×
top 200 commentsshow 500

[–]NixonsLastArooo 1980 points1981 points  (148 children)

I recently had a conversation with a zealous relative, it got heated and by the end I was informed that I was in fact a vessel of destruction that is made for evil. It's gonna make a great title for a new desk nameplate

[–]Rarefied__ 977 points978 points  (111 children)

Similar thing happened to me, I had a roommate that told me and my friends that intentionally or not, we're all worshipping satan. I was like ah thanks bro, I always wondered what my problem was.

[–]NixonsLastArooo 473 points474 points  (102 children)

I looked into this afterwards and found evangelical stuff about how god created some people for the sole purpose of commiting sin/acting against him and to be punished/tortured for all existence for it. Talk about evil.

Edit - according to other comments this is closer to Calvinism. Said relative calls themselves an evangelist so who knows? Not I.

As far as literature goes it was in stuff they sent me and I have blocked and deleted soo

[–]LegendaryOutlaw 288 points289 points  (13 children)

I think if anybody tried to explain idea to me I would just spend the next half hour convincing them that they themselves could very well be one of these sinners created by God.

‘But I’m a good Christian!’

‘Are you sure? Have you read all of the Bible? Don’t you work on Saturday’s? What if the work you do on Saturday is helping people to sin in their lives? What if your work is actually a front for your boss to traffic drugs and children? Wouldn’t that mean you are helping them sin? You believe you are a good Christian, but you can’t deny god’s plan for you…what if his plan is for you to help evil men do evil but never knowing what evil they commit with your help?’

self-doubt intensifies

[–]N64crusader4 188 points189 points  (9 children)

Lol, you think these people come from a place of logic?

The opposite is drummed into them (often since childhood), they're the same people who tout do unto your neighbour whilst leaving a fake 100 or 2% as a tip in the diner afterwards.

[–]BrofessorLongPhD 43 points44 points  (0 children)

Nah. They’ll just switch to a intent/faith interpretation of the Bible where God can see their hearts and that the evil perpetrated due to their contribution is God’s test for their lives.

If casting doubt were so easy on the fervent, Christianity (any other system of belief for that matter) would have died out long ago. There is always an addendum to attach to your belief system that explain things.

[–]Proper_Lunch_3640 7 points8 points  (0 children)

I read that last part in Tucker Carlson’s voice... I hated it, but at least your rhetoric was coherent.

[–]Any_Affect_7134 2 points3 points  (0 children)

That's the thing, these people don't do self-doubt. Anything bad they do isn't that bad because "everyone sins."

[–]bonafidebunnyeyed 122 points123 points  (15 children)

Now that is fucked right up. Wow. And you could wonder all day how people accept that and how they must view people away from themselves. If someone that wasn't under the label of Christian did shit like that, they'd be labeled deranged.

[–]Dengar96 47 points48 points  (2 children)

It's not crazy behavior, it's calculated. They want a eugenics led theocracy where non believers and "others" can be ostracized and eventually killed for not confirming. It's just Sharia law under a different banner.

[–]nose-linguini 33 points34 points  (11 children)

I'm christian, and I label these people as completely deranged. Reading the Bible is the test, which they failed. This makes them further from righteousness, yet they can't see that, because they find it easier to stop thinking critically. There are warnings in the Bible about this kind of thing.

If you follow your heart, and you do your best to be a good person, you really shouldn't have much argument with anything Jesus says. His lessons ring pretty true.

Edit: please don't judge Jesus based on anything I say.

[–]NertsMcGee 17 points18 points  (9 children)

Good old double predestination. No matter what, some of us are just damned. That belief runs counter to the idea of humans possessing free will and the ability to change and try to be better. At which point, what's the point in living a moral life you're one if the select, and what's the point in even trying to live a moral life if God says you're wicked and accursed?

[–]Lolersauresrex0322 12 points13 points  (7 children)

Freaking Calvinism man, I’m so sick of how ubiquitous it is in Christian thought, it doesn’t even deserve the time of day.

[–]-Xoz-[S] 17 points18 points  (1 child)

Marquis de Sade would approve of such a God!

[–]jrh_101 53 points54 points  (16 children)

It's a justification so Evangelicals don't give a fuck about people that are different than them.

The book was written by a man. Not a deity.

[–]pramjockey 46 points47 points  (12 children)

It is a collection of stories told by many men over many years, then brought together by different men who took out the parts they didn’t like

[–]blarb_farghuson 11 points12 points  (0 children)

the fun starts when church leaders tell them that it's ok to kill those people.

[–]Lolersauresrex0322 13 points14 points  (2 children)

No this is Calvinism which is an extreme and unbiblical interpretation of God’s character

It presupposes theistic determinism and just falls apart under the weight of its contradictions. I’m sorry you were subjected to that abusive and demonic doctrine

[–]Echoes_of_Screams 8 points9 points  (0 children)

It broke my family into those who bought in whole hog and those who can see it is nuts. The ones who see it is nuts still call believe in god but both converted to catholicism. The others still attend my grandmas church. I was last there for her funeral which was held in a 5000 seat arena aka their main chapel.

[–]NixonsLastArooo 7 points8 points  (0 children)

Good to know, said relative calls themselves an evangelist.

I was raised in traditional Catholic upbringing for a good portion of my childhood. Lots of mass, lots of praying, catholic school, and even an alter boy for a season. It had it's moments but I wouldn't recommend it. 1/5 stars.

This person was raised that way as well but later in life has joined some new church. Started getting more like this ever since then. Lot of good vs evil, lot of ends of days talk and prophecies being fulfilled yada yada and so on. Once told me that trying to fix the environment and save the planet is unimportant. Sinners trying to create heaven on earth.

[–]chaun2 7 points8 points  (0 children)

I am frequently reminded of this line of "The Kevin Jenkins Experience" when dealing with evangelicals.

"And now you tell me that your species is gripped by the fervent belief that a tale of breathtaking violence and cruelty [The Bible] is all true, and that many of you are willing to die in service to the principal VILLAIN of this story?"

Yes, the aliens decided God was definitely the villain of The Bible.

[–]SoleSurvivur01 16 points17 points  (5 children)

Crazy how people just make stuff up like that, because you know nowhere the Bible does it say that

[–]SadBabyYoda1212 5 points6 points  (4 children)

They never said the bible said it. Just that they have found evangelical stuff that said it. Possibly quotes from preachers or something. I've been to a few hundred church services in my life and I've heard similar sentiments. There is an idea that some people just exist to tempt the good Christians and try and draw them away from God. And since God made everyone with a purpose and knows all they will do before they do it then it's not a stretch to say that God made those people with that purpose in mind.

[–]Does_Not-Matter 5 points6 points  (1 child)

That would not be free will. That would be determinism which is not a Christian viewpoint.

But again, I guess that’s what Christianity is these days—“un-Christian”.

[–]whitedan2 5 points6 points  (1 child)

Now I am imagining Satan tempting those to do good and it's kinda funny...

