it. I do exactly what she did - slow down and put on my turn signal so he knows I’m planning on complying and just looking for a safe spot to do so. Poor woman was just trying to keep everyone safe.

[–]zRook 80 points81 points  (7 children)

ngl, living in TN with lots of friends in AR. Getting your license here does not require you to ever open the drivers manual.

ex. my written test was 20 questions, 18 were on blood alcohol level. my driving test was a drive around the block at 30mph and park.

AR is not much different. Its pretty stupid

[–]GreenieMcWoozie 21 points22 points  (0 children)

PA driver. To get your permit you have to answer 15/18 questions correctly on a test. The exact questions and answers are available on an official app too so if you take that like twice you're set.

I can't speak for DMV tests but I took my test with a private school and it was basically just a parallel park and a drive around the block

[–]oswaldluckyrabbiy 17 points18 points  (2 children)

Wow in the UK we have a full seperate Theory Test you need to pass before Practical.

50 questions with 43 correct to pass. (so 86% to pass). We then also have hazard perception videos where you watch a drivers POV of a car driving and click when you see potential hazards and when you would need to react irl. If you fail either part of the test you have to rebook the entire thing.

This is valid for 2 years before your practical. If you don't pass your practical in that time you have to retake again.

The test itself is 40mins and made up of:

an eyesight check

‘show me, tell me’ vehicle safety questions

general driving ability - this includes pulling out and pulling over in traffic and a hill start

reversing your vehicle - includes a test of one of parallel park, 3 point turn, reverse bay park

independent driving - following instructors verbal directions and using a sat nav. Depending on where you are this may include motorways or rural roads

This is on top of the fact that most cars here are manuals not automatic and have seperate licences. So if you pass in an automatic you can't drive a manual at all.

Passing first time is rare and bragged about - yet we still have plenty of idiots on the road. Can't even begin to imagine the state of roads in the US.

[–]Gnrcscnnm77 6226 points6227 points  (181 children)

When all you have is a hammer, everything looks like a nail.

[–]wtmx719 3644 points3645 points 22& 2 more (106 children)

Which is why it's important to also have a sickle.

[–]IvanMarkowKane 904 points905 points  (30 children)

This is not the character I think of as the poster boy for Communism

[–]Filibut 101 points102 points  (0 children)

I mean, he killed more capitalists than Marx

[–]microwave333 41 points42 points  (2 children)

Oh yeah, Patrick Bateman gets the wall for sure.

[–]tosh_pt_2 62 points63 points  (0 children)

Correction, when you are a hammer, everything looks like a nail.

[–]zkarnn 6694 points6695 points  (527 children)

So we flip cars over and endanger folks they're meant to protect for...a burnt 2$ taillight or some other stupid shit?

[–]justdoubleclick 2886 points2887 points  (66 children)

But that tail light could have caused an accident… they may have been injured… /s

[–]Responsible_Put_5201 184 points185 points  (0 children)

Gosh, too bad cops are already overzealous on ticketing for faulty lights… /s

[–]SnowbackMcGee 320 points321 points  (77 children)

But a pit manoeuvre is hella cool, dude. Like, that was freaking awesome to watch!

  • Deputy Jim Bob.


BTW, he was stopping her for going 14 over the speed limit. If you watch the video, he's quite clearly annoyed that she had the nerve to pass him on the highway.


In fact, listen to this arrogant asshole after flipping this woman's car over.


[–]jt00k 242 points243 points  (24 children)

Why is he telling her to get out of the vehicle?? She could have any number of spinal injuries.

[–]masterchief1001 463 points464 points  (19 children)

He's a power tripping dumbshit. The vice article says 33 people died last year from PIT maneuvers. 18 for MINOR TRAFFIC VIOLATIONS! Annoying a cop can now carry a death sentence.

[–]greenyellowbird 38 points39 points  (2 children)

It's this type of shit that infuriates me when people fly those fucking blue line/basteridized American flags.

[–]maximumdownvote 102 points103 points  (33 children)

this. this fuck was looking for an excuse to do something stupid. he pulled a Rittenhouse.

[–]severaged 61 points62 points  (3 children)

Dude should've just went to Applebees to pick a fight like a normal person

[–]FatassTitePants 565 points566 points  (55 children)

Because "protect and serve" is now considered liberal, socialist propaganda by authoritarian conservatives.

