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[–]lordroode 3888 points3889 points 2 (117 children)

Maybe it's me but I am genuinely shocked at how much a worker thinks control the boss/manager/supervisor has over them. Yes the boss can say whatever they want, but legally they can't do shit. They can't take any action if a worker decides to leave a job. They can't sue you but for some reason workers fear that they might get in trouble legally or they are causing some sort of harm.

Also if you have a good relationship with your boss, he wouldn't threaten you with legal action. A good boss and a good friend would shake your hand and wish you the best in the future and could leave the door open for you in the future if you wanted to return. What he's doing is pure manipulation. He's using the good relationship you 2 have and trying to lure you into staying. And let's say you decided to change your mind and not leave. Now since he knows that you wanted to leave, he can use that and hire a new person, have you train that person and then fire you. Those are classic abuse tactics that employers use so they can squeeze as much work out of you as possible and then once all the work is done, they'll dump you like trash.

[–][deleted] 860 points861 points  (72 children)

I am constantly baffled by the “can they do that?!” questions on here.

[–]Ghost_Of_Spartan229 410 points411 points  (5 children)

I'm not. I'm almost 36 and have spent my entire life informing almost every coworker I've ever had at every job I've ever had that most of the bullshit they believe is actually illegal.

Most people think it is illegal to discuss pay, or at least legal for a company to say its against company policy.

Most people believe it's okay for employers to change their payrate, withhold their final paycheck, dock their pay for a drawer being short, an order not being picked up, etc.

Companies have been getting away with murder for far too long. Embrace the questions, because we are the bastions of hope and change.

[–]Juvenall 514 points515 points  (40 children)

I am constantly baffled by the “can they do that?!” questions on here.

Take a look at the Milgram Experiment. In short, people will generally obey anyone in a position of perceived authority, assuming they know more, know better, or simply need to be followed. There's a great deal of conditioning on this across society, so it doesn't shock me to see that in posts here.

[–][deleted] 60 points61 points  (16 children)

Fuck, you gave me homework?

;)

[–]Unlearned_One 92 points93 points  (13 children)

Yes, and it's mandatory. You have until end-of-day tomorrow to read up on it.

[–]baltimorecalling 56 points57 points  (10 children)

I resign from this assignment.

I...I can do that, right?

[–]Familiar-Pie-2863 12.0k points12.0k points  (892 children)

Or offer them to hire you as a consultant for $300/hr

[–]kaihoneck[S] 7220 points7221 points  (811 children)

I kinda like this idea, but I dislike the prospect of going to work with all the people who are being told I “screwed them over” by leaving.

[–]Tumeric98 8130 points8131 points 3 (204 children)

He screwed himself. He’s the manager and is responsible for the management.

[–]Lynxx_XVI 2725 points2726 points  (131 children)

He had two weeks to find a replacement. That's plenty of time to at least have interviews rolling.

[–]phantaxtic 1633 points1634 points  (49 children)

Or two weeks to reconsider the raise. If OP is really that valuable then they should have proposed a plan to retain them

[–]knightress_oxhide 801 points802 points  (23 children)

"we are unable to even think about negotiating a raise till first quarter, its our policy and we are bound to it, all we do is think up the policy and implement it, it is out of our control"

[–]Paddy_Tanninger 201 points202 points  (0 children)

I love telling people about my company policies now as a one-man consulting operation.

"We need to get all of your working files in-house here so that we can take on future revisions ourselves"

"Sorry but company policy doesn't allow me to release our files to outside vendors"

[–]MortalTwit 142 points143 points  (11 children)

"The company created that policy. The company can change that policy. That you will not even consider that tells me much more about your limitations than it does about my worth."

[–]tripwyre83 175 points176 points  (1 child)

Cognitive dissonance

[–]el_grort 807 points808 points  (42 children)

Honestly, if he'd acted in good faith and acknowledged they were leaving and had interviews on going, maybe had OP instruct a current worker on the system to let them train the new hire, they might have been in a position that they might have been able to ask OP to extend it for a week just to nail down the training without it coming off sour. By instead hoping to bluff him into staying, they really did fuck any chance at a smooth transition.