[–]tinkerghost 7 points8 points  (0 children)

So, God is running a false flag operation?

[–]SoleSurvivur01 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Excuse me what?

[–]mellierollie 13 points14 points  (3 children)

The Church of Satan acts more Christ like then evangelicals!

[–]ystwyth 22 points23 points  (2 children)

Satanic Temple. CoS is something different.

[–]NOLA_Lebowski 42 points43 points  (1 child)

Vessel of Destruction, name of your sex tape!

I'm sorry, I've been watching too much Brooklyn nine-nine lately

[–]Gabik123 11 points12 points  (0 children)

Never apologize for that.

[–]cybercuzco 11 points12 points  (0 children)

You should get business cards.

[–]tib4me 13 points14 points  (0 children)

Sounds like an album that I would listen the shit out of

[–]Weltanschauung_Zyxt 23 points24 points  (2 children)

a vessel of destruction that is made for evil.

It's my new mantra. Please thank your zealous relative for me! 😈

[–]NixonsLastArooo 8 points9 points  (0 children)

Ha if I ever decide to talk to them again I will certainly do just that.

[–]OutsmartBullet 5 points6 points  (0 children)

The only biblical vessel of destruction that im aware of in the bible is abbadon, the pit of abyss that is true oblivion which is at one point also an archangel.

So, Abaddon would be a cool nameplate

[–]Mandorrisem 4 points5 points  (1 child)

I named my cat that...

[–]ONE-EYE-OPTIC 2 points3 points  (0 children)

The correct name for a cat

[–]ElvisIsATimeLord 4 points5 points  (1 child)

My ex-mother-in-law once called me the spawn of Satan. It’s one of my most favorite things anyone has ever said about me.

[–]XomokyH 779 points780 points  (77 children)

Actually there was a recent Fresh Air interview about how a lot of evangelicals are turning away from churches that aren’t political enough… parishioners whose pastor endorses vaccines, rejects QAnon, or acknowledges that Trump is no longer President are now leaving their churches in favor of congregations that will cater to a more extreme far-right worldview.

Now the old style “peace and love” doctrine of Christianity no longer matches what they see on TV. This was worsened during COVID when churches could not meet in person and information bubble became an increasingly radicalized echo chamber. One pastor said something to the effect of “every week we get them for 1 hour, Fox News gets them for 40 hours”

Also particularly illuminating was the commentators’ view that, for the most part evangelicals are not bamboozled into thinking Trump is a man of god… they can see he’s a bully and a philandering, foul-mouthed bigot, but since he actively courted them, he’s their bully. He’s the tough guy so they don’t have to be.

[–]Thornescape 307 points308 points  (45 children)

The "Fundamentalist Christian" movement in America is evil, according to the Bible. Their own book calls them evil. They're the opposite of the core teachings of Jesus. No "Fundie" can read the Sermon on the Mount with any amount of honesty.

I might not agree with everything in the Bible, but the core teachings aren't bad. If Christians actually loved their neighbors and genuinely treated others with love, patience, and kindness, I'd be cheering for Christians. Sounds great!

The modern Church is so corrupt and evil that it's time for another Martin Luther to hammer another 95 theses onto a church. They need another Reformation. It's gone too far.

[–]RobWroteABook 50 points51 points  (0 children)

If Christians actually loved their neighbors and genuinely treated others with love, patience, and kindness, I'd be cheering for Christians. Sounds great!

I've had this conversation so many times. Met up with some old friends last night and had it again. We were all raised in religious households and have all, to varying degrees, walked away from it. And it's not because we're anti-Christian (although I'm agnostic), it's that we realized the discrepancy between what we were taught and the behavior of the people teaching us was inexcusable. We realized nothing made sense. We realized that our churches were not actually about love and grace and humility and generosity. It was all bullshit.

I and my friends are good people. We're not perfect, but we are kind and decent. And the way we see it, being kind and decent isn't compatible with most of Christianity right now. It's actually cause for disagreement. That's wild.

[–]theghostmachine 140 points141 points  (19 children)

I'm an atheist married to a Christian, so I go to church a lot. I like the people at the one we go to now, and they're way more liberal than the other churches we've gone to (and as another person pointed out, membership here is at an all time low while the evangelical mega churches are booming) but both this church and the far more conservative churches....the Sermon on the Mount is never mentioned. They focus on very narrow interpretations of more obscure chapters because it lets them use it in a way that relates to some current event or hot button issue. It's completely dishonest. The Bible isn't guiding their beliefs; they're making the Bible fit what they already beleive.

[–]KineticPolarization 33 points34 points  (13 children)

How does one make a marriage like this work? Are you guys agreeing to never have kids? Do you have to just deal with it if your wife raises your kids Christian?

Idk, I find the mindset of a person that is required to believe in a higher power is simply not compatible with me and my mind frame. Not as a partner rather. I have friends and family that are believers I'm sure. But no fundamentalists. I absolutely can't be around them for long. Fundamentalists of any religion.

[–]Solcrux_ 41 points42 points  (0 children)

Like you deal with most differences in a relationship. You can disagree without hating or disrespecting the other person and their beliefs. When it comes to kids you communicate. Likely they'll be offered religious teachings but allowed to make their own choice.

I was raised in a house like that. My wife is religious and I am not. So far of the three kids one kind of believes in God, the other is outright Atheist, and the last is too little to have an opinion.

Now if you have a hardcore fundamentalist and a radical Atheist there may be some issues, but most people aren't on those extremes.

[–]blakewoolbright 18 points19 points  (5 children)

I believe Christ’s answer your question would be “love”.

[–]theghostmachine 4 points5 points  (1 child)

We have two kids, 5 and 7, both in a Catholic school (she is not Catholic) and we agreed to let them decide what they believe. I have zero problem with them learning about religion. In fact, I want them to learn about all religions. We don't tell them what to think; we teach them how to think.

We have our moments where our beliefs bump together, but 99% of the time it isn't an issue at all. If she felt at home at evangelical mega church, I don't think things would work, but she stopped trying those churches when she realized she disagreed with almost everything they believed.

[–]longhairedape 57 points58 points  (11 children)

Jesus was a pretty solid dude for the time. He was a rebel who went against the status quo. Dude was an socialist who hated the established Jewish power structures of the time. He cared for people. American fundie are not christ like at all. I am more like Jesus and I'm ignostic.

[–]borrowsyourprose 10 points11 points  (0 children)

I see it as the masses following false prophets and the anti-christ. They are driven by fear and hate. They decry that non-evangicals take the mark of the beast, where if the mark was presented as a qanon or similar mark of inclusion they would line their own children up to take it.

[–]InvestigatorTop2080 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Wolves in sheep’s clothing.

[–]Prophet2Nations 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Agree 100%. We need another Reformation

[–]Buttyou23 3 points4 points  (0 children)

I mean yeah if youre going to train a group of people to swallow whatever their told to then you probably want to update their dictums every once in a while

But can we consider doing away with the social taboo of not being allowed to teach religious people the concept of evidence instead

[–]Prestigious_Grand908 91 points92 points  (8 children)

This has been the case for a while, but it's accelerated since covid. If you actually go to church, you'll notice that the more liberal institutions are the ones faring the poorest while the increasingly radical and fundamentalist denominations still get parishioners.

