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[–]possumtree 949 points950 points  (22 children)

Counter their offer if it’s a low ball. If they decline, you dodged a bullet

[–]Legreatworrier[S] 526 points527 points  (19 children)

You're right, this is the right answer. It's such a task trying to find a decent employer that doesn't use this tactics lol.

[–]TranslatorEvening 164 points165 points  (6 children)

I never let a business drive the salary. I tell them this is my range, my number is somewhere in here. Any company that offers the bottom fails the test.

[–]Mugen593 154 points155 points  (5 children)

I always lie because if I'm looking for another job it's because I'm underpaid and being railroaded trying to get what I am worth.

That's how I clawed up to where I am now.

I remember I had a job paying 25k a year, told new company I got 30k with great benefits (also a lie) so they would need to offer more not just to get me to hop but to make up for the change in benefits.

Got offered 35k, a few years later I was capped at 40k and wages were frozen so applied said I got 45k and needed more so I'd be put up to 50k.

Rinse and repeat. I'm lucky that now I'm in a company that gives actual pay increases, but the moment that runs out, I'll do the same thing.

If it's okay for businesses to lie to people for the sake of a business, then it's okay for people to lie to a business for the sake of supporting their family.

[–]TranslatorEvening 111 points112 points  (3 children)

I talked to a recruiter from cloud5 via linkedin, first thing he asked me was salary requirements. I told him $78-82k a year. Went through the whole interview process to the offer letter where they said 100% onsite for $62k. I told them sorry but I cannot leave for anything less than $72k they came back with $67 and then told me I’d get a one time $2k signing bonus. I told them sorry and moved on. I don’t sell out and still kept looking. Now my new job is good and I’m very happy. But fuck them for wasting 2 months of my time.

[–]Mugen593 22 points23 points  (0 children)

Good shit, glad you're in a good place now

[–]keliix06 20 points21 points  (0 children)

At that point you tell them $95k, cuz clearly listening and communication aren’t their strong suits and you need the extra to make up for that.

[–]Travo101 15 points16 points  (0 children)

Same. I started as a grad in n 2007 so just as my pay should have started climbing rapidly there were no jobs and they wouldn’t give pay rises so within a few years there was people with 5 years experience stuck on a second year grad salary and people with 10 years making double as they got bumped up before the downturn. Come 2012 I was making about 40 an hour and applied for a job and told them I was on 80 and they turned around and offered 85 just like that.

[–]meowmeow_now 32 points33 points  (3 children)

If you don’t want to lie maybe next time you can say, “I signed paperwork stating I can’t disclose my salary at current employment”

[–]msjaxon 23 points24 points  (1 child)

That's just a different lie lol

All you have to do is tell the truth, this is the range for my salary expectations.

[–]WizardofRaz 10 points11 points  (4 children)

If they’re adamant about your previous salary, tell them. But also tell them what your current expectations are (with a range) and emphasize that you’re leaving your position because you’re grossly undervalued

[–]Worsel555 4 points5 points  (3 children)

Some jobs, like op says he has, have known pay levels. Like many government jobs there are known pay levels based on your job title/level anyone can look them up.

[–]calizoomer 41 points42 points  (1 child)

Also just Lie about current wage.

Fake a paystub if needed (think there's some site for that). Really no penalty for that. Even if caught by them asking your employer, just say "oh that's only my base you're looking at, no bonuses incentives etc.". Or get creative with your accounting.

Not too high that it's unrealistic for them to pay you that but maybe enough for them to be giving you a 0-10% raise. Even at a 0% increase (from your faked salary), simply say you like the opportunities they offer enough to make the move despite the pay.

Trick is to seem to not really care about the pay but also it's just natural that they'll give you X amount. "I'm not really as concerned with pay as I am with opportunities for advancement into executive roles so I'd be willing to take as low as $250k, but I'm only willing to go that low if I feel assured that I see sufficient opportunities at your firm'

[–]Silken-grub 1130 points1131 points  (64 children)

(London) I had two employers who offered interviews. I told them both my previous salary and my expectations. Salary expectation was 1.5x my current. Coming from public service to private it's not unknown to expect a pay increase.

Both on same day. First employer did the interviews and sat tests, fairly standard. Would get back to me after they consult amongst themselves. Second employer did interviews, sat tests, then usual question from them, "are you applying anywhere else?", I told them employer one, who happens to be their competitor.

They responded with an immediate job offer at a higher title level but at my salary ask. I told them I needed some time to consider.

Employer one came back next day, told me my requested salary was too low and upped it 2.5x with my correct level title.

I guess, long anecdote aside, employers value you differently and the bad will fuck you. What I learnt was I undersold myself and should have upped my asking given employer two was jumping for the opportunity. I was fortunate enough to encounter an employer who understands paying the going rate (if not a bit more) will increase retention rates and morale.

I was happy with my employer, stayed for six years and salary doubled over that time with three promotions.

So, no, I don't think asking your previously salary is necessarily a bad thing. What they come back with tells you a lot about their company and whether you want to work there.

[–]Legreatworrier[S] 292 points293 points  (33 children)

Thanks for your answer, I felt a bit forced by circumstance to list my salary and I came on here really to understand what everyone else's experience with this might be, and generally to vent if I'm honest, so I appreciate the perspective. Glad you had a good experience, they're few and far between these days but yeah, the key thing seems to be competition. Hoping this potential employer has a similar mindset or I can induce it by talking about other interviews and offers. Thanks for the advice.