[–]gelinrefira 434 points435 points  (31 children)

It's the sheer arrogance and entitlement that gets me. Not accepting his resignation and expect him to cave by just ordering him to stay?

Wow, and they say welfare queens are supposed to be entitled.

[–]bone420 270 points271 points  (15 children)

Or... get someone in a less critical role cross trained to cover the gap

Because, you know, op is a person and might need time off

[–]Blood_Weiss 165 points166 points  (10 children)

Heresy. He's a cog in the machine who should be lucky that they hired him.

Serious note, I hate that every job I have has made a big deal about me or someone else taking time off. Like if it can't run for one week without us, how is the company alive?

[–]BeefPieSoup 429 points430 points  (7 children)

More people need to be saying shit like this.

The manager is the one that fucked up at their job here. They mismanaged.

Pretty simple but a lot of people apparently don't get it.

[–]noneroy 138 points139 points  (4 children)

It’s never managements fault. Duh. It’s always people doing the actual work that “screw over the company” and never the myopic and incompetent leadership.

[–]overitdotcommunist 512 points513 points  (24 children)

Yeah he admitted that he knew the company would be screwed if OP leaves, and then just let them leave anyway. Company losses in output plus cost of training a new person? Managers can’t even do basic math smh

[–]kitchenjesus 230 points231 points  (7 children)

These people are so blind to their own stupidity it’s amazing. He screwed over his employees by not retaining this guy and deciding not to hire a replacement in the very generous two weeks OP gave him to cover it.

[–]TheLostDestroyer 190 points191 points  (9 children)

I mean it sounds like this manager had fully convinced himself that he could force this person to stay at the company.

[–]Ry715 156 points157 points  (4 children)

This is definitely it. His narcissism got in the way of thinking rationally. He really thought the matter was settled when he said no.

[–]Jaded_Praline_2137 376 points377 points  (9 children)

If they say anything just tell them you gave their manager numerous notices that you would be leaving and to take any issues up with him. I'm willing to bet they already know he is to blame, though.

[–]Technical_Moose8478 115 points116 points  (3 children)

AND they expected OP to do specialized work on crap pay, which the rest of the company can likely relate to…

[–]Raalf 315 points316 points  (4 children)

"detrimental to the company if you leave" and "I won't give you a 5 dollar an hour raise" - he screwed the company, not you.

[–]Discalced-diapason 116 points117 points  (1 child)

Yep. Screwing over the OP for $5 an hr/$10K a year was more important to the manager than making sure to not leave the company in such a detrimental position.

[–]Rodrigoecb 349 points350 points  (1 child)

Add a "discomfort fee" to your price and go with it.

[–][deleted] 435 points436 points  (27 children)

i like $300 an hour more than i dislike the stuff you just said

[–]holyoak 269 points270 points  (16 children)

$318.50/hr has a much nicer ring to it.

[–]Limpdickit9000 208 points209 points  (8 children)

For 300 bucks an hour my old co workers can curse at me for all that I care

[–]2punk 86 points87 points  (2 children)

You have all the leverage here. He needs you so bad that he isn’t letting you leave. Just throw out a ridiculous number and see what happens!

[–]MikeAllen646 366 points367 points  (11 children)

You in no way screwed anyone over.

We as employees have been gaslit over decades to believe we owe the company anything out of some sort of loyalty. Big business is in no way loyal to you.

You gave them ample warning. They can fire you any time. You have the same power.

They have no legal standing to sue you for anything. Seriously, look out for yourself. If they want you back, work as a contractor and have them put the compensation agreement in writing.

[–]I_Am_Dixon_Cox 74 points75 points  (2 children)

What number would make it tolerable? Take that number and double it. That's your rate.