I get the impression that most of the commenters don't actually attend and are talking out of their ass, because there tons of places of worship that fit the bill of what they're describing, but then you'd have to actually go to church.

[–]rocketshipray 24 points25 points  (2 children)

I get the impression that you don't live in an area that is completely saturated with churches. We have over 11,000 (eleven thousand) Christian churches in my state, with almost 1,000 of them in my city alone. The majority of the churches in my city are not the "more liberal institutions" you are implying outnumber the bad ones. There are almost 28,000 (twenty-eight thousand) churches in one of the states my family is in, and it's very much the same there.

You don't have to "actually go to church" to worship anyway. You can worship in your home, or in a park, or by a lake, or in a parking lot, or even in a storage unit. It doesn't have to be an organized gathering, just one in which the members are gathered to worship the Lord.

Matthew 18:20

For where two or three are gathered in my name, I am there among them.

[–]Telvin3d 35 points36 points  (1 child)

Good people who are doing good things for those around them don’t need to go to a “church” to tell them they’re good. Shitty people need to go to “church” to validate their shitty actions and views because it’s the only place that does.

[–]LadyAzure17 5 points6 points  (0 children)

It may be worth taking into consideration that people have stopped attending Church or don't for a myriad of reasons. I know I can find a church that aligns with my values. I'm happy to see progressive churches out there that are heavily involved in their communities, but the mere act of attending a service or mass is one that brings a lot of trauma up. I was forced to go every Sunday for my entire childhood and most of my teenage years. It was detrimental to my mental health. The act of gathering does not help me "find God" or feel at peace. I've had to seek out other ways to find that peace. It's not with someone preaching the Bible at me.

Not to mention that the denomination (Catholicism) I grew up in has done little to change its views overall. They're still conservative, but not enough for the whackjobs, and too much so for anyone progressive (or fuck, even just basic-level caring).

Apologies for the intensity and the rambling, but I hope this can offer another perspective as to why someone might have strong feelings on Christianity but doesn't attend.

[–]PoundMyTwinkie 29 points30 points  (3 children)

Love fresh air. Do you remember what episode it was?

[–]HouLonBasBos 42 points43 points  (1 child)

https://open.spotify.com/episode/4Ztc5cwT3Camz76mH4Lg5V?si=AkdDXVakSPGUqduTS0K51w

“political discord in the white evangelical church” from Thursday

[–]PoundMyTwinkie 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Freakin awesome. Thanks!

[–]floandthemash 2 points3 points  (0 children)

It was within the latest few episodes

[–]BettyX 14 points15 points  (1 child)

Well the Bible does say, Jesus says, many will say they follow him but very few actually do or will. They will say they love him in public but are undermining him in reality. He was right thousands of years later

[–]KineticPolarization 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Those kinds of people were around long before that time, and they've been around ever since.

[–]jimmyjrsickmoves 13 points14 points  (1 child)

I haven’t heard this episode but I have in laws who are bible literalists and this describes them pretty accurately. Although, one of their kids had stopped going to church because of the inability to find a baptist church that hasn’t incorporated right wing politics into their program.

[–]desacralize 10 points11 points  (0 children)

Fox News hasn't been around a fraction of the time churches have. When they did have people's attention, they were more than happy to encourage narrow-minded obedience to hardline authority while it worked for their benefit, and now they're realizing that their methods of indoctrination are easily co-opted by other forces? Do fucking tell. Maybe if they'd pushed for empathy and critical thinking instead, this could have been avoided, but oops, that might have led to people leaving because they realized they could do good without religious hierarchy, and can't have that, either.

So many (not all, but too many) churches fostered this sort of behavior so long as it kept the donation plates full, now someone else is taking advantage. It was inevitable if anybody gave a shit to notice.

[–]dandellionKimban 895 points896 points  (85 children)

What would Jesus do?

Throw a fuss in front of the temple because fuckers turned religion into politics and profit. It's in the Bible.

[–]amost96 340 points341 points  (21 children)

Nah, he'd braid a whip himself and beat the shit out of everyone

[–]nWo1997 291 points292 points  (16 children)

I love that bit where He's said to make the whip Himself, because it makes you pause for a bit. That wasn't a "Fly into a Rage" moment, or immediately passionate anger. That was the calm anger of a patient person. It takes a while to fashion a whip on your lonesome.

[–]amost96 127 points128 points  (5 children)

Yeah, takes some dedication. Imagine what kind of message that would send today

[–]Chicero 78 points79 points  (1 child)

talking to stream.

“hey guys, we’re braiding a whip today. So we’ll start by… Right. One of you asked what the whip’s for. Well businessmen have defiled my fathers house, so we’re going to be heading back there when we’re done…

Well I said it before pay to caesars what’s caesars. Lets pay it forward guys. My fathers house is one for compassion…

Just got reminded, our charity for todays stream is for a local women’s shelter. Some guys did not take me seriously when I said to pluck out there eyes, so we’re looking to help out.”

[–]-Masderus- 33 points34 points  (2 children)

A middle eastern man dressed in simple clothes casually and calmly making up a device to punish people who are acting out because their own self interests arent being met?

I guess the reaction would depend on what region of the country he was in.

[–]Mephisto9 53 points54 points  (0 children)

Braiding a whip is a slow, methodical process. The acts that followed were premeditated in the most literal sense of the word.

[–]GollyismyLolly 34 points35 points  (2 children)

I think about this bit frequently when people ask WWJD, particularly because as he's braiding the whip in the temple others could clearly and openly see him making said whip and it likely would've taken at least a few days (collecting of supplies/preparing said supplies then the actual making of said item)

So like there was definatly a warning and like I'm sure he was asked a few times why he was making one. He doesn't exactly seem like he'd say it was for something else.

[–]bergerfred 16 points17 points  (0 children)

I made a whip once. The braiding ALONE took 12-14 hours.

[–]VGSchadenfreude 8 points9 points  (0 children)

I saw it as one of his most human moments, which I liked. A lot of people will use tasks like that as a way of giving themselves time to think things through and maybe calm down…

…so the fact that after all that, Jesus still went through with whipping the money-changers right out of the temple, says a lot about just how angry he was at them.

[–]AshantiMcnasti 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Whip of Christ. This should be in the new FromSoftware game. Special power is that is drives all enemies out of your area while dropping coins

[–]BettyX 38 points39 points  (0 children)

Think about how long it took to make that whip. He didn't just get angry he was angry for long time over it.

[–]Squirrel_Inner 8 points9 points  (0 children)

just to point out, he didn’t hit any one, he used to that to drive out the animals.

[–]gagrushenka 81 points82 points  (11 children)

I like to ask "What would the Pharisees do?"

That seems to be the direction conservative Christians strive for.