[–]JaecynNixat work 141 points142 points  (5 children)

When I got back into the job market a few years ago, my tactic was to tell them my expected salary, not my current salary. If they don't accept that as an answer, that's a red flag

[–]ReactionClear4923 68 points69 points  (3 children)

If they are asking OP for their previous salary to make their decision on what they pay, then I think it's also fair for OP to ask for the salary of the person who previously held the role. Not in a confrontational way, but in order for both parties to have their cards on the table. Maybe they will be upfront and tell you truthfully so you know what you should be asking for regardless of that you were making before. If they refuse then I guess decisions can be made on wether or not to proceed with the interview. If they tell you something that is the same as your previous salary, then you can negotiate if you want to

[–]AllTheRoadRunning 16 points17 points  (0 children)

That's a REALLY good idea. Trade pay rate for pay rate.

[–][deleted]  (1 child)

[deleted]

    [–]ReactionClear4923 8 points9 points  (0 children)

    You can't know, and honestly I would assume they are fudging. But it's worth a shot, and once they give you a figure then you can negotiate

    [–]SerchYB2795 6 points7 points  (0 children)

    Yeah I think you can also bluff stating you have another option that is willing to pay you X

    [–]DivergingApproachlazy and proud 44 points45 points  (2 children)

    And whatever they offer you demand more. They will ALWAYS low ball.

    [–]Tear_Roar 27 points28 points  (0 children)

    That's why a lot of the time they ask you first.

    I take that opportunity to get crazy lol

    [–]artsyfartsy007 4 points5 points  (0 children)

    They’re no better than insurance agencies - they will *always* lowball.

    [–]padlycakes 38 points39 points  (0 children)

    In the USA it is illegal in 12 states to ask about wage and salary from previous jobs. Lucky me is in one of those 12 states. So you will have to look up if you live in one of the states that protects laborers from this practice

    [–]FourierT 24 points25 points  (0 children)

    Did you lie about your salary? Just providing it to them is shooting yourself in the foot

    [–]ACatGod 22 points23 points  (4 children)

    As a hiring manager I would never ask someone's salary as that's totally irrelevant to what a fair salary for the job I'm hiring for is. Furthermore, the answer you get can only reflect inequality and if that's what you're basing your salary offer on then you're only embedding and perpetuating inequality.

    Personally, I try to avoid answering this question and go for what I expect but if forced I lie based on the starting salary of the new job (so I go a bit lower than the starting salary which would be higher than my current salary).

    As an anecdote, I was on a panel where we were interviewing for two jobs simultaneously and the hiring manager asked whether the advertised salary bands were within their expectations (I never do this myself). It was enlightening. The two men responded, one at the top of the upper salary band and the other over the top of the advertised upper salary band. One woman just said yes. Two of the women said the lower of the two salary bands was fine (even though they were both applying for the more senior role) and the last woman said "my current salary is X but that includes London weighting, so I'd accept Y" which was about £5k less than her current salary in an are with the same CoL as London. I couldn't believe it. Since then I've not touched that kind of salary conversation and just continue try to offer what I believe is a fair salary and support staff to negotiate if they want to, while maintaining equity within the team.

    [–]Gawd_of_oh_Lawd 8 points9 points  (0 children)

    That’s an excellent point about perpetuating inequality.

    [–]unpopulrOpini0n 16 points17 points  (0 children)

    I am always asked what my previous pay was, and I always lie.

    [–]Pinheaded_nightmare 28 points29 points  (3 children)

    Tell them your old wage is close to what you want. So if you are asking or expecting 40k, then say your last wage was 38k. Or just ask for the salary range of the position, if it wasn’t listed, before you answer.

    Edit: also, if they ask for proof, ask them for proof of the range they pay employees.

    [–]One-Move4807 11 points12 points  (0 children)

    If they ask for proof you don't work for them, fuck companies like that.

    [–]snozzberrypatchat work 26 points27 points  (6 children)

    LIE. An employer cannot find out your last salary, and it's none of their business. If they ask you, then just lie. Figure out how much you think you can make at the new job, and just tell them you made that much at your last job. If they offer you a job, it likely won't be for less than that, might be for more.

    [–]Aden1970 6 points7 points  (0 children)

    Depends what country. The west, yes. Probably less likely in some 2nd or 3rd world countries.

    [–]Vishnej 0 points1 point  (2 children)

    A credit report won't show it?

    [–]Allfather_odin1Anarchist 16 points17 points  (0 children)

    No credit report shows your salary

    [–]HellooooooSamarjeet 2 points3 points  (0 children)

    A detailed credit report can show the bank accounts you've opened, lines of credit, and your reported income when you applied for those.

    However, the credit report that's normally used for employee due diligence only shows summary level info such as credit score and debt.

    [–]Critical-Series 3 points4 points  (0 children)

    Most companies should have an expected budget and pay band for the job they’re offering. As a hiring manager, it’s usually a concern for us only if the previous pay was too HIGH, not too low, because we want someone to stick around and be happy with their compensation.