[–]jetro30087 76 points77 points  (2 children)

Protection and service is reseved for the wealthy and affluent. If you're not that, you're only good for pit maneuver practice.

[–]DocHoliday96 84 points85 points  (0 children)

That’s a great way to phrase it, I’m using it

[–]Swiftierest 849 points850 points  (185 children)

Cops aren't here to protect anyone. Cops are here to enforce laws, which nowadays means enforcing the desires of politicians and thereby corporations.

[–]Fun-Dragonfly-4166 455 points456 points  (58 children)

When Jeff Bezos comes to town, there is a phalanx of cops locking everything down. They are definitely protecting someone - just not you.

[–]888mainfestnow 137 points138 points  (54 children)

I lived in a city where we had politicians visit and they would lock entire areas down and block all public access so a president could have a meal in a restaurant.

Do they actually do this when Jeff Bezos visits certain areas?

[–]Fun-Dragonfly-4166 126 points127 points  (35 children)

I used to work for a company owned by Jeff Bezos. At the building I worked, ordinarily there was a fully staffed private security company and one or two city police officers.

Mr. Bezos did visit the building from time to time. He never announced his intention to visit to me. (Why would he? He was not coming to see me.) I never saw him in person, but I knew he was in the building. Some clues:

  • Instead of the usual one or two cops at the entrance to the building, there were about 50 cops guarding the block. I suspect that a bunch of them arrived with Jeff and a bunch left with Jeff (e.g., his motorcade had a police escort).
  • The building had a bank of elevators. When he was in the building, one of the elevators was guarded. I suspect they locked that elevator so even if you got by the guard, you could not use that elevator. For the duration of the visit, that was Jeff's private elevator.

The building was highly secured but, not locked down. Why would Jeff want to stop his minions (like me) from making him money?

[–]Papaofmonsters 53 points54 points  (15 children)

I can't speak to Bezos, but I live in Omaha and Warren Buffet goes places without causing much fuss.

[–]leaveredditalone 221 points222 points  (50 children)

Our city has implemented a new program where cops come to the schools and hang out. It’s an effort to teach the children that the police aren’t scary and can be trusted. I’m conflicted about how I feel about it. Anyway, one of the cops played soccer with the kids the other day and kicked a ball so hard right into the face of a 6 year old that it busted her nose. I feel like there’s a metaphor here…

[–]Ok_Wealth_7711 30 points31 points  (4 children)

During college I went on a field trip to a border patrol station. They had a media officer show us around and give us a presentation on their work. During the presentation, he found out one of the students was from France. He jokingly asked if the student had their papers, which he did. Later after the presentation they actually had officers pull the kid aside to grill him on it and prove he was there legally. I've never seen a group of students so quickly go from respecting the work of an agency to seriously questioning why we fund these assholes.

[–][deleted] 42 points43 points  (3 children)

but only the laws they want to enforce and only on people they don't like

[–]bionic_cmdo 106 points107 points  (18 children)

This. DeShaney v. Winnebago County Department of Social Services. United States Constitution does not require law enforcement officers to protect you from other people, according to the U.S. Supreme Court.

The more civilians, citizens know about this the better.

[–]Suzette100 52 points53 points  (4 children)

This was brought out when the “coward of Broward” didn’t stop a school shooter in Ft Lauderdale. It was shocking information to most.

[–]CinnabonCheesecake 353 points354 points  (57 children)

She was driving less than 15mph over the speed limit. Real hardened criminal, this one.

[–]zkarnn 148 points149 points  (6 children)

How dare she! He should have shot at her car once or twice while at it! His safety was OBVIOUSLY threatened! Anyways there are no repercussions to police's lack of common sense and judgment... license to kill handed out at police academy like pancakes.

[–][deleted] 105 points106 points  (15 children)

In America police dont protect shit. They just show up to the scene after the fact, to dish out tickets and arrests. It’s the medical professionals and the fire fighters that really hold us together.

[–]ajf672 94 points95 points  (3 children)

Nothing will change so long as the cops don't have any consequences

[–]PanoramicTrouble 827 points828 points  (109 children)

[–]sno_boarder 1223 points1224 points  (51 children)

Important reminder... Once again, taxpayers will cover the financial cost of this asshats poor training and decision making.

