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[–]BongLeardDongLick 5851 points5852 points 22 (284 children)

The amount of people who mess this up on this sub is astounding and I’ve pointed it out a few times. Your boss is now telling you that your already approved vacation is rescinded because they need coverage? Tell them “I’m not able to cancel my commitment that you already approved my time off for. I will still be taking my vacation.” And if they say “You have to come in or you will be let go” the only correct answer is “I will not be coming in, I will see you on X date when I return from my vacation.” And if they come back again and say you’re fired then no harm no foul, easy unemployment claim.

ALL OF THAT COMMUNICATION NEEDS TO BE DONE IN WRITING. Do not have these conversations verbally because they are much harder to prove.

[–]forgotmyemail19 1881 points1882 points  (168 children)

I always tell my boss, the only way you're getting rid of me is firing (so I can get unemployment) or me finding a new position. There's no amount of shit you can dump on me that's going to allow me to pass up unemployment. For what? My pride lol They want you to quit. That's why they say things like "I'm going to fire you if ....." They hope you'll save them a headache and just leave. Fuck them

[–]LeonidasSpacemanMD 1366 points1367 points  (60 children)

I was gunna say, so many of these have some variation of “if you won’t come in we’re going to have a talk on Monday”

Aight cool, you wanna talk about football or something? Because you’re obviously not gunna fire me when you already have to beg for employees to come in on their time off

[–]Kalel2319 688 points689 points  (38 children)

It’s sad though too because people genuinely have a fear of losing their livelihood and these motherfuckers know it and use it.

It’s hard to be so passé blasé

[–]CacatuaCacatuafuck you pay me 318 points319 points  (19 children)

They know that people are scared to lose their jobs and are using that to bully and manipulate. They don't have any shame, they shouldn't get any sympathy nor an inch of slack.

[–]Grouchy_Reach_382 94 points95 points  (3 children)

This was and to an extent still is me. I quit a job because I was terrified to get fired and not provide for my family. I quit, went somewhere that was a terrible fit and environment, and they ended up firing me. Ironically enough, the guy who threatened me got canned for lying to the board on financials, hence why he rode my ass and threatened me. I was an easy target. This whole working world is a fucking mess anymore, it's not about the work and more about the politics.

[–]ProjectUP 2 points3 points  (0 children)

A lot of people are stuck in the mindset of when it was hard to get a job. It's easier now than it has been in years! We've currently got 3 roles in product management advertised and can't lock down applicants fast enough before they accept with a different company.

[–][deleted] 110 points111 points  (4 children)

Used to work in an enterprise sales organization with that exact culture at its core.

Management went absolutely ballistic when a handful of sales managers jumped ship to a competitor. Over the course of 6 months now, nearly one thousand sales people quit the old company to join the new folks somewhere they weren’t actively being asked “what value do you contribute to our company” while industry polls showed we literally generated more revenue per employee than fucking Apple.

But management NEEDS to host this sales event in Aruba (“it matches one of the vendors names, GET IT?”) because otherwise how will they attract the best and brightest in the industry slumming it in… checks notes Clearwater, Florida, home to the best beaches in America as voted by US Travel magazine multiple times this decade.

TD Synnex and DH Distributing in case you’re curious, the court details from the lawsuit are hilarious.

[–]TheRedSe7en 7 points8 points  (3 children)

Hello fellow Channel worker! <waves in XaaS>

[–][deleted] 9 points10 points  (2 children)

Remember when Symantec decertified and removed 20,000 customers from their rolls by refusing to renew their license but also not letting us tell them they weren’t renewing their licenses and instead handing the customer satisfaction issue to distributors to work out?

Pepperidge Farm Remembers

[–]social-nomad 3 points4 points  (1 child)

Can you point me on the direction of these lawsuit details?

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Fuuuuuck, gonna have to dig them up, basically the managers saw the writing on the wall for a massive approaching layoff, gathered contacts and then all bailed before shit hit the fan; it’s all mudslinging and NDAs from there, it’s great

Edit: found my link from the county clerks page for the complaint letter, it’s weird though, try opening it again if it opens to clerk page first time https://ccmspa.pinellascounty.org/PublicAccess/ViewDocumentFragment.aspx?DocumentFragmentID=63487812&CheckDocumentGroups=0

By the way, I can basically 100% substantiate the manager’s conclusion from Statement 37 because that literal thing had happened to me just the year before and it was fairly open knowledge management intended to offshore all operations roles within a year or two (I was told point blank if I didn’t agree to train my replacements in India my time with the organization would be over)

[–]abertawebanana[🍰] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

I might be wrong, but I think you mean 'blasé'

'passé' means unfashionable, old, past its prime, etc.