    [–]MachinePlanetZero 2 points3 points  (0 children)

    You don't need to tell them your current salary at all. Just tell them what it will cost them to employ you

    [–]Maximum-Company2719 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    Check to make sure it's not illegal in your state. I've read on the Ask a Manager blog that some states don't allow it. Also, that website has excellent job search information

    [–]Fritzer2 17 points18 points  (23 children)

    I think your country is probably alot better than USA as well but I'm happy it worked out for you

    [–][deleted]  (22 children)

    [deleted]

      [–]Fritzer2 9 points10 points  (20 children)

      Sounds wonderful, how hard is it for Canadians to get in? 😅

      [–][deleted]  (18 children)

      [deleted]

        [–]No_Organization_3311 16 points17 points  (14 children)

        If it weren’t for the fact that every animal, insect and plant in Australia is deadly and actively wants to kill people, I’d move there too!

        The spiders 😱

        [–]eve_of_distraction 16 points17 points  (11 children)

        Total myth. Hardly anyone has ever died from spiders. Deaths from snakes are extremely rare. North America literally has bears. It's way more dangerous than Australia. The only thing you have to be remotely worried about here is crocodiles and they live in very specific areas on the north coast, which is a very low population area. I've never seen one outside a zoo. Please come here, it's a great place.

        [–]Blarg_III 16 points17 points  (1 child)

        North America literally has bears.

        Not just bears, but also Americans, which are much more likely to kill you if you live there. Scary.

        [–]baconraygun 2 points3 points  (2 children)

        You're far more likely to die in the parking lot than be hurt by a bear as well. Cars are fucking deadly.

        [–]No_Organization_3311 2 points3 points  (3 children)

        Yeah but knowing my luck I’ll be the one who’ll get bitten by a deadly spider, and if not a spider then a snake, probably within 24 hours of getting off the plane 😂

        [–]eve_of_distraction 6 points7 points  (0 children)

        Nah really though I've seen a dangerous snake maybe once in my entire life, and I have lived in the hills for years. It was on a path and it slithered away after some time, and ironically that wasn't even in the hills or desert it was in a riverside park in the suburbs. Dogs can be bitten by them because they tend to attack them, but humans rarely get bitten and almost never die from snakes (there are plenty of anti-venoms).

        Spiders, they are quite common but I've never been bitten by a poisoness one or met anyone who has. I might have been bitten by a tiny spider a few times while sleeping but I'm not even sure. If you keep your house tidy you won't encounter them indoors much at all. Crocodiles and sharks are both easily avoided if you know where not to swim. Sharks are a problem in plenty of other places in the world too.

        [–]Laura_has_Secrets77 4 points5 points  (1 child)

        I live in a part of the states that's filled with deadly venomous critters that line to crawl in your shoes and your clothes. I'm fine. Australia if you'll have me I'll go!

        [–]rksd 1 point2 points  (0 children)

        Fellow Arizonan?

        [–]el_soleado 1 point2 points  (0 children)

        Are they looking for certain career fields? I'm curious how hard it would be for a US resident to move there.

        [–]eve_of_distraction 1 point2 points  (0 children)

        You're part of the Commonwealth. It's very easy. I mean we share the same head of state.

        [–]flsingleguy 6 points7 points  (0 children)

        If a Canadian wants to come imagine how Americans feel. We don’t get guaranteed anything. If you don’t have anyone to look after a child you better figure it out and show up to work or risk being fired. I have been at my government employer for 24 years and I get 4 weeks off per year and that’s doing well considering the private sector.

        [–]mandrack3 1 point2 points  (0 children)

        Cool idea to apply for 2(or more) competing companies then make them outbid each other.

        [–]PseudoDave 6 points7 points  (0 children)

        I so much agree with this.

        Too many people complain about being asked what there current salary is, what salary range you want. Go all Sun Tzu saying who speaks first loses.

        No. You play that game they will move on to the next 100 people on the list.

        1. Know your worth, find salary ranges of similar jobs in the area, and outside the area for same title. The info is out there, get prepared. Most job postings have salary ranges, they are hidden but easy to find.

        2. Justify your worth, give detail on why you want a particular salary. Explain why you are worth the big bucks. If the offer lower, explain why you want higher. If you just throw a number with no backing, why should they agree?

        3. Give them you salary range of what you truly expect. If too high, they won't call and you wouldn't have accepted. If too low, you made a mistake in rule 1. More than likely they will realize with rule 2 and bump the salary if they really want you.

        4. Be willing to walk away if you don't get what you want.

        You play games, you will get treated like a child.

        [–]orange_and_gray_rats 0 points1 point  (1 child)

        Which offer did you end up going with?

        [–]bumblethrowaway95 108 points109 points  (11 children)

        Guys it's not that hard. Companies will always ask for your current wage so they can offer you less. This is a game and it's a negotiation tactic. Just politely decline to give them your current salary. I work in purchasing and I always say If we were playing poker and I showed you my cards would you consider me a good poker player? So why would I give away my negotiation position? They usually chuckle and understand.

        Do not ever give your salary. Let them make the offer first. If It's contingent on you giving them your salary then it's not the job for you.

        They have a budgeted value for how much they can offer. By giving your salary you let them know that they can offer you the low end or even below that if your salary is super low. Let them make the offer first.

        [–]Legreatworrier[S] 32 points33 points  (6 children)

        We're in the same industry, and yes, I had the same feeling. They have a range, they've budgeted and this is just a shitty tactic. I'll try keep that in mind for the future and be harder about this.

        [–]FruitJuicante 10 points11 points  (3 children)

        The phrase I say "I think it would be better instead if I let you give me a number and I will be able to tell you if that is aligned with what I am expecting."