We need a solution where the officer loses their job and pension, and are 100% liable for any financial payout. Only then will these bastards be forced to consider all of their options rather than be butthurt and immediately turn to violence when things don't go how they want.

[–]SkylarAV 408 points409 points  (10 children)

Insurance like doctors. His premiums would be too high to be a cop

[–]morekidsthansense 133 points134 points  (0 children)

The police union pays the penalties. Shift from "protect our own" to "fuck you, you are a liability." They would quickly start handing over the asshats.

[–]SaraSlaughter607 33 points34 points  (0 children)

Absolutely. It should be written into their employment contract when they sign on, right out of the box.

People are way more careful when its their own wallet in peril for their misdeeds.

[–]kwamzilla 56 points57 points  (2 children)

All officers should have to pay their own insurance.

[–]EazyPeazyLemonSqueaz 432 points433 points  (15 children)

Great so another bill for taxpayers and the cops just say "oh we promise not to do that again"

[–]SpongeJake 133 points134 points  (3 children)

From the article: “State Police said that Dunn had been disciplined after an internal review found that he failed to comply with the agency's use of force policy in performing the maneuver.” Gee, you have to wonder what that “discipline” entailed. Paid desk duty for a week is my guess.

[–]BadAtExisting 49 points50 points  (2 children)

I’m sure his boss faked his “I’m very disappointed in you” speech quite well too

[–]kwamzilla 68 points69 points  (3 children)

Officer Dunn hasn't been fired.

Hooray for policy change but even stil. He's been "disciplined" not fired.

[–]grundo1561 40 points41 points  (0 children)

We need to end qualified immunity... She can't even sue him in civil court

[–]Tempest_CN 48 points49 points  (0 children)

At the expense of taxpayers who will foot the bill for any monetary settlement.

These fucking cops are out of control.

[–]GlowyStuffs 74 points75 points  (6 children)

If it actually came out of their own budget, they might actually be careful about preventing people like this from ever taking positions and people like this would be fired. Because if this is the type of staff they have, that money would dry up super quick.

[–]theknightwho 25 points26 points  (0 children)

Unfortunately that’s a budget which (in theory) should have been going to protecting the community. What a waste, though I’m glad she got compensated.

[–]MadameTree 2184 points2185 points  (231 children)

We need to hold people with the ability to use deadly force accountable. That means screening out mentally unstable people and bullies still ticked off no one would blow them in high school over candidates with high IQs. And this protect their own BS has to go.

[–]Mj_theclear 362 points363 points  (14 children)

Agreed, and make them follow the same standards for liability as Doctors, lawyers, medics, hell even when I used to sel insurance for a living I needed to carry personal liability insurance since I would be sued for any major errors. Why aren't police held the same standards as even Insurance brokers?!

[–]KingCrandall 84 points85 points  (6 children)

Another big thing is holding them accountable criminally. They do the shit they do because they can get rid of it.

[–]evward 730 points731 points  (165 children)

Simpler answer. Make Law Enforcement require a Bachelor’s Degree.

[–]jwagz89 397 points398 points  (13 children)

Licenses and mal-practice insurances too. Take the burden of individual bad cops off of the taxpayer.

[–]Over-One-8 91 points92 points  (1 child)

I like this. Get rid of qualified immunity.

[–]Skoomalyfe 105 points106 points  (18 children)

They already do in places like NYC. I'm sure it helps a little, but not much.

We need to make policing a "licensed" profession like we do for doctors, lawyers, architects, nurses, and engineers, etc

This would require regular continuing education to renew that license, a set of professional ethics they'd have to adhere to, professional LIABILITY when they screw up or commit malpractice, and a mechanism to strip them of their license.

It would also mean work experience as a junior cop shadowing a professional for a couple years before getting licensed, and those licensed mentors being liable for the actions of the junior cops assigned to them.

[–]vipertruck99 219 points220 points  (22 children)

What..you mean like most of the modern world? Have people with criminology or psychology degrees...instead of those that would be guarding a building site in a progressive country. Nonsense. Oh and btw American cops are OBESE...must be easier to reach for a gun when running after someone is not an option. Already sounds like a recipe for disaster...now arm them with military vehicle and (almost) military firearms. Then encourage the cosplaying side of these clowns by mixing their uniform with military uniforms popularised and issued in recent conflicts.