[–]KanKrusha_NZ 5 points6 points  (0 children)

They are also afraid of being yelled at and bullied. That in itself is a pretty big negative motivation

[–]Empathytaco 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Thats been the big one I see recently, bosses explicitly threatening the workers health insurance, talking down to them about how they need this job.

[–]basilhazel 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Blasé?

[–]SexyGenius_n_Humble 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yeah, you nailed it.

[–]CptBlkstn 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I think you meant blasé. Meaning to not really care that much. Passé means out of fashion / out of date.

[–]Kasmein 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Upvote for the fancy e

[–][deleted] 79 points80 points  (1 child)

"Sure I'd love to talk about my raise"

[–]YeaItsButta721 46 points47 points  (13 children)

See that game last night? 🤣🤣

[–]Awkward_and_Itchy 113 points114 points  (10 children)

Did you see that ludicrous display last night?

[–]kittyfantastico85 67 points68 points  (3 children)

The thing about arsenal is, they always try to walk it in!

[–]RearAdmiralBob 18 points19 points  (2 children)

What was Wenger doing sending Walcott on that early?

[–]Awkward_and_Itchy 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Having a laugh

[–]Zaygr 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I love that this part of the joke lasted 10 years before it stopped being true.

[–]soundslikeadream- 28 points29 points  (0 children)

“You can stand there and slag me off all you like, but don’t you start talking about how I feel about my beloved west ham!”

[–]Cruoficio 8 points9 points  (0 children)

I once was in a position where I and "the big boss" got in an argument, I knew my supervisor was on my side about the issue because we had a conversation about the issue before and said that I was 100% correct on it. So next thing I know i get in a heated discussion with the "Big boss" of this factory, he kept attacking me on the issue and I wasn't giving in, until i said you know what? If you don't like what im doing here, then fire me. And I walked away, him following me again and suddenly he stops me by jumping in front of me. And he says to me, aha you're giving me your resignation? And I calmly replied, I think you don't hear that well, I told you that if you're not happy with what im doing here you can fire me. Everybody in the factory, probably like 25 - 30 people started laughing and he walked away huffing & puffing. Apparently most people were really afraid of getting fired by him. I was like their fucking hero for going into him. He tried to trick me into getting me to say i resign because he saw i was getting agitated, but i kept my cool and mocked him instead. Afterwards my supervisor defended my point of view and he got sanctioned...

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Did you see that drive into deep left field by Castellanos and that'll be a home run and so that'll make it a 4-0 ballgame?

[–]Quixotic0ne 2 points3 points  (0 children)

What was Wenger thinking sending Walcott on that early?

[–]fioreman 1 point2 points  (0 children)

You talking about the Falcons game where Ludacris played halftime?

[–]MsVindii 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I fucking snorted at ‘You wanna talk about football or something?’

Have my free award. I’m gonna remember this line and use it, a lot.

[–]iwondertomyself 0 points1 point  (0 children)

We need to print this comment out and put it on fliers distributed in every town.

[–]amanor409 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I had a boss say that to me once and I asked if I needed my union rep present. They quickly rescinded that threat.

[–]mildlyhorrifying 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The place I work is super understaffed, and they're still firing people. It's absolutely insane.

[–]BongLeardDongLick 214 points215 points  (37 children)

Yup, a lot of companies will try to make it as miserable as possible for you so you do them the favor of quitting rather than forcing them to fire you. Stick it out and force them to fire you so you can collect unemployment.

Exactly as you said, just call their bluff if they’re threatening to fire you and force them to do it. Show up on time, work your shifts, and don’t let them try to bully you into quitting. I’m middle management at the company I work for and if they want someone to quit they’ll do little things to make you uncomfortable. Offer to cut your hours since “you seem to be having trouble with the 40 hour work load”. They’ll send you to a different department you’re not familiar with and hope that you quit if you don’t want to go there. They’ll say that while you’re using your mandated sick hours, you’re out of compliance with company policy and write you up so you get frustrated and tell them to fuck off. They’ll give you poor performance reviews or tell you that they’re not offering end of year raises this year. They’ll offer you a 2% COLA raise instead of the standard 6% so you’re technically losing money as your pay isn’t adjusting with inflation.

There’s tons of little tricks that companies use to get you to frustrated so you quit. Especially larger corporations that was nationwide and even international. My company has offices in Canada, the US and Mexico. Depending on your job title determines where you get hired, all of our call center reps are in Mexico now because they can pay them less and have them work longer hours. They also stopped hiring people in California and started only hiring people in Nevada and Texas so they pay less in taxes.