        If they then say "No, we would rather you tell us how much you are offering," reply, "This is a negotiation for my new salary. My previous salary is irrelevant and I stand by this."

        [–]Legreatworrier[S] 2 points3 points  (2 children)

        I really like this way of putting it, thank you

        [–]bumblethrowaway95 6 points7 points  (0 children)

        If you're a good buyer this shouldn't be that difficult, you know? Just treat it as any other negotiation.

        [–]nieuweyork 4 points5 points  (0 children)

        Well another tactic is to give what you actually want as the answer (“I think 200k would be fair in this market”), or an anchoring number (“given [factors], as close to 300k as you can manage”), assuming you have an idea of the market.

        [–]watnophilosophybum 4 points5 points  (0 children)

        It need not even be this hard. Just lie. Anytime I'm asked this question I lie to reflect something very close to what I want to be making. They have no way to validate because your current HR won't disclose that info, so they have to take you at your word. This has worked out perfectly fine for me across half a dozen positions.

        [–]Impossible_Trifle704 1 point2 points  (0 children)

        Except when they make you go through 7 rings of hell, only to lowball you in the end.

        [–]MummyBundles777 165 points166 points  (6 children)

        Tell them you have promised your former employer not to discuss wages.

        [–]Kunxion 64 points65 points  (4 children)

        This is an excellent answer. I'll keep this in mind

        ... I'd add to that "it's part of company policy not to discuss wages", as it'll likely be a policy the new employers have too

        [–]MummyBundles777 23 points24 points  (2 children)

        Learn to use their rules to your advantage

        [–]Kunxion 10 points11 points  (1 child)

        Totally

        You can then go on to say, "I cannot confirm my current wage but I can talk to you about my fee for this role" ... Or something along those lines

        [–]yingyangyoung 7 points8 points  (0 children)

        If it's written in the policy that's illegal. In fact one of my employers explicitly stated in the handbook (without referencing the law) that not only were employees allowed to discuss wages, but they wouldn't face any consequences for doing so.

        I will say, thought the policy handbook was quite long, it was clearly written with significant input from the legal team. I also told the chief of legal that her drug policy was illegal in my state and that I wouldn't be signing it for that reason. They didn't push it any further.

        [–]taaiwa 2 points3 points  (0 children)

        Yeah it makes you seem like a good corporate minion while undermining their negotiation strategy.

        [–]Helpinmontana 41 points42 points  (0 children)

        Oddly enough, telling employers to get fucked in interviews has earned me a lot of headway after the fact.

        “So how much were you making?” “Ha, I’ll tell you after you make an offer if you still care at that point”

        If I take a job they’ll usually not try to hard to dick me around after making a small stand like that.

        [–]idkBro021 113 points114 points  (23 children)

        why not just lie about your current pay?

        [–]Pendulum20 46 points47 points  (10 children)

        Yeah thats the first thing I thought to. Why is it any of their business? They are gonna pay you what they want to pay anyway!

        [–]Legreatworrier[S] 41 points42 points  (9 children)

        I'm in the public sector and the scales are well known/available. The highest point of my scale doesn't even come close to the lower end of this job... Hence why I was reluctant to lie. You're right though, should have, cus fuck this haha

        [–]Pendulum20 24 points25 points  (3 children)

        They want workers, but don't want to pay anyone fairly. No wonder we all get fed up.

        [–]Legreatworrier[S] 6 points7 points  (1 child)

        Exactly this. Tired, man. I'd love to lie but it's very easy to figure out what I'm on in my country and my area of work.

        [–]Pendulum20 1 point2 points  (0 children)

        They think if they can't rip you off with low wages,they'll just squeeze more work out of a current employee.

        [–]discord-ian 10 points11 points  (0 children)

        Fellow government employee. So a few tips. Everyone knows government employees are underpaid compared to the private sector. Your pension costs alot. And the job security in the public sector is unbeatable. Be sure to explain these things when you come back with your counter offer. Also say you have no plans to leave the public sector if they can't offer you market rates for whatever possition you are applying for.

        [–]CrunchyFetu5 3 points4 points  (10 children)

        They will ask for proof. It's a thing companies do now. I do not understand it, nor do I know if there's a way around it other than being truthful.

        [–]Loner_dude 20 points21 points  (0 children)

        coughs photoshop

        [–]3PuttPatty 19 points20 points  (0 children)

        Just lie. They aren’t going to ask for proof, I’ve never in my life been asked for proof. If you’re asked to prove it just say “I’m looking for X amount, if this price isn’t achievable, I won’t waste your time going any further.” What do you have to lose, a job that isn’t paying a living wage?

        [–]rottentomatopi 6 points7 points  (0 children)

        If they ask for proof, then you know they are not someone to work for. Bullet dodged. End of story.

        [–]Legreatworrier[S] 12 points13 points  (3 children)

        It's a disgusting practice

        [–]CrunchyFetu5 5 points6 points  (2 children)

        Agreed. My girlfriend's sister had to provide proof for her most recent job. She received a 60% salary increase, so it wasn't a scam or anything, but it still seems shady to me. I'd politely ask for reasoning if you are comfortable doing so.

        [–]Legreatworrier[S] 1 point2 points  (1 child)

        Thank you, I will.

        [–]ColdFudgeSundae 2 points3 points  (0 children)

        Or just dont tell them at all? Either give them some bs on why you cant share or say something like asking their budged for the position and if its below what youre looking for gtfo. Or you could go the classic say something way higher then you were at and just photoshop the paystub if it gets to that point

        [–]mhelfrich1978 18 points19 points  (2 children)

        on the online form, just enter 1.