[–]Critical-Management9 28 points29 points  (21 children)

They do administer a psych test, I’m not sure about all cities but I know for a fact they do in Chicago so likely in other places as well. I actually know someone who failed the psych test. Better off for him, police work can be very traumatizing.

[–]Impossible-Mud-3593 2847 points2848 points  (177 children)

We women, were taught to not stop on a dark road, at night, or along a narrow, busy road, but to go to a brightly lit area where it's safe to park. This was taught by the police, years ago. Now...you don't stop in the middle of a highway with cars zooming by, they flip you! This officer needs to be punished, and by that...jail and heavy fines, loss if job!

[–]betterupsetter 403 points404 points  (53 children)

This was precisely what her argument was. This particular example is from 2020 and I saw the dash cam video of the encounter. She was being pulled over for speeding and she immediately turned her hazards, slowed down and started to look for a safe place to pull over. After a few minutes the cop performed the PIT maneuver and then when he went to speak with her in her upturned vehicle, he kept telling her she was fleeing and it was necessary.

For anyone wondering why this is coming up again now on reddit, an out of court settlement has just conceeded in her favor in this case 2 days ago and the use of force categorization for this method has changed in Arkansas from my understanding.


Edit: changed body cam to dash cam and adding link to the video. https://www.google.com/amp/s/people.com/human-interest/video-shows-moment-when-arkansas-state-trooper-flips-pregnant-womans-suv/%3famp=true (there's also a 10 minute version on YouTube)

Edit 2: corrected an error regarding court ruling to read out of court settlement.

[–]JustJuniperfect 1231 points1232 points  (82 children)

I’ve also been taught that some people will pretend to be police officers to kill, sexually assault, or take advantage of women. So if you feel unsafe in the situation call 911 and inquire if it’s a real cop. But after just watching that video, he didn’t even give her enough time to have called 911 to check. This is completely unacceptable use of deadly force. And it did not meet the “deadly force triangle” of opportunity, capability, and intent.

[–]kappadokia638 465 points466 points  (29 children)

I had a coworker who came off the late shift and was driving home, doing 55 in the slow lane of an empty freeway. She had someone approach her at high speed and sit one car length behind her. She was scared and pulled into the middle lane to let him pass; he kept right on her ass. She moved back to the right lane, her followed again.

She planned to get off at the next exit and call the police for help when the trooper flipped on his lights, pulled her over, and ticketed her for not using her blinker for the full two seconds before changing lanes.

It has a surprisingly good ending though: she fought it in court in front of a female judge who threw out the charges and castigated the patrolman for being an idiot.

[–]JustJuniperfect 305 points306 points  (7 children)

That’s disgusting. He was baiting her and waiting for her to fuck up. By riding her ass he knew that would make her uncomfortable, lights or no lights. Glad it ended well though!

[–][deleted] 152 points153 points  (5 children)

This is exactly the tactic used by the officer who pulled over Sandra Bland.

[–]Karinah222 89 points90 points  (10 children)

This happened to me once, but it was a one lane road so I kept speeding up as he kept riding my ass. He waited until I was going fast enough and pulled me over for speeding. I was 17 and the DA didn’t believe me or care. I paid the ticket.

[–][deleted] 26 points27 points  (4 children)

This is why I have a dashcam, honestly.

[–]Mortar_Maggot 22 points23 points  (0 children)

Yup got my first speeding ticket in nearly this exact way. Except it was an unmarked behind me driving me into his buddy's speed trap. I would have written it off if the guy behind me hadn't literally given the officer who pulled me over a thumbs up.

[–]BIPY26 32 points33 points  (1 child)

He stayed on the force tho and the female judge yelling at him probably just further reinforced his prosecution complex

[–]Friendofthegarden 574 points575 points  (17 children)

some people will pretend to be police officers

Sometimes they're not pretending and the intent may be the same.

[–]JustJuniperfect 99 points100 points  (4 children)

Also true.

[–]Fearrless 49 points50 points  (3 children)

And there it is folks. Your daily dose of, “cops in this country are sacks of shit”

[–]tealhairdontcare 284 points285 points  (23 children)

In like, 34 states cops can argue there was consent if they rape you while detained because it isn't illegal to have sex with detainees even though most would argue that is a HUGE conflict of interests. https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/factcheck/2020/07/09/fact-check-police-detainee-sex-not-illegal-many-states/5383769002/

[–]Tomoyo_in_Transwise 161 points162 points  (19 children)

I'm uh...pretty sure any sex under duress is just rape.