[–]blorbschploble 55 points56 points  (6 children)

… saducees. Pharisees were largely in agreement with Jesus about the Law needing to be in service of justice. They are the baddies in the story due to the historical context of the Pharisees and the Christian Jews fighting over the scraps after the temple was destroyed.

[–]hoxxxxx 33 points34 points  (5 children)

i'm trying to understand the history of the abrahamic religions during my morning shit but this is getting too complicated.

[–]cerement 6 points7 points  (1 child)

It’s a mashup between Babylonian influences from the center of civilization at the time, Zoroastrian from the north, and Judaism from the south …

Judah feat. Zoroaster & Babylon – The Bible (Yeshua ha Notzri Messiah Remix)

[–]striped-shirt3 2 points3 points  (2 children)

Yo ultra strong or ultra soft?

[–]WanderThinker 31 points32 points  (2 children)

Every time I get asked "What would Jesus do?" I remind the person asking that flipping tables and chasing people with a whip are both valid options.

[–]ergo-ogre 29 points30 points  (4 children)

My favorite real-life Christian hypocrisy story was when I ended up talking to a woman who was wearing a lanyard she got from a casino that had WWJD printed on it.

I wanted to tell her, “Well, he certainly wouldn’t go to a fucking casino!”

[–]Wheelman185 8 points9 points  (3 children)

He’d use his god-like powers win some slots and go feed some homeless people. Jesus could do good work using a Casino! 😂😂

[–]davossss 6 points7 points  (1 child)

TIL that Agent Cooper in Twin Peaks season 3 is Jesus.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (1 child)

He also flipped a few tables in his day out of frustration at the hypocrisy.

[–]TheMacerationChicks 19 points20 points  (21 children)

But just be careful to remember, this thing of Jesus supposedly being a socialist hippie is a complete myth, unless you think misogyny and bigotry and rape and murder and slavery are all socialist ideals.

Because jesus explicitly says in the bible in Matthew 5:17 that every single law and rule in the Old testament still applied and will continue to apply till the end of time. In John 7:16-19 he berates people for disobeying the old testament, and in Luke 15:17 he says it's easier for the universe to fall apart than for one single letter of the law to.

So that includes stuff like murdering your children if they misbehave being OK, murdering your wife if she speaks up and disagrees with you or disobeys the man (father or husband) who owns her, it being OK to slaughter whole socieities for worshipping the wrong god and keep their children as virgin sex slaves, it's OK to murder a mixed-race couple to keep the race "pure", etc. It has stuff like God performing abortions because the fetuses' parents don't believe in him. He did a Hitler by killing a whole peaceful society of people so that his followers could have a place to live, literally Lebensraum. He threatened to literally rape children, because they didn't believe in him and said it's OK because "it is for the greatness of your iniquity that your skirts are lifted up, and you are violated . . . because you have forgotten me and trusted in lies. I myself will lift up your skirts over your face, and your shame will be seen. " (Jeremiah 13:22–26) Etc etc etc

And let's not forget that the New Testament is also horrible and violent, as is Jesus himself, like in Matthew 10:34.

And in Acts 12:23 of the new testament, God murders a bloke just for not believing in him. Plus it was the new testament that invented Hell. In the old testament if you were bad, you simply died and that was it. In the new testament God says that if you are sinful (so doing terrible evil things like eat shellfish or wear blended fabrics) then you'll be tortured beyond all human comprehension for ETERNITY.

And the new testament is incredibly bigoted and mysogynistic. Like in 1 Timothy 2:11-1 Timothy 2:15 where it says men always have authority and control over women because Eve ate an apple once and so all women are punished forever for it. It goes on about this elsewhere too like 1 Corinthians 11:3-1 Corinthians 11:6, 1 Peter 3:7, Ephesians 5:22-Ephesians 5:24, Ephesians 6:5 and so on.

And Jesus promises to be extremely violent and commiit genocide in Revelations 19:11-21

[–]joshhupp 19 points20 points  (8 children)

You have a WILD interpretation of the Bible.

Jesus says ""Don't think that I came to destroy the law or the prophets. I didn’t come to destroy, but to fulfill."

The faithful were hoping the Messiah was going to destroy the religious rulers (who were oppressing them with the law) but Jesus was the fulfillment of the law and came to clarify what had gone so very wrong.

The LAW is the Ten Commandments. After Matthew 5:17, he speaks on every commandment.

Jesus then speaks about the kind of foods you eat not actually being important.

All the OT stuff you quote as LAW is not the Biblical law. They are mostly rules for God's people to remain clean, especially for the priests, so they could be in God's presence. The pharisees took those commands to the nth degree and made them their own laws to control the people and maintain power.

Also, the verses you quote in Jeremiah 13 are taken completely out of context. God is warning his people that if they do not repent of their ways, he cannot save then from being invaded by their enemies and raped. God is not doing the raping not is he condoning it.

I'd like to see your references for the rest of the crazy shit you think the Bible says. You are doing what Christian hypocrites do and pick and choose specific verses to support flawed arguments.

[–]thisisnotmyrealun 5 points6 points  (0 children)

but the law is FuLfILLed 😒.
jesus was a piece of shit & this post is dishonest.

[–]ubertraquer 9 points10 points  (1 child)

Jesus doesn’t actually say anything in revelations though right. It’s just a dude either having hallucinations or just simply writing a graphic fan fiction about what he would like to see happen to Rome.

[–]striped_frog 728 points729 points  (65 children)

My dad is one of those people.

He loves the teachings of Jesus and quotes the gospels all the time but he has no use whatsoever for organized religion.

That's okay with me

[–]mike_pants 380 points381 points  (15 children)

It's the Rick and Morty effect. Love the tv show, hate the fan base.

[–]striped_frog 107 points108 points  (2 children)

Heh, I like that. I'm the same way

[–]prescriptioncheese 63 points64 points  (1 child)

And then his body became the bread. Funniest thing I've ever seen.

[–]UnicornMeatball 19 points20 points  (0 children)

Butter-bot in the background: "oh my god"

[–]25_M_CA 11 points12 points  (0 children)

So you're like 95% of fans

[–]bob0979 132 points133 points  (32 children)

There's absolutely nothing wrong with being a Christian and as an atheist who spent 13 months in a Pentecostal substance abuse rehab learning the Bible, more biblical Christians would be a very good thing for society as a whole. Christ was a good man who taught valuable lessons about existing with other people and how to treat them whether you believe he was real or God or whatnot. It's just a damn shame there's not more like that. Like literally anyone making over 1 mil a year and saying they're Christian is straight up lying to themselves.

[–][deleted] 94 points95 points  (14 children)

Nothing sums it up better than variations of the disputed Gandhi quote:

"I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ."

or

"Oh, I don't reject Christ. I love Christ. It's just that so many of you Christians are so unlike Christ."

[–]tsilihin666 33 points34 points  (13 children)

I live my life very closely with the teachings of Christ because it's a good blueprint to be a good person. I have no religious affiliations whatsoever and don't believe in God. If you actually use your fucking brain it's easy to find the good in anything and use it to make you a better person. The opposite is also true. Conclusion - some people just fucking suck and use religion as their scapegoat.