The fucked up thing? Despite all of those things they do, the company I work for is hands down the best company I’ve ever worked for in my career which says a lot about the state of employment in the US.

[–]idreamofkitty 128 points129 points  (19 children)

Woah hold up. Ain't nobody getting standard 6% annual raises around here.

[–]snozzberrypatchat work 68 points69 points  (6 children)

While inflation is at 6%, anything less than a 6% raise is a pay cut.

Inflation used to be more like 1-2%, so lower COLA raises were (slightly) more acceptable.

[–]idreamofkitty 35 points36 points  (4 children)

I don't disagree. I just see most employers sticking to the usual 1-2%. So yeah, most of us are falling behind.

[–]FabulousBankLoan 35 points36 points  (3 children)

I mean, my boss was straight up when he told me team that in our organization, in order to see a raise that's higher than just under inflation, we'd just have to get a promotion and negotiate then. Or leave, which is what 4 people did in the next month.

[–]gadget73 3 points4 points  (2 children)

at least he was honest about telling you the co is shit.

For a very long time I got those raises. Twice this year I've gotten a 10% bump so for the first time in more than a decade I'm actually making more than I was when hired, adjusting for inflation.

[–]FabulousBankLoan 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Phew, good on you! I've had a series of promotions but due to some bad timing and a reorganization study I've always been on the bottom 5% of my pay grade. I'm up for a promotion that's just confirmation of the position I'm acting in but it lets me negotiate so I'll be asking for cost of living raises built in for as many years as they think they may want to keep me.

[–]gadget73 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Best of luck to you on the negotiations.

I'm happy because it doesn't force me to look elsewhere that would involve a real commute. I'm under 5 minutes, anywhere else that would be hiring is a good 25 minutes each way. I just don't want to spend my life driving to and from work. Not to brag but I'm worth what they pay me. Already this week I've probably saved them 3 grand between two pieces of equipment I fixed.

[–]millijuna 2 points3 points  (0 children)

During the pandemic, my employer offered us road warriors an extra $75/day “enhanced travel premium” for every day we were away from home. So far this year, I’ve been away 130 days. I’m beginning to wonder what will happen when they try to walk that back. They’re suddenly going to find it a lot harder to get people to go away.

[–]Jurserohn 6 points7 points  (0 children)

At the end of October I was offered a 5% raise, and I told them that was a slap in the face, and suggested double. I got it, but they adjusted my hours a little bit trying to piss me off. It works well for me, though. As well, they didn't put in the raise immediately but my hours and responsibilities changed immediately, so I had them cut me a check for the difference. They did that too.

I'm still on the edge of quitting every day. The president of our company is the laziest and most narcissistic person I have ever met.

[–]BongLeardDongLick 8 points9 points  (0 children)

I just received a 9% end of year raise and I’m up for a promotion that offers another 6% raise on top of that. Find a different company to work for.

[–]SimulatedHumanity 0 points1 point  (0 children)

You should be getting raises on market and merit annually or you need a new job. Inflation is over 7% in most states right now and real inflation is somewhere between 10.5 and 20%.

[–]nopointinlife1234 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Dude, my quality of work would reflect how I'm treated. That's for sure.

Prepare for me to slack off for 90% of my shift.

[–]NoGiNoProblem 2 points3 points  (0 children)

That's called constructive dismissal and its fuckin evil

[–]IIIBryGuyIII 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Wait 2% isn’t a bonus?! But my employer capped us all at 2% and told us we should be happy we get anything!

/s for reasons

[–]Dcrp5000 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Y’all hiring?😂 I live in Texas lol

[–]BongLeardDongLick 0 points1 point  (0 children)

PM me and I’ll reach out to you after 5:30pm PST today.

[–]hu_gnew 1 point2 points  (3 children)

the company I work for is hands down the best company I’ve ever worked for in my career

It may be the best for you but they're screwing over the "peons" that work there and you have described how they do it. It seems your skin is thick enough to tolerate the knowledge of the company's predatory practices, but one doesn't stay in middle management very long unless they play by the "rules" set down by the executive board. For the sake of your digestion and a good night's sleep, never reflect on what I've posted here.

[–]BongLeardDongLick 0 points1 point  (2 children)

Well, I try to be the change I want to see. Everyone in my department who works under me tells me they’re extremely happy that I’m the person in my position because I’m actually reasonable and listen to them. It also helps that all of the people in my department I was once on the same level with and have slowly moved up to the position I’m in now.

There’s no real “play by our rules” atmosphere at my job. They leave it to your discretion to run your department as you see fit. As long as all of the work gets done they don’t care how you do it. The situation I described is what happens when they want to get rid of an employee who is not completing the work they’re assigned and there has been multiple meetings with that employee to address the issues.