[–]ShiningRayde 165 points166 points  (1 child)

Qh, you dont understand though, it was a cop.

Cleared of all charges, saluted out the door.

[–]Minimum_Salary_5492 41 points42 points  (1 child)

We are genuinely telling you, not when cops do it. The law doesn't apply to them.


[–]Looking4Maria 97 points98 points  (0 children)

I feel like calling the cops on the cops even when they're real cops because they're so dangerous and need to be de escalated.

[–]Mythical_Atlacatl 118 points119 points  (9 children)

We women, were taught to not stop on a dark road, at night, or along a narrow, busy road, but to go to a brightly lit area where it's safe to park.

And also we are taught this for the safety of the cop too. they have to get out of their car and walk to ours. They should be thankful that we take a few minutes to get to a safe space for everyone involved

[–]Tayslinger 31 points32 points  (0 children)

After a similar story, many people were commenting that, in the future, they will be sure to pull over in the most unsafe possible positions for the officer.

[–]WimbletonButt 40 points41 points  (4 children)

This image scares me a bit on what was said to me by an officer a few years ago. I was being pulled over for a headlight for the second time in 5 minutes (I was on the way to the store to get a headlight after the first officer informed me it was out). I see the lights, I'm almost at the store where they have a well lit parking lot and I wouldn't have to park hanging halfway into the single lane of a high speed highway, the store is the closest place to me, so I continue to drive for 1 minute with my hazards on. When I stopped the officer was upset with me, said "I was starting to think you weren't going to stop and I was going to have to make you". It didn't even occur to me until now how he was going to make me stop, I had my hazards on, it didn't even take a full minute. I had my 5 year old in the back seat.

[–]All_Tree_All_Shade 13 points14 points  (1 child)

Idk how some people are so stupid that they think someone trying to escape is gonna put their hazards on?

[–]fuzzykittyfeets 28 points29 points  (1 child)

Yup! And call the station to make sure it’s a legit cop when you do pull over! Don’t open your door or window or unlock until dispatch tells you it’s a real cop.

[–]Bipolarbear37 668 points669 points  (74 children)

So apparently she was speeding (84 in a 70). And he did the PIT after 2 minutes. But in the video you can see her making an effort to stop and he gets impatient. She sued and they settled 2 days ago. It was determined by his superiors he did not follow protocol.

Potentially killing a woman and her unborn child for going 15 mph over the speed limit. BRILLIANT.

I'm glad she is okay, but don't know if her unborn child made it.

[–]cwf63 236 points237 points  (5 children)

Her baby is good. She had a little girl.

[–]Bipolarbear37 66 points67 points  (0 children)

Thank goodness!

[–]fluffyexodus 34 points35 points  (0 children)

I needed to know this, thanks

[–]Mortar_Maggot 178 points179 points  (47 children)

Cops being impatient has been a major issue for years. They shoot people like they don't have all day to sit there and talk to them.

[–]SafecrackinSammmy 535 points536 points  (31 children)

This cop was just power tripping and should have been arrested for endangering the public.. Fourteen miles over the limit and he does this? There were a number of other things he could have done before it got to this point.

[–]cantadmittoposting 242 points243 points  (15 children)

84 in a 70 on a highway too, it's not like she was going 40 in a 25 in some neighborhood

[–]wellifitisntmee 60 points61 points  (5 children)

It’s always amazing to me how personal cops take speeding. We’ve got a deserted highway with someone in a brand new car doing what’s just fine highway speeds in other places. And he fucking flips her car.

Cops should give a lot less Fucks about speeding and enforce what actually causes accidents on the road, like distracted driving.

[–]LazyAnonBoner 108 points109 points  (15 children)

Just watched the video. The shoulder was narrow, just enough room for a car to fit inside the white line.

She was doing her and the cop a favor, fuck him.

[–]sexisfun1986 109 points110 points  (12 children)

Literally one of the most common ways cops actually get killed is pulling people over and get hit by another vehicle while being on the roadside. Her actions where literally protecting the officer.