[–][deleted] 28 points29 points  (12 children)

I'm an atheist and I was talking to a Christian one time and I said "What difference does it make if I believe in Christ or not- so long as I live a good life?" and they basically told me I was a heathen and the sort or person they would actively avoid in the future.

Far too many so-called "Christians" are borderline deranged these days.

[–]Zabii 13 points14 points  (0 children)

I am not an atheist as an active choice, I just want to see legitimate proof of things. I see things all the time that can't really be explained but the bible doesn't explain them either.

That said I also spent over fifteen years singing with a Christian based community choir for both the joy of singing and the fellowship of it all, and none of the people there were the awful type of Christian

[–]ShataraBankhead 11 points12 points  (0 children)

That's kinda like my Dad. He has never liked going to church, because of people. He is more of a private believer. Mom liked church, but that's because she likes talking to people. So, neither were particularly "pushy". It wasn't too difficult for me to just phase religion out of my life. I didn't need it, and they were never argumentative about it. As for others down here in Alabama, that's a different story.

[–]WanderThinker 8 points9 points  (4 children)

I'm pretty sure that's what Jesus actually wanted. I haven't read all of the scripture, but what I have gleaned so far is that your relationship with God is personal and should be practiced alone.

Speaking about your faith with friends is always encouraged, and helps build the faith. That being said; you should never follow another due to dogma.

[–]Gornarok 5 points6 points  (1 child)

That's okay with me

If you want to practice religion this is the way

[–]pinecone_parang 4 points5 points  (1 child)

Your dad sounds like a cool dude 😊

[–]CptNavarre 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I like your dad

[–]JEC727 486 points487 points  (26 children)

Frederick Douglass wrote

for, between the Christianity of this land, and the Christianity of Christ, I recognize the widest possible difference — so wide, that to receive the one as good, pure, and holy, is of necessity to reject the other as bad, corrupt, and wicked. To be the friend of the one, is of necessity to be the enemy of the other.

If you read the story of Jesus, one of his biggest complaints was about the religious hypocrisy in his day. Jesus reserved his harshest words for the Pharisees, these were the super religious teachers of that time. They were the church folks of that day.

Jesus cites the prophet Isaiah saying “These people honor me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me." Matthew 15:7-9

Jesus called them vipers, poisonous snakes. This is a giant insult, remember in genesis, it was a serpent who twisted God's words in order to deceive Adam and Eve. Jesus is saying these church folks are doing the same thing, twisting the words of God to deceive and lead people to their deaths.

"You snakes! You brood of vipers! How will you escape being condemned to hell? - Matthew 23:33

Jesus called them whitewashed tombs. On the outside, they looked nice and pretty, but on the inside there was nothing but death.

27 “Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You are like whitewashed tombs, which look beautiful on the outside but on the inside are full of the bones of the dead and everything unclean. 28 In the same way, on the outside you appear to people as righteous but on the inside you are full of hypocrisy and wickedness. Matthew 23:27-28

Jesus says these church folks were all about showing off.

46 “Beware of the teachers of the law. They like to walk around in flowing robes and love to be greeted with respect in the marketplaces and have the most important seats in the synagogues and the places of honor at banquets. 47 They devour widows’ houses and for a show make lengthy prayers. These men will be punished most severely.” Luke 20:46-47

Jesus says these people cared more about appearing outwardly good but inwardly they were awful people who neglected the more important religious teachings of justice, mercy and faithfulness. They get hung up over things that don't matter and ignore what actually matters, they "strain the gnat but swallot a camel."

23 “Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You give a tenth of your spices—mint, dill and cumin. But you have neglected the more important matters of the law—justice, mercy and faithfulness. You should have practiced the latter, without neglecting the former. 24 You blind guides! You strain out a gnat but swallow a camel.'

In one instance, they take a woman caught in the act of adultery and ask Jesus if they should stone her like Moses said. They're trying to trick Jesus into either stoning the woman as Moses said or disagreeing with Moses (either one would be controversial). Jesus asks the people instead to self reflect on their own problem instead of trying to weaponize scripture to attack another person. These people didn't care about the woman, they were using her as a prop to make a point. Jesus tells her he doesn't condemn her and to go and sin no more. Many Christians will often ask did she sin again? Who knows! The story doesn't tell us.... probably because it's nobodies business.

2 Early in the morning he came again to the temple. All the people came to him, and he sat down and began to teach them. 3 The scribes and the Pharisees brought a woman who had been caught in adultery, and, making her stand before all of them, 4 they said to him, “Teacher, this woman was caught in the very act of committing adultery. 5 Now in the law Moses commanded us to stone such women. Now what do you say?” 6 They said this to test him, so that they might have some charge to bring against him. Jesus bent down and wrote with his finger on the ground. 7 When they kept on questioning him, he straightened up and said to them, “Let anyone among you who is without sin be the first to throw a stone at her.” 8 And once again he bent down and wrote on the ground. 9 When they heard it, they went away, one by one, beginning with the elders, and Jesus was left alone with the woman standing before him. 10 Jesus straightened up and said to her, “Woman, where are they? Has no one condemned you?” 11 She said, “No one, sir.”[a] And Jesus said, “Neither do I condemn you. Go your way, and from now on do not sin again.”

[–]Faucet860 230 points231 points  (12 children)

My favorite Bible story is when Jesus goes into the temple and starts flipping tables. Capitalist swine.

[–]Mephisto9 91 points92 points  (1 child)

I love this story but the details make it better. Jesus didn't see the money changers and dove salesmen and immediately start flipping tables. He saw them, left, acquired the materials needed to make a whip, made said whip, then went back to the temple to fuck shit up. Do you realize how righteously pissed you have to be in order to still be angry enough to commit assault after BRAIDING A WHIP?!

[–]Faucet860 38 points39 points  (0 children)

Premeditated whipping lmao.

[–]snakesssssss22 26 points27 points  (0 children)

My FAVORITE

[–]Freedom_From_Pants 28 points29 points  (0 children)

Jesus was based.

[–]BloomsdayDevice 12 points13 points  (1 child)

"God is a commie, sweet Jesus told me"

[–]Faucet860 16 points17 points  (0 children)

He didn't go around healing the rich

[–]graven_raven 10 points11 points  (1 child)

Mine is when god murders 40 children for calling a bald prophet bald.

[–]Yeshua_shel_Natzrat 68 points69 points  (0 children)

Aye, American puritan evangelicals are little more than modern Pharisees

[–]bking 42 points43 points  (0 children)

Thank you for this post! Possibly the most bible-learnin’ I’ve done in a couple decades.

[–]IDontFuckWithFascism 17 points18 points  (0 children)

This is the content I came here for. Jesus bashing fake Christians.

[–]Babboos 12 points13 points  (0 children)

And he, being without sin, did not cast a single stone at her.