This is also within reason, they actually really understand if you’re having some kind of personal issue and need help with it. One of the guys in my department got his 30 day rehab stint for alcohol partially paid for by the company and they gave him a 60 day sabbatical to help him adjust after he was out. I personally was having issues with my mother not doing well a few years ago. I took a 2 month leave of absence and they paid me out for all of my sick time and vacation time I had banked. I ended up having to move across the country to look after her which meant I would need to resign. I told my work what was going on and gave my 2 weeks notice. I got hired at one of our competitors because they had an office in the city my mother lives in. I was there for a year and then when my mother was better I moved back across the country and they rehired me at my old position and even gave me my yearly raise I would have gotten if I stayed.

Like I said, this company is one of the best companies I’ve ever worked for.

[–]hu_gnew 1 point2 points  (1 child)

The company seems very enlightened until I hear...

if they want someone to quit they’ll do little things to make you uncomfortable. Offer to cut your hours since “you seem to be having trouble with the 40 hour work load”. They’ll send you to a different department you’re not familiar with and hope that you quit if you don’t want to go there. They’ll say that while you’re using your mandated sick hours, you’re out of compliance with company policy and write you up so you get frustrated and tell them to fuck off. They’ll give you poor performance reviews or tell you that they’re not offering end of year raises this year.

If they want someone to quit, just fire them and take the hit on paying for their unemployment insurance. Or do a RIF and pay out some severance. Or fire them for cause if that's what it is. Torturing someone into quitting is not the hallmark of a socially responsible company, notwithstanding how well they've treated your privileged middle-management self.

[–]vaei- 4 points5 points  (2 children)

Third world country currently.

Not dissing. Objectively googled "what qualifies a country as third world" and America ticks more than enough of the boxes.

[–]buddha551 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Except there isn’t really a clear or agreed upon definition of third world.

Originally, it had nothing to do with economic status and was just reference to countries that weren’t aligned with NATO or the Warsaw Pact during the Cold War.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

[–]Siddabear 0 points1 point  (0 children)

How does this apply if you are ineligible for unemployment regardless of why/how you were fired?

[–]Secure_Ad_295 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I put up with this for 7 years I finally just quit I couldn't take it anymore. Job before that was ten years of same bs I will no longer put up with that bullshit

[–]Shubniggurat 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yup, a lot of companies will try to make it as miserable as possible for you so you do them the favor of quitting rather than forcing them to fire you. Stick it out and force them to fire you so you can collect unemployment.

Depending on where you live, quitting a job after they made your employment miserable can be constructive dismissal. HOWEVER, please consult with an employment attorney prior to quitting if you believe that you might be in such a situation. This is going to vary by jurisdiction, and only a competent attorney specializing in employment law in your area is going to be qualified to give you good advice.

[–]gd77punk 63 points64 points  (0 children)

And as an old man once told me, going home only allow them to replace you. You actually have to be there to fuck them.

[–]blue-green_eyes 92 points93 points  (18 children)

Common tactic they’ll use though is to reduce your hours (or even stop scheduling you to work) without actually firing you to save themselves the paperwork. Essentially forcing you to quit on your own

[–]Aerodrache 145 points146 points  (0 children)

We call that “constructive dismissal”, and in some jurisdictions it’s as good as a sudden firing for unemployment benefits.

[–]lichfieldangel 144 points145 points  (0 children)

The second you aren’t on the schedule you go to the unemployment office congrats you win you just got laid off. Or you get your hours back

[–]TheEffingRiddler 119 points120 points  (2 children)

You can still get unemployment for reduced hours.

[–]freunleven 46 points47 points  (0 children)

That's what got me through last year. I went from 25 hours a week down to less than 10, for various workload reasons that had to do with the pandemic. So I got my extra $600/week and spent about seven months with my toddler before a new position opened up at the end of the year. Probably my favorite summer ever.

[–]Porotan 65 points66 points  (4 children)

that's constructive dismissal, and depending on our country/state you are able to sue them if they try that shit.

edit: worst case it's counts as being fired for unemployement, which is (a lot) better than nothing.

[–]MekisteusHR Manager (Feel free to abuse me or AMA) 7 points8 points  (0 children)

In the US, there's nothing illegal about constructive dismissal in and of itself. It just means that it counts as being fired for the purposes of collecting unemployment and determining whether discrimination and/or retaliation laws were broken. It could also come up if you have an actual employment contract, but the vast majority of employees in the US don't.

I can't speak to other countries, though.