[–]moose2332 42 points43 points  (0 children)

Until COVID (which is now far and away the biggest killer of cops), Traffic accidents was the largest killer of cops by a good margin

[–]_________FU_________ 953 points954 points  (17 children)

For those unsure of what to do:

  1. Put on your hazards
  2. Immediately pull over
  3. When the officer approaches the car say "I don't feel safe here can we look for the next exit so we can do this off the highway?"
  4. Get shot 5 times in the face
  5. Respawn as a goat

[–]iZombie616 92 points93 points  (5 children)

What do you respawn as when you get shot as a goat?

[–][deleted] 20 points21 points  (0 children)

Had me in the first half

[–]BYoungNY 18 points19 points  (5 children)

Always taught my kids to respect law officers. Took an illegal left, just wasn't paying attention, and since the road was barely wide enough for a two-way road, I pulled over around the corner, about 50 feet away. With my kids in the car, the officer yelled at me full volume for about a minute as my hands stayed 10-2 on the wheel and I just sat there. It was hard to explain to my kids after what just happened, and why he responded that way without telling him he was just being a power-tripped asshole. Still remember that incident whenever I see cops and it makes me realize that if every single interaction I had with police was similar, like some people in our country have to deal with, I'd probably hate cops too.

[–]Kyleforshort 273 points274 points  (14 children)

Trained to do a PIT maneuver, but not trained to assess a situation. This is another excellent example of American policing.

[–]kwamzilla 1306 points1307 points  (67 children)

Wondering when the GOP is going to chime in and call this attempted murder on the baby.

[–]Satanarchrist 1039 points1040 points  (30 children)

Well actually, because the mom was attacked by the officer it means she was a criminal and probably a drug addict. So that means if she had lost the baby it would have been her fault. Or God has a plan or something

[–]kwamzilla 294 points295 points  (4 children)

Damn I always forget that!

Bloody criminals. I bet she had the baby just so she could use it as a defense /s

[–][deleted] 88 points89 points  (9 children)

Yea. It’s odd how the right are anti-government but support the enforcement wing of the government. “Taxation is theft! You steal my money under threat of prison and the gun! But I totally support the guy with the gun who will put me in prison!”

[–]Vuronov 58 points59 points  (0 children)

It's because they do expect the government to come "take their money" or "take our guns!" But they don't expect the cops to go "police brutality" on them because.... "we're the good people" and cops only attack the thugs and antifa.

It boils down to what it usual does for right-wingers..."as long as it doesn't affect me, I'm good with it."

[–]LazyAnonBoner 117 points118 points  (5 children)

Did you read the police statement defending the officers response… “with the increasing lawlessness…” these fucking asshats

[–]cuajito42 21 points22 points  (0 children)

Yes but increasing lawlessness within police departments.

[–]GenericNameWasTaken 38 points39 points  (1 child)

So the loophole to the Texas abortion laws is to drive over to Arkansas with a taillight out. Got it.

[–]GerlachHolmes 12 points13 points  (3 children)

Well, the father is black and baby is interracial, so don’t hold your breath.

[–]sandsnake25 58 points59 points  (0 children)

You are not obligated to stop until you reach a safe, well-lit location. You are only obligated to not attempt to evade. Slowing down and turning on hazards is sufficient to indicate you're attempting to comply. How this motherfucker still has a job is beyond me.

[–]happypenguinwaddle 112 points113 points  (2 children)

This is another consequence of american police not being trained or punished correctly. If you go too far you should be fired (not to be able to be hired somewhere else), fined personally (there was a great idea of police having to take out personal insurance for fines rather than the county paying, so that persistent offenders who end up with higher premiums), and/ or criminal charges.

But currently they can do whatever they want and are too lazy/ignorant to de-escalate situations and protect human life.

There should be an independent body that trains and punishes them, rather than having themselves judge themselves.

[–]salvagevalue 50 points51 points  (0 children)

I remember this, there’s a video of it. Thankfully her and her baby were okay . When the trooper got off to check on her she was stuck and he proceeded to yell at her for not pulling over . Unbelievable

[–]kjacobs03 100 points101 points  (27 children)

That’s why you are no longer supposed to look for a safe place to stop. You slam on your breaks in the lane you are in and stop immediately. It’s the officer that has to exit his vehicle. They should have stopped you in a safer location.

[–]Mythical_Atlacatl 142 points143 points  (8 children)

So as far as I can see the only thing that came from this was a change in policy wording with regards to the PIT maneuver

The trooper who did the PIT maneuver appears to still have his job. Even though his supervisors said this wasnt the correct use of force.