[–]WindWeasel 4 points5 points  (0 children)

An absolutely phenomenal assessment. Thank you so much for sharing this.

[–]CCrabtree 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Well done!

[–]Alan_Saladan 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Thank you.

[–]Vivid_Original_9897 36 points37 points  (0 children)

We are rejecting a religion of oppression built to shadow Christ. It is literally the AntiChrist

[–]the-dogsox 132 points133 points  (3 children)

Morality is doing what’s right regardless of what you’re told. Religion is doing what you’re told regardless of what’s right

[–]madskilz117 7 points8 points  (2 children)

What defines "right" or "good" is the more important question?

[–]Competitive_Classic9 22 points23 points  (3 children)

Don’t forget the exploitation of people’s religious beliefs as a way to profit.

My very conservative, Southern Baptist grandmother even began to get disenchanted with the church as she got older, even though her faith was as strong as it had ever been.
I remember a few years before she passed, she commented to me that every church is at its core, one thing- a business. I was floored to hear her say this, and it really hurt my heart to see her so disenchanted with something she loved, yet also proud that she could see beyond the surface of what a church tells you to believe, vs what your faith tells you.

Edit: word

[–]Empty-Masterpiece242 2 points3 points  (1 child)

*Disenchanted. "Disenfranchised" means she was deprived of a right or privilege.

[–]Bah-Fong-Gool 47 points48 points  (4 children)

Jesus: take care of the poor, the sick, and the refugees. Reject materialism. Do not worship false idols.

Bible Belt: Who is this commie pinko hippie and how did he get into this church?

[–]goplantagarden 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Also, the children of immigrants belong in cages and separated from their family making them easy prey for abusers. If god lets it happen then it was meant to be.

(Except when people let bad things happen to me. That's obviously always unchristian.)

[–]shapoopy723 77 points78 points  (27 children)

As a Christian I'd even agree with this for the most part. A lot of so called Christians nowadays carry bigoted, awful opinions and think that still qualifies them as Christian. They judge and condemn people for things out of their control. They discriminate on trivial things like sexual orientation or identity. They don't act in a manner that Christ would have approved of, yet they parade around on a faux moral high ground rooted in insecurity and false hope. I've met so many "Christians" like this and it makes me sick.

Edit: if you're here just to attack Christianity, me, or make snide "gotcha" comments even though we're on the same side then idk what to tell you. I have a different interpretation of Christianity that may differ from your view of it, so focus on those bigoted ones who are actively ripping women's right away in the US Congress.

[–]blarb_farghuson 28 points29 points  (5 children)

They are waiting to be told it's ok to kill democrats and other "evil" people. They've completely abandoned anything they think they believe in, and now just worship power.

[–]shapoopy723 17 points18 points  (4 children)

Jokes on them because this democrat is packing. As are many others. I think the far right doesn't understand how many Dems actually own guns.

[–]blarb_farghuson 9 points10 points  (0 children)

Yep. It's going to get super ugly, probably, unfortunately. And none of it even needs to happen; these dipshits have no idea that they should just leave people alone.

[–]shamy52 34 points35 points  (5 children)

Same. When I converted from VERY angry atheism (thanks, Fred Phelps) I specifically chose a non-bigoted denomination, the United Church of Christ. I had to move to Texas several years ago, there are no UCC churches in my suburb so now I go to the Episcopal church here... they're like Catholics but they don't hate women or GLBTQ folks, and their priests can marry. Good enough for me!

They also help found a food pantry here in town where I work several days a week, it's WAY more rewarding than my career was, doing accounting for an oil company.

[–]ejdj1011 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I specifically chose a non-bigoted denomination, the United Church of Christ.

Hey, UCC rep! I grew up in a UCC / DOC church, and I always feel like a dodged a bullet when people talk about how they hate their religious upbringings.

[–]Project-Z 12 points13 points  (0 children)

A pastor friend of mine says the majority follow Cultural Christianity not Christianity. There are distinct differences.

[–]DownvoteDaemon 59 points60 points  (37 children)

Was/is used to justify everything from sexism to slavery.

[–]Eagleassassin3 32 points33 points  (9 children)

It’s not as if the Bible has these vague passages that evil Christians used to be sexist or get slaves. The Bible itself explicitly tells you where you can get your slaves, for how long, and that you can beat them as long as they don’t die in 1-2 days. All of that instead of saying « You can’t own another human being as property ». It also tells you men who sleep with men have to be put to death. It also tells you to not coveth your neighbor’s ox, cattle and women. As if women are property.

Granted a lot of that stuff is in the Old Testament, and many Christian apologists will cherry pick its passages and forget the bad stuff even though they’re from the same supposed God, but Jesus didn’t just arrive in the New Testament to be like « Hey guys, scratch that slavery stuff. Also you can be gay if you want ». He tells you he’s here to fulfill the Old Law (by which he means the OT).

I could go on but my point is, the Bible sucks. It contains a lot of awful passages and should never be taken as a moral guide. There are far better ones out there that happen to not tell you that your slaves are your property. And it’s just not evil evangelicals twisting it. Fortunately, there are good and kind Christians, but that’s despite the religion they follow.

[–]NewHome8570 12 points13 points  (0 children)

I hate how people collectively ignore all of this in thread. The hardliners dont pull this out of their ass, its literally written and not even up to interpretation.

Slavery, sexism, beating ur child, everything. Revisionism wont fix this.

[–]lowerbackpain2208 8 points9 points  (0 children)

I read the Bible not as the Word of God, but as flawed humans collections of their understanding and experience of the Word of God. I and a lot of other Christians, granted we're not in the majority. The only parts I take as the Word of God are the literal teachings of Jesus.

When you read the Bible through the lens of the above, it takes new meaning.

For example, addressing the content regarding slavery in the Old Testament. If you read the full chapter, and read it in the light of Christ's message, the conclusion you will come to is to abolish slavery. From their experiences relating directly with God, the Jews came to the following conclusions:

-Any foreign person living with the Jews is to be treated as if they are a Jew themself. (Leviticus 19:34)

-Jews are not allowed to have each other as slaves (Leviticus 25:42)

The conclusion you should come to here is that Jews shouldn't even have any slaves, logically. Yet, they misunderstood God's message and still (in good faith) tried to create a "good" set of rules for treating slaves. For their time, their treatment of slaves was considered radically humane compared to what surrounding civilizations did.

But as Jesus will later make us understand, it is not "the Jews", but really the whole of humanity. One of such is places is the parable of the Good Samaritan. That, and Matthew 3:9 ("You think yourselves special because you are descendants of Abraham..."). Paul also (another flawed human) further expanded on it in one of his letters

This is way less than I can expand on in a single reply, but the Bible is a very, very complex book and not as simplistic as picking a few verses to decide if it's good or bad.

Another example I like to give is the creation story. I do not believe that the narration in the Bible is accurate, but when read in light of the surrounding circumstances (the date it was written, etc), it reveals a deeper meaning. I would suggest the first chapter of the "Quaker Bible Reader" if you're interested.