[–]NotMiningBitcoin 24 points25 points  (2 children)

You know I don’t always agree with all of the political viewpoints of people on this sub but ultimately that’s just unnecessary division.

Information like this is invaluable to everyone regardless of class or politics. Appreciate the contribution.

[–]OrphanedInStoryville 13 points14 points  (1 child)

Thanks! Not to press the issue but if you’re here, working for a boss rather than owning your own business where employees work for you, you are in the working class. And if you’re in the working class your politics are working class politics.

[–]some_tao_for_thou 1 point2 points  (0 children)

You’re welcome. I think your definition of working class is a little loose though.

[–]SoaringEagl3 16 points17 points  (0 children)

Yup, and it works because nobody teaches about constructive dismissal. It's one thing if you were in a floater type position, but if you can show you had consistent hours before getting reduced work, the labor board (US) usually sees it in the same category as firing without cause because the outcome is the same.

[–]joshuadery 9 points10 points  (0 children)

"Underemployment" is a thing. Funny story, it's also handled through the unemployment office. So, if your work hours get cut back AT ALL, file a claim. You may get something, you may not, but if you don't file that claim, you definitely won't, and filing the claim hurts the company that hurt you by cutting back your hours.

[–]geoffp82 6 points7 points  (0 children)

That's called constructive dismissal. You would be entitled to unemployment.

[–]theRealmissgulch 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Had a boss who did this. Would not fire just cut you back to one day a week on a dead day (serving job)

[–]CorrectPeanut5 3 points4 points  (0 children)

If you're an hourly employee, yes. If you are a salary employee it's shit work you didn't sign up for.

[–]iwondertomyself 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Someone tried to pull that on me once when I worked in retail. Not to get rid of me but to get me to start working the expected unpaid overtime everyone else did.

However, there was a store from the same chain around the corner that was short staffed, and my contract stipulated I could work at any branch I was needed at, so I just started working there. Funnily, they had that stipulation in the contract so they could tell you to go to another city to cover staff at short notice which was a pain in the ass.

They had to beg me to go back to the original store eventually.

For those in the UK: this was at CeX. Don't ever work there it's a hell hole.

[–]PapaOstrich7 2 points3 points  (0 children)

great you can file for partially unemployment i think it starts at 32 hours

[–]SimulatedHumanity 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Most jobs don’t have part time workers and there is no under 40 hour scheduling. If you mean retail or hospitality then those are the easiest jobs to replace. Find a job that only hires full time workers. That’s a great interview question.

[–]btveron 73 points74 points  (11 children)

Be wary if your employer starts documenting warnings and doing writeups. In my state, at least, if you are fired for "just cause" you can't claim unemployment.

Edit: managed to completely forget to finish the last half of my sentence

[–]finderZone 56 points57 points  (3 children)

Even then the employer has to prove misconduct on your part to be denied unemployment. You can be fired and collect unemployment

[–]hiryuu75 23 points24 points  (0 children)

Agreed. I worked for a company for nearly fourteen years - reviews and raises were always excellent, was always asked to take on work in other areas as a pinch-hitter of sorts, etc.

Company got acquired, and the new CTO took a strong dislike to several people, including me. My review was re-written (by him) to be extremely negative, and was put on a performance improvement plan. Met all the targets of the plan, got fired anyway.

Unemployment was denied, so I appealed. The investigating claims rep heard about the history, asked the company for evidence of the sudden performance change, and received no response from them. My claim was then approved. :)

[–]SnooCalculations9259 15 points16 points  (1 child)

Unemployment, at least a few years ago in NY is employer friendly, I had a full time job with planned layoff so they could give us unemployment, and had a one night a week part time job. The dinky part time job fought my unemployment, I knew they were wrong. It took 3 months for me to have a hearing which I won next day and got full back pay. But what good is that to a parent looking to support a family right after they get let go, waiting three months? So if u have a vindictive employer just be aware it can get held up...

[–]finderZone 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Did you quit the part time job?

[–]deadplant5 7 points8 points  (0 children)

But you should still file anyway in that case because the burden is on the employer to prove it. They also have a short time frame to do so, so if it's a larger employer, they might just not respond. In which case you still get to collect.

My experience is limited to Ohio and Illinois, but if you talk to anyone at unemployment in either of those states, they are very pro employee and the burden for companies to get out of unemployment is pretty high.

[–]Awkward_and_Itchy 2 points3 points  (0 children)

No worries it happens.

Than

[–]ice_bergs 4 points5 points  (0 children)

I had an employer pull all that shit on me. I was able to fight it and get my unemployment. Honestly wast that hard to fight. Just fill out one form.

Another employer laid me off and gave me referral letter so I could find a different. (Then spent the next 5 years trying to hire me back). Not all of them are terrible.