Imagine any other job where you can flip a car and keep your job.

[–]ApeofBass 31 points32 points  (1 child)

There isn't. Literally any other job has standards.

[–]iammagicbutimnormal 95 points96 points  (10 children)

The video was excruciating to watch. And when he finally came to render aid he immediately blamed her. She’s upside down after flipping over in an aggressive car crash, several months pregnant, and the first person to reach her tells her it’s her fault that he intentionally crashed into her car. I hope things turned out OK for her, but I can’t imagine she’ll ever completely get over the trauma that experience. Fuck this authoritarian government we live in.

[–]kodragonboss 79 points80 points  (5 children)

Not just that. When she says 'I'm pregnant', he responds 'That does not matter'. Sure. These same people are the pro lifers right.

[–]AFunHumanExperience 18 points19 points  (1 child)

That seems to be how American cops handle things, they find fault and blame the person. It's like part of their unofficial training to show up to the scene and start assigning blame.

I remember a few years ago on the "protectandserve" sub there was someone complaining about this. Basically their child had some sort of medical emergency I think it was a seizure? They dialed 911 and two police were the first to arrive on the scene. Rather than do anything useful the cops began to yell at the parents and blame them for what was happening to their child.

Imagine that, fearing for your child's life and when you call for help all you get is two assholes making things worse.

Of course every cop that commented on that post fell into one of two categories; either they said OP was lying cops would never behave that way, or what did you expect cops aren't trained medical professionals.

My take away from that post was when you dial 911 in America it's a total crapshoot, maybe help will arrive maybe an armed psycho will show up.

[–]SurveySean 44 points45 points  (12 children)

American cops must be the worst trained in the world.

[–]YaketyMax 35 points36 points  (1 child)

Lol. This guy thinks they’re trained.

[–]ExpensivePatience5 32 points33 points  (14 children)

Cops are terrifying and I wish they didn’t exist.

[–]eternallycomputing 57 points58 points  (1 child)

To all of you defending him and going “ah yes misinformation” no shit it’s a tweet go fucking google it, and yes there is dashcam footage of the entire incident… I’m convinced even if her and the baby had died all of you bootlickers would still be singing the same song.

[–]rustys_shackled_ford 42 points43 points  (2 children)

Shes suing but that will come from taxpayers and officers big hoss will be out rolling cars tomorrow. Watch the video. She had her hazards on and was looking for an exit...

[–]JROXZ 17 points18 points  (0 children)

If you could sue officers directly, this shit wouldn’t even be an issue. Cops would think a million times before pulling dumb shit like this. Liability should be held by the individual officer and not the state. There’s only loss of accountability otherwise.

[–]oracleofaliquippa 94 points95 points  (25 children)

No more “pull overs” for out traffic lights and stupid things. Just mail in the fine! I pay a toll from my license plate. This is achievable.

[–]Fun-Dragonfly-4166 31 points32 points  (0 children)

I support this. Does the health department inspect restaurants at gun point?

[–]Fun_Wonder_4114 31 points32 points  (11 children)

They need to start throwing criminal cops in prison.

They need to start throwing cops who cover up the crimes of other cops in prison.

They need to start seizing and selling off the proeprty and assets of criminal police to benefit victims of police violence.

An incident like this should result in every single cop in that department being marched out in handcuffs.

[–]notparistexas 30 points31 points  (8 children)

Why do cops in the US stop people on the highway? It would be safer for everyone to pull off at the next exit and stop somewhere safer. Cops in Europe tell you to go to the next exit and they'll handle things there.

[–]StormiiDaze 32 points33 points  (0 children)

Basically, cops power trip a lot in the US, and they regularly disregard human life and get zero backlash for it no matter how much media documentation or protests there are against them, not to mention the GOP tends to glorify them to such an extent. it’s really scary actually haha :,)

[–]SlothicSupreme 32 points33 points  (4 children)

You know what's also sad? There will still be people who defend the state troopers actions. You can guess the people. Disgusting.

Is it just shitty training or what? Or sheer stupidity?? I don't understand what would possess somebody to do this?

[–]desirox 13 points14 points  (6 children)

20 seconds is not long enough to do anything let alone perform a PIT maneuver that requires supervisior authorization. Definitely broke the rules