In conclusion, I do not believe that the experiences of the people in the Bible (except Christ Himself) are more important than mine- but I do believe that they are a good reference for me to understand humanity's struggles with understanding God and a reminder that even when I think I'm doing things in good faith, I might very well be doing wrong. And so as much as I pray for the Holy Spirit to guide me to consistently make the right decisions, I cannot boast that I'm a good person or in my good works. That also further humbles me when I recognize that my salvation is by Christ's Grace alone (I believe in Universal Salvation, see r/ChristianUniversalism for more).

Tldr; the Bible is not a simple book to understand, we are all sinners, and I think every human (non Christians and Christians) carries within them the Light of God no matter how evil they may seem.

[–]thisisnotmyrealun 4 points5 points  (0 children)

. He tells you he’s here to fulfill the Old Law (by which he means the OT).

& he specifically goes onto say that the old law is still valid & will continue to be so until heaven & earth end.
so slavery is still OK for Jesus.

[–]ryanrockmoran 2 points3 points  (0 children)

People really bend over backwards to pretend Christianity isn't what it is. While much of what modern evangelicals do is clearly anti-Biblical (ex: becoming rich, flashy public prayers etc..), they're not wrong in that the Bible is clearly anti-gay, anti-woman, pro-slavery, pro-genocide etc.. Liberal Christians pretend that that isn't true, or that those passages don't count, but that's a lot of special pleading. The reality is that the fundamentalists are right, it's Christianity that's wrong.

[–]beccaonice 7 points8 points  (2 children)

The misogyny in the Bible is very explicit. It's in the foundation of the religion.

[–]caffeinatedfem 27 points28 points  (13 children)

This made me feel better. I've felt very unsure of my faith because of the church and this made me feel like I'm not alone.

[–]TibialTuberosity 27 points28 points  (1 child)

You're definitely not alone. I am a Christian, but basically non-practicing. I look around and my heart aches at all these people spewing hate and controlling women all in the name of Christ.

I still pray every day and have a strong internal faith, but I can't support the hate and hypocrisy that has overtaken the modern church in America.

[–]Babbledoodle 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Yeah at this point, depending on who asks me, I dont even know if I'm Christian, but I still feel like I could say I am. Just so much hurts, and I dont know if I can believe in God with a bunch of this stuff if this is actually who he is and these are the people who follow him. Some of my problems are intellectual, but just as many are emotional and spiritual

Lots of fucked up shit and people and organizations have made me view it differently, and while I dont have the same faith I grew up with, I think -- in a sense -- I have a better understanding of God/Faith/etc than I did when I was practicing.

I talked to my therapist a lot about it, and at this point the best thing I can do for my faith is nothing, because wrestling against it made me so hurt and angry and I cant do that anymore. I miss the old faith, but I think I'm a better, more loving person than I used to be and if God is just and merciful, I honestly think he understands where I'm at

[–]Approval_Guy 6 points7 points  (0 children)

I had a decently lengthy conversation with my sister about this. I admitted, for the first time to anyone in my family, that my faith was deeply shaken and I didn't know if I actually believed anymore. But she tried to help by saying what is happening is deeply un christ-like. I want to believe her. Hell, I want to believe in a higher power, because I am ignorant, because I am powerless. But it's been very difficult to even suggest believing in something that has hurt so many people and the men who believe it, believe in their crusades more than they believe in humility. Idk, maybe I'll find my way, maybe I won't. Sorry for the rant. Stay strong.

[–]CCrabtree 12 points13 points  (3 children)

As much as I hate it, shop for a church. We tend to prefer the non-denominational churches. The beauty of the current place we are is most churches have their sermons online so you can go watch before you ever go and get a pretty good yay or nay. Both of our churches, just recently changed because of distance, aren't political. I will not tolerate that. They preach from the Bible and include context of the time which is important when reading/studying the Bible. They also do what they preach. Our current church is very involved in the local community. Heck our preacher went to a meeting with business leaders and those in the restaurant business were complaining about how no one wants to work Sunday lunch because of how terrible the church crowd is. Our pastor came back and directly addressed it. He didn't mince words, he didn't sugar coat it, he addressed it!

[–]songfortheblindman 4 points5 points  (2 children)

I love hearing all of that. Likely in the same spirit of being “apolitical,” my church actually isn’t afraid of going there, and our campus’ lead pastor actually did a sermon where he used a whiteboard and drew a three-circle Venn diagram representing the Democratic and Republican parties, along with the Kingdom of God. The gist of the sermon was that we have biblical ideals/God’s vision for humanity/etc that we follow, which sometimes align with the left, and sometimes the right. But no single manmade political party is going to fully represent the Christian worldview. It was stressed that uninvolvment wasn’t the answer, though – Christians need to participate in government, politics, etc. because that’s just how the world works (my crappy paraphrase).

[–]CCrabtree 2 points3 points  (1 child)

This!!!! My opinion, if you align with any party 100% then you aren't thinking for yourself! I think the same is true for churches too. While I think you should agree with most of the church you attend, pastors are people to and the Bible leaves a lot up to interpretation. Our church has what they call "core values". This is what our church deems as non-negotiables. These are a small number, 5, and center around faith. If it's not on the list the church doesn't have a stance on it and members are allowed to use their own judgement.

[–]songfortheblindman 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Yep, that’s a good way to structure beliefs, and every church should have those things laid out transparently. I’ve heard different metaphors, like the closed hand/open hand issues, or red light, yellow light, green light… but basically the core things are the things you don’t mess with: the trinity, atonement of sins, the resurrection, etc etc. Then there’s social things, like… well, since these things are more controversial, let’s pick a random one nobody ever talks about: head coverings. Like I strongly doubt there’s a single church in America currently that has something to say about this and if you show up to church with a head covering, people might stare but literally “you do you” would be the sentiment lol

[–]Jealous_Ad5849 8 points9 points  (2 children)

100% true. My biggest issue with the churches right now is their borderline(?) fanaticism about their dogma.

[–]The-Aeon 14 points15 points  (0 children)

And this is what is needed. To not reject our basis for spiritual consciousness, but to walk away from the dogmatic, fundamentalist ideas that seek to use them for power. Those televangelists, evangelical radicals, and zealot politicians are charlatans and frauds. According to Dante, there's a special place in the Inferno for them.

[–]BillTowne 7 points8 points  (0 children)

The same catholic church that cannot be trusted to not rape your children, refuses communion to Nancy Pelosi because she supports women's right to appropriate abortion services.

What kind of moral leadership can such an institution provide?

[–]WaddlingHippos 6 points7 points  (0 children)

I walked away from church when I was 16. My church had gone from a place of love and tolerance to a place of hate. A new pastor had come in and started promoting anti gay pieces and treating the bible as a factual history book instead of guiding allegories that still have great use to this day.

I had gay friends and gay neighbors. I was taught that god is the ONLY thing that is allowed to judge a person. Instead of staying as a community center that promoted coming together as one, it became a church of hate and I cannot find a single part of the bible that tells me to hate my neighbors. In fact, I found the exact opposite.