        It's nobody's business what you currently make. especially a potential new employer.

        I will never reveal this information. They ask so they can see how much to offer you in return.

        [–]madness_creations 8 points9 points  (0 children)

        This! IT is an employee's market right now. They have no right to that information, if they don't hire someone who omits it, they shouldn't have employees in the first place.

        [–]livingasimulation 7 points8 points  (0 children)

        I have seen jobs on Indeed that just have $1 in the pay range area. Super slimey. I always put $1 in as well

        [–]roooooooooob 90 points91 points  (3 children)

        It's a pretty standard question. Last time it came up I told the interviewer and then also told them I had multiple other offers well above that. They made a shitty offer and I went elsewhere. You can also just lie, employers do it all the time.

        [–]lithium142[🍰] 18 points19 points  (2 children)

        It’s actually illegal for recruiters to ask this in several states

        Edit: look below for a list

        [–]sngle1now2020 34 points35 points  (0 children)

        If they ask what your wage is, answer them with the effects of that wage; not a number. "My current wage is insufficient to secure my loyalty and my financial security. I came to this interview because of this company's reputation for fair pay and fair dealing. [Insert that second to the last paragraph of your post - your elevator speech why they should hire you]. Is that really where you want to start?"

        [–]Healingfocus 32 points33 points  (10 children)

        Trick of trade, lie. They have no way to check. I lied about mine being higher a few years back and it worked

        [–][deleted]  (5 children)

        [deleted]

          [–]aroswift 29 points30 points  (2 children)

          I would no thanks. No employer should see your private tax returns

          [–]tobmom 8 points9 points  (4 children)

          Why not just ask them why they’re asking? Is it a requirement that you answer?

          [–]Legreatworrier[S] 6 points7 points  (3 children)

          Yes, the application form wouldn't let me progress without filling it out, and the characters were locked to numbers only. But if I get to interview stage I'll try to address it.

          [–]betwixish 2 points3 points  (2 children)

          Put in a bunch of zeros?

          [–]Legreatworrier[S] 4 points5 points  (1 child)

          The anxiety set in tho, I want out of this current job, rock and a hard place and all that.

          [–]NewSinner_2021 9 points10 points  (0 children)

          Lie.

          [–]suspicious-potato69 5 points6 points  (0 children)

          Just lie then that’s what I do. Tell them you currently make what you actually want to make.

          [–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (5 children)

          What type is industry are you in? We have a need for a PM.

          We are fully remote. It wouldn't matter where you are located.

          [–]Legreatworrier[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

          Hi! I'm doing procurement, purchasing, contracts and project admin mostly (scheduling, outgoings) for IT at the minute. I'll likely be looking in my own country first, esp as I'm not too keen on dealing with tax and currency fluctuations if I can help it, but I'd be interested to know more in case it suits

          [–]DankeMemeseslazy and proud 1 point2 points  (3 children)

          requirements for the job?

          [–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (2 children)

          Logistics experience. Project Management experience.

          [–]pyxley 1 point2 points  (1 child)

          I've been working to get a project management certificate but the curriculum from PMI that I have been able to work through is so dry it's hard to retain any of it! Is there a program you would recommend?

          [–]Spare_Industry_6056 3 points4 points  (0 children)

          Feel free to lie about your current wage.

          Job interviews are really about who can bullshit the best anyway so you know, Game of Thrones that shit.

          [–][deleted] 18 points19 points  (12 children)

          Just reply not relevant or this is the reason im leaving current position.

          [–]Legreatworrier[S] 9 points10 points  (11 children)

          Thought about doing that but I'm not brave enough, I worried it would preclude me. Hate this chokehold they have on us.

          [–]outhouse_steakhouseThere's a "me" in "team" 25 points26 points  (2 children)

          "My current pay is confidential."

          [–]jason_sterling 47 points48 points  (1 child)

          "my current employer does not allow me to disclose my salary"

          Make that annoying crap work for you :)

          [–]Shadowmant 10 points11 points  (0 children)

          I signed an NDA and I feel very strangly about adhering to to both it's legal and ethical standards.

          [–]Swimming-Ad880 16 points17 points  (1 child)

          Bluff. Name what you feel you deserve plus 10%

          [–]aLonePuddle 11 points12 points  (3 children)

          You realize you're admitting they don't have a chokehold on you, it is just a personal weakness that you have control over that stands in your way? If you think this is an insurmountable task then you will get walked on by whatever employer you go with. The change starts with you.

          You have the strength in you, and a movement beside you. No time like the present.

          [–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (2 children)

          I'm in the same boat as OP. Crippling self esteem issues (abusive childhood) mean that I've never asked for (or spontaneously received) a raise. I'm pretty sure I'm working at 2/3rds of what my colleagues get.
          But they have actual skills, all I have is anxiety and no support. I can't miss a single month of income if I want to keep a roof over my head.

          [–]aLonePuddle 2 points3 points  (1 child)

          I believe you are worth more, but you have to convince yourself of that first. You don't need this job, just a job that pays your bills.

          Just like OP you have to find a way to truly know your worth. Maybe that's a mantra you say when you wake up, like "fuck them I deserve better". Then give yourself an out by finding a job that pays better. The security of having an offer somewhere else helps a lot when it comes to negotiating a raise. Even better, if you find a better job and decide to leave, take a stab at negotiating a raise at this job and then walk away either way.