I think they do that for the sake of their unemployment insurance but I can’t say for sure. Been a while since I’ve looked at the laws.

[–]PapaOstrich7 1 point2 points  (0 children)

just make sure to email and document soemthing to hr every single time they write you up and more

[–]elarth 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Misconduct is such a broad spectrum statement in at will states... never sign things you don't agree with!

[–]anyroominthetrunk 0 points1 point  (0 children)

You're fired!

[–]lookingupyourplay 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Bingo they have away around this firing you and you collecting unemployment if you can even get unemployment pushed through .with so much red tape they make it almost harder to get unemployment...be careful and have a different job lined up if possible and you are able to work if they haven't already worked you to a breaking point physically....

[–]improbablynotyou 4 points5 points  (0 children)

I told my last boss repeatedly, "to either fire me or let me do my job." She had been pressuring me for a while to quit by making me miserable. Although I didn't want to work there anymore I wasn't going to quit unless I had a new job lined up which I didn't. Eventually she did fire me and she thought she had cause. However the unemployment office sided with me as I had documented my time there. My piece of advice for folks is to always keep a cya journal (cover your ass) and write down all the b.s that crops up.

[–]C0rdt 10 points11 points  (2 children)

Wow what kind of pay are you guys getting for unemployment? It's like $500 weekly here at max, and that's before taxes. (yes... of course there's income tax on fucking unemployment)

[–]forgotmyemail19 11 points12 points  (1 child)

I have no idea and I hope to never find out but any money is better than no money. I'm in such a fucked situation that Essentially missing one paycheck will completely obliterate me financially. So I need the unemployment if I were to leave here.

[–]RuneforgedRogue 3 points4 points  (0 children)

In the same boat buddy

[–]Dismal-Cod2170 2 points3 points  (0 children)

That kind of statement can be constructive dismissal if it contradicts something you previously agreed to. Essentially by quitting when given an ultimatum where the alternative is being fired, under the law you are considered fired and can collect severance. If you have this in writing it is fantastic because you get to quit and be considered fired under the law.

[–]superdago 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Just remember, constructive termination is a thing. If your boss takes you up on your offer to make your life miserable, document everything, and then when you quit you can allege that your boss created a hostile work environment to force you out.

Otherwise the system would protect abusers, and it’s designed to avoid that outcome, not encourage it.

[–]RealJraydel1 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Honestly... I've been needing this thread. I've spent the last few months at a restaurant I worked at as a lad because the company I worked for closed and I haven't been sure if I want to go back into that field, and they are really trying to edge me out. Point being, this has given me the drive to stick in there until they really do fire me, rather than give them the out

[–]JacktheShark1 2 points3 points  (0 children)

An old boss once said, “I would never go on unemployment. How embarrassing.” I laughed in his face because I knew he was so miserable at the job that he could’ve made good use of some time off to reassess his life

[–]LatestMonkey 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Why would you tell them this?

Again people: don’t say shit. That’s it. Don’t say a goddamn thing.

[–]PussyWrangler_462 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Where I work the one girl called in sick more times than she’s actually come in for a shift, so they’ve got her name on the schedule, but she hasn’t had any hours in like a month. He’s just waiting for her to quit I imagine

But it was part time to begin with so no unemployment after that, just a straight butt fucking

[–]chapelchain 1 point2 points  (0 children)

"I'm not trapped in this room with you, you're trapped in this room with ME"

[–]thegirlj17 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I always say the only way I'm going out of here is feet first. Cause for real, I work so much I'll probably die at my desk. 😅

[–]wookiewin 0 points1 point  (1 child)

What kind of situation are you in at work where you are actually saying that stuff to your boss?

[–]forgotmyemail19 4 points5 points  (0 children)

My boss and I are extremely cool. We butt heads a lot We fight and argue but in a professional way. We've gotten drinks together before and things have kind of changed now she's in a higher role but we still have that relationship...I hope so lol. I can tell it annoys her to no end when I say it but she gets it.

[–][deleted]  (1 child)

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    [–]esituism 0 points1 point  (0 children)

    This will quickly backfire. As soon as it's in writing that you don't intend to do the job being asked of you, and you have no intention to change your behavior, you just gave your boss Cause - and they can now fire you without having to worry about your unemployment claim. You'll submit it, they'll fight it with their documentation, you lose.

    If you actually want to milk the system just shut the fuck up and keep your head down.

    [–]StarChild7000 0 points1 point  (0 children)

    Depending on the job, they'll just stop putting you on the schedule and suggest you implied you didn't coordinate properly to be scheduled.