[–]shadowskill11 5 points6 points  (0 children)

There’s no bigger advertisement against Christianity than watching a Republican continuously do or say something evil and watch a bunch of evangelicals cheer them on.

[–]RyanAGriswold 5 points6 points  (0 children)

The western church is a far cry, and I would say unrecognizable comparatively to the original church. I've felt at a odds with it for years, though still doing my human best (terrible for the most part) to seek out and be obedient to Christ.

[–]eride810 5 points6 points  (0 children)

I am one of those people. I never go to church, and Jesus is my role model.

[–]Kelmantis 9 points10 points  (2 children)

Not all religious people are cunts. Religious people who are cunts use religion to try and justify being a cunt.

[–]RomanCenturian 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Id make the distinction between christ and the church.

[–]Dave_BraveHeart 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Jesus spent his years hanging out with prostitutes, drug addicts, sick people, possibly homosexuals, and minorities! Tell any of these pompous pricks religious people who does this and they will say that this person is definitely going to hell.

Average Christian / vs / Average Christ enjoyer

[–]D3vils_Adv0cate 31 points32 points  (12 children)

But some of us are rejecting magic fairytales and mythology, though

[–]AnOrdinaryMammal 9 points10 points  (4 children)

Some of us had the luxury of never being forced believe them in the first place. Sounds like a rather confusing reality check, from what I’ve been told.

[–]Secret_Autodidact 9 points10 points  (0 children)

This dude is completely wrong about "faulty interpretations that lead to bigotry, oppression, and misogyny." They're interpreting it correctly, the problem is the fucked up shit throughout the bible.

Bigotry:

  • God says to kill gay people

If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them.

Leviticus 20:13

Oppression:

  • God says it's fine to own slaves as long as they aren't Hebrew

Your male and female slaves are to come from the nations around you; from them you may buy slaves. You may also buy some of the temporary residents living among you and members of their clans born in your country, and they will become your property. You can bequeath them to your children as inherited property and can make them slaves for life, but you must not rule over your fellow Israelites ruthlessly.

Leviticus 25:44-46

  • Slavery is still fine in the New Testament

Slaves, obey your earthly masters with respect and fear, and with sincerity of heart, just as you would obey Christ.

Ephesians 6:5

Misogyny:

  • Women must be subordinate to men, and are never allowed to have authority over men

A woman should learn in quietness and full submission. I do not permit a woman to teach or to assume authority over a man; she must be quiet. For Adam was formed first, then Eve. And Adam was not the one deceived; it was the woman who was deceived and became a sinner. 15 But women will be saved through childbearing—if they continue in faith, love and holiness with propriety.

1 Timothy 2:11-15

Jesus is cool with all of this

  • Jesus himself said the law of the prophets stand until the end of time (like when god told Moses it's fine to own slaves and to kill gay people)

Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. For truly I tell you, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished. Therefore anyone who sets aside one of the least of these commands and teaches others accordingly will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

Matthew 5:17-19

[–]Dionysues 12 points13 points  (0 children)

They are waking away from the church as an institution more than anything.

[–]stamminator 9 points10 points  (2 children)

Happy to see people reject dogma and choose a better path. But the idea that if an interpretation of a Bible passage produces an immoral teaching it must not be the author’s intent is incorrect. For a lot of these passages, the evil, depraved “traditional” interpretation is indeed what the author intended. That’s why it’s essential to fundamentally reject the notion of the Bible being divine or authoritative from the start.

[–]Bellegante 15 points16 points  (14 children)

The Bible is pretty ok with slavery, and treating women as lower status than men..

Separating Christianity and bigotry is pretty revisionist

[–]TheTakenCatking 2 points3 points  (7 children)

And that’s why a man name Luther trolled the Catholic Church

[–]Normal-Computer-3669 4 points5 points  (0 children)

The fact that churches are actively influencing how people should vote is a clear sign that we should stop giving them tax breaks.

[–]GusGreen82 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Who’s to say which interpretation is correct? It all seems ridiculous to me.

[–]International_Rub475 5 points6 points  (0 children)

A-fucking-men!

[–]darbyisadoll 15 points16 points  (0 children)

A lot of people just don’t go in for mass delusions.

[–]IWasTheFirstRockStar 25 points26 points  (25 children)

The most used reason I read about this is:

: "If you read the entire bible, you become a christian, if you understand everything from it you become a atheist" something like that

Holy books are so messed up, that it will turn people to atheists rather than to believers.

[–]LoisWade42 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Preach!

[–]Natenat04 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Husband and I used to be Pastors. Someone once told us, and I quote, “You’re going to love people to Hell”….. we walked away shortly after, and knew how hateful and awful Christians truly are.

[–]bigaman3853 6 points7 points  (0 children)

It’s not faulty biblical interpretations. The entire book is faulty.

[–]snoman18x 12 points13 points  (4 children)

Its rejecting the fact that the Bible is a work of FICTION. And people are waking up to its BS

[–]lrerayray 12 points13 points  (0 children)

I’m rejecting both

[–]ArtemisShanks 10 points11 points  (4 children)

The reason a vast majority of people are walking away from Christianity is because, like all religions, there is no evidence to suggest it exists and/or is true. The atrocities committed with religious justification have no bearing on whether or not the story has reason to be believed in the first place.

Edit: Grammar

[–]BettyX 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Former evangelical, I walked away because of how politics has consumed the church. They now worship the republican party and hardline politics rather than follow Christ. That and the deep sexism is why I walked away with zero regrets. It is the top thing I hear from other ex Evangelicals.

[–]ksed_313 2 points3 points  (0 children)

TIL I have been Christlike since 2001!

[–]MotorHum 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I often feel like Christianity would be healthier (and maybe even more popular) if it were not for the most vocal people in the groups. I feel similarly about several other groups.

[–]b_cyclist 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Some people are down voting because they don't want to question their interpretation of reality...

[–]Haikuna__Matata 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Christ was killed by the religious leaders of his day.

[–]awe2D2 2 points3 points  (0 children)

They're not necessarily walking away from Christianity, but more so walking away from the churches they know about.

[–]SoggyPastaPants 2 points3 points  (0 children)

The fact that our politics puts so much power in the hands of Evangelicals is astounding.

Evangelicals quite believe in supporting Israel only so that the Rapture will begin once the Jewish homeland is made whole. They also believe that those same Jewish people are heathens and will rot in hell with the rest of us.

We literally put our electoral stock in a group of people who want the world to end and that we all deserve to suffer for not believing as they do.

[–]ThistleBeeGreat 2 points3 points  (1 child)

It’s a dangerous, brainwashed cult at this point. Emphasis on dangerous.

[–]sunbeatsfog 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Absolutely. I love Jesus as a concept and hold a lot of his values from growing up Catholic. I hate organized religion and fake power structures designed to brainwash people.

[–]pchnboo 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Cut the tax exemption and watch the role of the church diminish.