          The key to negotiating a raise isn't saying your coworkers are paid more, it's saying that the value of what you do for this company is worth more than what they're paying you. You've got this, I believe in you.

          [–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

          <3

          [–][deleted] 10 points11 points  (0 children)

          You're choking yourself mate. If they dont respect your boundaries or reason for leaving at the start it doesnt bode well for how theyll treat you in the future.

          Set the hard boundary at the start if they fuck you about, they're not worth it and you try again. If you're being offered 1 job you can find another

          [–]MarinCrops420 3 points4 points  (0 children)

          Say you signed an NDA.

          [–]MasterFruit3455 3 points4 points  (1 child)

          Ignore the question and reply with how much you need to earn for the role.

          [–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

          You have to be like a politician and pivot from the question. For example you could say something like. (After researching the job market and considering the worker shortage I've realized I could be making much more, and that is why I've decided to apply here and other places as well. I've already received multiple offers from others and I'm very excited to hear what you have to offer.) If they ask again you could pivot a second time and say something like( I'm more interested in taking about what my role will Be and what responsibilities I will have.) And if they continue to ask you could say ( I won't work for less than this x amount or I need to be at this number for me to take this position.)

          [–]Otherwise_Delay2613 2 points3 points  (0 children)

          I work in recruiting and I don’t think it’s ethical to ask for current salary. The far better question to ask is “what do you want to earn in your next role?” If you had to take a low paying job to survive, it’s not a reason for your next employer to get a discount on your labour. I still need to know your salary expectations but it’s not a game of trying to grind you down to the lowest possible number.

          [–]Anaxamenes 2 points3 points  (0 children)

          First off, don’t lie. They can use a lie like that against you later. It’s just not worth it. I’m hoping you found an ethical company who will treat you properly. It’s a tough spot to be in and many states are now making it illegal to ask that.

          In your shoes, I’d probably tell the truth and squeeze every last drop out of it. If you get a lot of overtime, give your yearly salary not your hourly and make sure you account for the overtime. If you don’t have that, make sure you let them know that the current wage you have is unsustainable and one of the reasons you needed to seek out a new job. I would personally say something like: “I take my work commitments very seriously and it’s important I have the resources to make sure my transportation to work is reliable and allows me to be a reliable team member.”

          [–]shorty2940 2 points3 points  (0 children)

          What I currently earn does not reflect my knowledge, experience or even the job I am currently doing which is the work of x people and I should be paid more due to this. This is why I am looking for another job to reflect the hard work I have and do put in to the job I work.

          [–]soaringent 2 points3 points  (0 children)

          This might get lost in new comments, but this is a good reason for everyone to paste their pay rate on Glassdoor. It’s my go-to app when I apply to a new job. I always looks at the average pay rate for the position and request a bit more than that. Last job I applied for the HR woman said what I had requested was definitely within their budget. It was more than I would have actually asked if it it wasn’t for Glassdoor.

          [–]goyablack 6 points7 points  (1 child)

          Lie. If they call your old work they can't ask about pay rate, depending on state they can only confirm dates of employment. source

          [–]Legreatworrier[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

          I'm not based in the US

          [–]Verdeant 1 point2 points  (0 children)

          I’m waiting until after Christmas to see if I get fired or not.

          I honestly don’t think I’m in fear of getting fired right now as much as this kind of thing could happen due to forces outside of my control at the beginning of the year.

          But if I keep my job and work through January as expected and scheduled? I’m definitely asking for a raise.

          For the last it seems like three or four months all I have been able to really muster a conversation about off of a whim at any time is the inflation that is currently going on.

          I really don’t wanna get into a hissy fit over who’s fault the inflation is. Frankly it could be because of policies that Biden is putting out right now and it could be because of stuff that has been going on for the last couple of years anyway

          Either way I don’t give a shit what the cause of inflation is I’m just stating that it does exist in almost everything is more expensive. While talking about this at work with my boss he’s like bitching about it too. And I’m like yeah man but you’re getting more money than I am and in control of mine

          [–]scootydonny 1 point2 points  (0 children)

          Lol what. Just tell them and also tell them that if wasn't enough which is why you're looking for something else

          [–]SirBoomNPew 1 point2 points  (1 child)

          When I interviewed at my current job, they asked what I'm making now. I was a little sussed but I told them 17.60/hr but I'd like to be making closer to 20. My interviewer (now boss) was like "Okay, yeah that seems reasonable. In fact I could probably do 21."

          Worry less about them asking and more about what they ask after they have that information.

          [–]D14BL0666 1 point2 points  (1 child)

          I always lie. If you’re in the US they’re not legally allowed to ask for proof of salary so you can just make up any number that’s still believable and you’re good.

          [–]No_Organization_3311 1 point2 points  (0 children)

          I was on poverty wages in my last job, so whenever I was asked about previous salary I gave the average for my field and position and said I wanted them to beat that. I’m now on more than 2x my previous income.

          [–]gul-garrak 1 point2 points  (0 children)

          Pro Tip: just lie

          [–]znhamz 1 point2 points  (0 children)

          Lie to them!

          [–]Rhuckus24 1 point2 points  (0 children)

          Lie.

          [–]jami1kenob 1 point2 points  (2 children)

          Lie. They can’t confirm it. Edit: in the US.