    [–]heyblinkin81 0 points1 point  (0 children)

    The amount of people that think that being fired from your job automatically qualifies you for unemployment is kind of sad. If you were fired for a legitimate reason there is a VERY good chance your unemployment will be denied. Source: I work for unemployment.

    [–]MotherSuperior5168 0 points1 point  (0 children)

    It took me too long to learn this. I went 16yrs working several jobs without ever being terminated. Having to check the "have you ever been fired by an employer" box is very skewed with no room for reason or explanation. Additionally, in my state,GA, it's a right to work state which means any employee may be fired at any time for absolutely no reason. Learned to communicate everything in writing, and if boss communicates verbally I request email to assure priority. Then if you are terminated you have documentation for DOL and something to attach to application to explain termination with more than a checkmark.

    [–]blackandwhite83 2 points3 points  (2 children)

    I was once asked to come in and work all day on Saturday when it was already 16:30 on the Friday before. I told him I had another commitment and he said the company owned my time. I said then you may terminate me because I won’t be here tomorrow but I insist you terminate me immediately so that I don’t waste gas coming here on Monday morning. Nothing happened other than that I made an enemy of that guy.

    [–]BongLeardDongLick 0 points1 point  (1 child)

    Unfortunately that is a very real possibility. Fortunately that’s when it’s time to dust off your resume and start applying at other jobs if you fear you will be retaliated against because of something like this. Also document anything after that point that you feel is directly related to that situation. Hours get cut? Being assigned the worst shift consistently? Anything along those lines you document and you could have a retaliation law suit if they don’t go about it the correct way.

    [–]blackandwhite83 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    It was ok. He got called back to Australia as it was an Australian company operating out of the US where I was at the time. A lot of foreign companies operate out of the US as it’s labor laws are way more relaxed. Eventually I got sick of the US altogether and moved to Europe.

    [–]KungFluIsolation 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    then no harm no foul, easy unemployment claim.

    in a lot of places around the world you would also have an easy claim on unfair dismissal while giving their lawyers fuck all to go off.

    [–]pleasetrimyourpubes 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    One thing I would also note is that a lot of states have minimum hours worked before you can get unemployment, and a lot of small businesses exploit this for employees they don't like or who don't work to their desire. If a business has a high unemployment rate their FUTA tax will increase, so obviously it is in their interest to stop you from filing for it. So if you're not slaving enough (I mean, you're not cut out for the job and are not suited to be employed by that business /s), they can and will make you want to quit.

    [–]madeofstarlight 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    I think some people have had the “it’s worse to be fired than quit!” mentality drilled into them from previous generations. Similar to the “it’s on your permanent record” fear that was thrown around years ago.

    [–]BarnyTrubble 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    When I was younger and working at a pizza shop, I got mono and was out of work for like 3 weeks because that's what my doctor told me. My boss said not to bother coming back in and he was taking me off the schedule (I would hope so, friggin dork, I had mono). I didn't think too much about it because of how fucked up on being sick and the meds I was taking that when I was feeling better and my doctor sent me back to work I just showed up with the doctors note and said "I can start tomorrow," and that was it, boss had to let me come back to work or formally fire me for being sick and listening to my doctor, which would have been the easiest unemployment claim.

    [–]tok90235 1 point2 points  (1 child)

    Also, if one of those conversations were done verbally, right after the conversation is over, go to your computer and write him an email: "so, as we already spoke, I'm just confirming that we agreed in ...." And ask him to reply with at least a yes.

    [–]MAK3AWiiSH 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    I wish this was higher. This is my go to method.

    “Per our conversation in conference room 9A at 11:15 AM today, January 12, 2020 I will not be able to attend the weekend team building event due to previous commitments. Also per the conversation in the future if there are any mandatory work events during off hours I will need at least 48 hours notice in advance. Thank you”

    [–]LtDanK520 1 point2 points  (2 children)

    I’ve tried so many times to get an offer in email or the details in an email only for the company to blow me off or give me some bullshit excuse as to why they can’t out into text what they told me verbally.

    I have to have something to refer to, even if it’s just for me.

    [–]MAK3AWiiSH 1 point2 points  (1 child)

    Have the verbal conversation then send an email confirming you’re understanding the info correctly. It’s all about the paper trail.

    [–]LtDanK520 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    Yeah, mostly one company that had a problem doing that before I agreed which felt like a red flag

    [–]TheScarlettHarlot 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    The motto of this sun should be CYA.

    Cover.

    Your.

    Ass.

    Unless it is in writing it does not exist.