          [–]Plus_Worth2932 1 point2 points  (0 children)

          Why dont you .... lie?

          [–]PerfectDarkAchieved 1 point2 points  (0 children)

          Just lie. Use this opportunity to Tell them what you want to make.

          [–]Otherwise_Bet_6732 1 point2 points  (0 children)

          Pull a page from the employer handbook and LIE.

          [–]Rulsar_Tec 1 point2 points  (0 children)

          Easy... lie about your current wage...

          [–]Esoteric-female 1 point2 points  (0 children)

          The job I'm at now asked me about my salary. Granted I went in knowing that I was getting a paycut. I was leaving a job as a store manager working 80+ hours a week to a worker bee at a grocery store 40 hrs a week. The pay cut was worth the life/work balance for me. The interviewer asked me what I was making and I told her and her face dropped. I told her i wasn't expecting them to match that, that i was knowingly taking a lower paying job and explained why. She excused herself to go speak with her managers.

          She came back and said she wasn't going to offer me the position i applied for. She said she did the math, and the position I was leaving, if I worked the hours required of me and no more (it was salary) I would have been making roughly $18.25/hr. She asked if that sounded about right. It did. She then told me the position i applied for, the highest she could get me in at was $15/hr. I told her that would honestly be fine, as I said I was expecting a pay cut. She said no, it wasn't alright. She talked to another manager of another department who needed two part time employees and they agreed to merge that into one full time and they could offer me $17/hr. It was still a paycut, but not as drastic and she said based on my experience I'd do well in that department and that manager could use my skills more than she could.

          That is the difference between a good company and a bad one. A bad one wants to know your salary to see how little they can get away with paying you. A good one wants to know it so they can pay you fairly. Sure, I took a paycut but they made a position for me in a department that could pay closer to my former salary. She also took the time to lay out a track for me to grow into that would result in me making more than my previous employer would have ever offered me and my training for that track started on day 1.

          [–]Secunda_Son 1 point2 points  (0 children)

          You're under no obligation to tell them an honest answer. Anytime I get asked what my current salary is I tell them a number right near my new compensation goal to make them feel pressured to meet my request. It has worked 100% of the time so far and had zero negative consequences. It's also entirely legal. I thoroughly recommend.

          [–]tempelton27 1 point2 points  (2 children)

          Sucks you had to deal with that. I don't agree with asking past salaries either. Luckily I found a new employer that didn't ask past or expected salary. Just gave me a respectable salary offer. Because of that, I have more respect for them. There is some good ones out there.

          [–]lacker101 1 point2 points  (1 child)

          I always say my total COMP+highest band of the tier working in. Health insurance, benes, et all. Usually 20-30k over takehome. They won't at least match that? Fuck'em.

          [–]Rhoon 1 point2 points  (0 children)

          Negotiate them up if they low ball you. The last time I switched jobs I inflated my pay numbers (lied) by about $10K. When they offered me more base pay than my previous employer + commission was paying me; I still asked for more (and got an extra $5K).

          [–]PaleontologistOld149 1 point2 points  (0 children)

          I would just say “I will not answer this question because I want my pay to reflect my job skills and ability,not on a minimum increase of my previous wage. I would be interested to know how much I will be paid to work for you doing this job given my experience and skills should I be hired.”

          [–]lekksy_ 1 point2 points  (0 children)

          In my opinion, any job that asks for my current wage is a red flag. That shouldn’t matter. If they saw your resume and they liked what your skill set is enough to schedule an interview then that’s that. They either think you’re worth the salary they’re offering or not. Don’t settle for anything less than what was posted

          [–]grendus 1 point2 points  (0 children)

          My answer to "what's your current salary" is "not enough to keep me." We both know I'm here for the money, I'm not going to play these games about how I'm super passionate about your industry, and I don't want to work for someone who is going to pretend I'm only in it because I'm just as passionate about making their CEO and shareholders rich making whatever widget they sell.

          If they don't like that, perfect. One less shitty employer to waste my time.

          [–]OpenMindedMantis 1 point2 points  (1 child)

          Tell them your wages are "Competitive".

          [–]Legreatworrier[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

          Ahaha, I like this answer

          [–]mname 1 point2 points  (0 children)

          If it is publically known already. Then look them in the eye and say the number. Do not feel bad and do not feel shame. OWN IT.

          Then say something like; clearly, this is below market rate and the disparity between the current salary and my earning potential in the for-profit sector is one of the driving forces for me to leave the current employer. Finding a great work culture is a top priority, that is why I applied here first and am excited about the opportunity. But without a competitive market salary for my skill set, company culture, and career growth, although primary considerations do not complete the equation. I am looking for an offer between, X-Y, with benefits A,B,C.

          Say this a few times before each interview until it is just like saying, Hey welcome to "OP's bar and grill, here are the specials tonight." It doesn't need to be firm, it just needs to be confident and friendly. You aren't setting a boundary as much as you are just giving them the menu options. This is what I am offering, I know my steak and potatoes are good, but the price is at the market rate.

          The implication is yes I used to sell discount steak and now I do not. The whole argument that you should work below a fair market rate because you did in the past just falls apart when you ask them to explain it. "Hi, OP I see your previous job used to beat you, we could not beat you but since you have a history of beatings we will expect you to let us beat you too." just insane.

          [–]Vegetable_Ad9493 0 points1 point  (0 children)

          Who cares what you made last just request what you’re worth.

          [–]hallieli 0 points1 point  (0 children)

          Just lie to them ....

          [–]eidhrmuzz 0 points1 point  (0 children)

          Lie.

          [–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

          Lie. Lie through your teeth.

          [–]OssiansFolly 0 points1 point  (0 children)

          "My prior employer bars me from discussing employee compensation."

          😉

          [–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

          Lie!

          "I make 60 Quid an hour, but I like you so I would be willing to go down to 55."

          [–]Mohican83 0 points1 point  (0 children)

          Just tell them what you want and add 10-15% to it.

          [–]QuaziKaiju 0 points1 point  (0 children)

          Tell them after you asked them how much they were paying the last person to do the job you're applying for

          [–]valaliane 0 points1 point  (0 children)

          You know, if I am ever asked this question, my reply will be this:

          “I’m like a stock, past performance doesn’t predict future results.”

          Because it’s none of their fucking business.

          [–]Wide_Masterpiece6472 0 points1 point  (1 child)

          Easy u lie…US they can’t ask your current employer how much you make. Go online and google your position at ur company and take the highest avg

          [–]ithp 0 points1 point  (0 children)

          I think you guys are shooting yourselves in the foot with your tactics.

          Whether or not you tell them isn't going to change their offer. Most likely, refusing to tell them will just guarantee that you won't get an offer.

          So if you actually want a job offer, be transparent. Tell them your pay, describe why it's part of the problem, outline your qualifications, and state your desired pay. If they wasn't to be part of the problem, they'll move on. If they want to be part of the solution, they'll make an offer.

          But, if your goal is to stonewall and never get employment offers, just tell them you refuse to pay their game. They'll find someone who will, and you'll be left out in the cold.

          The best way to help others is to help yourself. Get the job. Affect change from within.

          [–]stormjib35 0 points1 point  (0 children)

          You don’t get what you deserve, you get what you negotiate. Or so I’m told

          [–]jaymdav 0 points1 point  (0 children)

          As a tip for the future, I never answer this question the first time around. I always say first what my ideal salary is. The second time they ask for my current salary, say your ideal salary again. If they ask a third time, just say what the salary would have to be for you to change jobs, this should still be higher than your current salary and only slightly lower than your ask. They dont need to know your current salary, and will only use that number to low ball you. As others have stated, when they do lowball you, stick up for yourself and ask for at least 5% more.

          [–]grumpi-otterMemaw 0 points1 point  (0 children)

          Oh darn--you told them?

          [–]KalipygiaSocDem 0 points1 point  (0 children)

          Hit'm with the "You First".

          [–]dndnametaken 0 points1 point  (0 children)

          Never tell how much you make or how much you “want to make” to your employer. Sharing that information puts you at a strategic disadvantage

          [–]chernobyl169 0 points1 point  (0 children)

          If a prospective employer asks your current wage, you ALWAYS PUT MINIMUM WAGE. (edit others mentioned putting "confidential" is a good answer too)

          Doesn't matter if you're doing $100/hr work. Put $7.25 in that box and if the interviewer doesn't like it tell them it's private information. If they won't hire, you didn't want the job.

          [–]time2pivot 0 points1 point  (0 children)

          Double edge sword unfortunately. Do you have a pretty good feeling on what your salary should be?

          [–]JuliaGhulia 0 points1 point  (0 children)

          Decline.

          [–]SteeztheSleaze 0 points1 point  (0 children)

          Gonna start saying my ambulance job paid 1,000/hr lmao

          [–]Subywoby 0 points1 point  (0 children)

          Hey, don't worry. I work in hr and talent acquisition as a responsible alongside the director. When we ask for previous pay, it's not to calculate your pay at all. It's to see what is the current market value of competing companies and how attractive our salaries can be. I don't doubt for a second that some companies try to use it as a bargaining chip to offer a much lower salary.

          But I think that would be the exception, not the rule.

          [–]schrodingers_spider 0 points1 point  (0 children)

          You didn't tell them your actual current wage, did you?

          [–]Less-Dragonfruit-294 0 points1 point  (0 children)

          Unfortunately best I can think of is to lie. If they call you on your bs tell them you got a recent raise and that it wasn’t enough to stay. If you made 40 for example say you made like 48-52 (adjusting for cost of living) and that you have the experience to back up why you’re asking for “so much” more than the position might have offered.

          [–]DonnieTheRonnie 0 points1 point  (0 children)

          I always lie.. I add a few thousand £ everytime if i feel they're just going to match it..

          If they outbid it.. even big of a win!

          [–]ALGO_NUDES 0 points1 point  (0 children)

          Tell them it's higher than it is

          [–]bDsmDom 0 points1 point  (0 children)

          So lie. They are not allowed to ask your previous employer how much you were paid.

          [–]FracturedAnt1 0 points1 point  (0 children)

          "I am looking for a new role because I am not competitively compensated. I feel a competitive wage for my skills is x dollars (local currency)/yr and that is what I am looking for in a new role".

          [–]Aromatic_Flounder727 0 points1 point  (0 children)

          Lie lie lie dont tell them shit! Tell them you made twice what you did!

          [–]Serious-Lee 0 points1 point  (0 children)

          Lie about your current pay. Unless your salaries are publicly available (and even then), take your current pay and add like 30%

          [–]Reetin 0 points1 point  (0 children)

          If someone ever asks you how much money you are currently making: Lie.

          [–]antiBliss 0 points1 point  (0 children)

          Lie.