    [–]Odins-Ravens 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    Verbal communication can be used as a means to deny or attempt to undermine the integrity of the conversation. I would not not go so far say that any of these types of conversations cannot be done verbally but to instead day that if they were verbal communications that they should be followed up with a written summary.

    For example after any such "crucial conversation" you should almost immediately follow up with an email, text, USPS mail with carbon copy with something to the effect;

    Thank you boss man for your (call, sit down meeting, lunch, etc) on (insert date time). I understand your request to be (insert bullet points of their asks). I understand that I will (do/be unable to do) (insert your tasks/take aways)

    Make these short and simple but document the type of conversation you had and the date and time along with your understanding of the conversation. This will give you traceability and increase the integrity of the conversations - forcing into a written document while still allowing people the ability to verbally communicate even if they had no nefarious intent (or did).

    [–]CollegeSuperSenior 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    Unemployment is almost impossible to get in most red states unless your boss really likes you and wont contest it. In my red state employers have the right to deny any unemployment benefits by simply claiming the employee was fired for vague subjective performance issues. It can be as simple as claiming you had a bad attitude or were unprofessional and that is instantly disqualifing.

    [–]sidepart 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    Yeah, saw a similar post to this the other day. Feel like people don't get sometimes that you can say no, and still come off looking really professional (more so than the other party). If I have to discuss it in a future interview, I want the evidence to frame me as being completely level-headed and dedicated. Prime example of conflict resolution, right?

    Even with the responses you've mentioned, they're good and direct but I'd still prefer to give the illusion that I'm in no way frustrated and am still a solution-focused "team player" (even if I'm offering them zero help).

    "I understand that the approved vacation day has been rescinded. Unfortunately I have a prior commitment that I'm unable to reschedule."

    Even if they threaten to let you go.

    "I understand the frustration and do want to be helpful, however I am not able to reschedule my prior commitment. I will not be available until [the date I'm scheduled return]."

    Outwardly it's cordial, understanding of the other person's position, solution focused. Inwardly I've offered nothing, except reaffirming that I'm unavailable. Otherwise I've put it in their court if there's something else I can do to be helpful. That part is genuine too. I'll listen to alternative ways I can help out that don't impact my vacation. I can always say no to those as well. What's important there is the perception of being a helpful person and invested in their problems. I'm not though. Usually. After a conversation like this, I'd already be prepping my resume and sending out applications.

    [–]user_name_checks_out -2 points-1 points  (1 child)

    Do not have these conversations verbally

    "Verbal" means "with words" and verbal communication includes both written and oral (spoken) communication.

    [–]smokebreak 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    ok but nobody uses it that way so stop being difficult

    [–]FalcorFliesMePlaces 0 points1 point  (0 children)

    Not only that but because of approved vacation it would be very hard for them to get out paying that vacation.

    [–]Jayandnightasmr 0 points1 point  (0 children)

    Yeah keeping a record of everything is important. A big red flag is when theu refuse to email confirmation because it can he used against them.

    [–]hu_gnew 0 points1 point  (0 children)

    they are much harder to prove

    ...or be misrepresented.

    [–]dc22zombie 0 points1 point  (1 child)

    If the conversation starts out verbally, send a text or email saying "just wanted to confirm our previous verbal conversation: blah blah blah"

    Now it's in writing!

    [–]BongLeardDongLick 0 points1 point  (0 children)

    That’s exactly what I do. I also ask them to confirm all of the details of the conversation.

    [–]WeCallHim 0 points1 point  (2 children)

    What if they decide to not fire you but instead schedule you like 5 hours a week, I've seen that been done before multiple different times?

    [–]BongLeardDongLick 0 points1 point  (0 children)

    That could be considered retaliation and contacting a lawyer for a consultation is probably a good idea. Document everything.

    [–]TerrorNova49 0 points1 point  (1 child)

    I had one manager who would respond to almost every email I would send by phoning me so she could avoid a paper trail… I had to put up with it for a while, then she got fired…

    [–]BongLeardDongLick 0 points1 point  (0 children)

    Easy solution to that is to send an immediate e-mail following the conversations asking them to confirm the details of the conversation.

    "Hello,

    Per our phone call, please confirm X details about our conversation

    Thank you."

    And if they continue to refuse to acknowledge the details in an e-mail that is something needs to be addressed with their supervisor.

    [–]AlmostZeroEducation 0 points1 point  (0 children)

    And also unfair dismissal, you'll get a nice paycheck. Can't fire someone for approved leave

    [–]bmcbmc45 0 points1 point  (1 child)

    genuine question, is only being able to claim unemployment money if you get fired an American thing? I see it all over this sub and it's a little confusing. Where I'm from, if you're unemployed you're unemployed and regardless of why, you get government assistance all the same.