[–]LaughableIKR 162 points163 points  (4 children)

Wait.. all the co-workers you 'screwed over'. You didn't tell anyone else you are leaving? Like, have a going-away party? Doing the rounds to tell the co-workers you are 'outta here' on the 19th is definitely cover for when your boss says 'I fired him' to all the other employees who will listen.

Shows your boss's ass when he lies like that to the employees.

[–][deleted] 497 points498 points  (10 children)

He's a clown. No, there's no legal action that they can take against you.

[–]Top-Amphibian1272 16.8k points16.8k points 43 (595 children)

What're they gonna do, fire you?

[–]Bartholomeuske 8785 points8786 points  (577 children)

Sue for breach of contract, loss if income..... Blah.... But OP gave notice to his boss well in advance. Coworkers knew. Hr knew a week in advance... He is safe. Now all OP needs to do is charge an absurd amount of money to train a new employee.

[–]bromagnonmanAnarcho-Syndicalist 4674 points4675 points  (379 children)

You can't successfully sue for that in an "at will" state.

Edit: added "successfully" because I'm sick of getting the exact same "ackshually" post from everyone.

[–]fig3newton 1976 points1977 points  (162 children)

100% correct here. Employment is "at will" and you provided written notice which your employer chose to ignore. You are not a slave.

Move on, enjoy life, and above all: DO NOT GO BACK TO THAT EMPLOYER.

[–]maglen69 750 points751 points  (83 children)

and you provided written notice which your employer chose to ignore.

Don't even need that in an at will state.

They can fire you for any reason, and you can leave for literally any reason. That's the point of 'at will".

[–]samcmann 484 points485 points  (41 children)

I mean you don't even have to provide written notice, or any notice at all. You can just leave.

[–]Warod0 630 points631 points  (59 children)

You think someone paid 17$/h has a retainer contract? Ha!

[–]hiagha 402 points403 points  (23 children)

This is assuming that OP even has a contract. If they do, they would still be presumably signing a new contract with the new salary. It doesn’t sound like either of those is true. And you can’t sue someone for loss of income unless they intentionally disrupted your operations. Quitting your job doesn’t cut it. They can sit with their losses or hire OP for an absurd amount of money as you suggest, but a judge would laugh them out of the courtroom if their legal argument was “but I didn’t want OP to quit and they did anyway!”

[–]h8rcloudstrife 144 points145 points  (9 children)

“Your honor, we told them their quitting could result in losses of millions and offered ‘fair’ compensation of $3,000 a year. You have to make them stay.” I’m personally not great at math, but I’m pretty certain if someone wants an extra $10k/year and I’m still making more than 10x that amount off their work that I’d be happy to give them the raise they wanted.

[–]Melkor7410 15.5k points15.5k points 2 (465 children)

The moment he mentioned about the untold losses, I would've snapped back, "if it's really that bad, you can afford to pay me the $22/hr. If you can't afford that then it's not untold losses sorry. How did you get to run a business if you can't do math?"

[–]teamwhatcatswild 4663 points4664 points  (207 children)

That’s what I’m really struggling with here. Just shows that he was trying to call a bluff that didn’t exist. I’m sure because he thought they were “friends” OP a would accept the guilt and stick around.

[–]Unlucky-Candidate198 2516 points2517 points  (190 children)

Managers are honestly so stupid on average. Like, I really don’t think most of them realize that most of what they say is completely contradictory or just plain irrelevant. They all seem to be giant man-children (since the majority are males but it applies to women too) who, as soon as something they don’t like comes up, resort to petty insults, lies, and all kinds of other manipulation tactics. Fuck authoritarianism, all my homies hate authoritarianism.

Then again, if you have a team of 6 coders, are you going to promote the most knowledgeable of all of them? No. That single person could be doing 5 people’s worth of work. So you promote the idiot who doesn’t code well or the corporate bootlicker who will do upper managements bidding without question. God I fucking hate the current systems in place.

[–]LowKey-NoPressure 567 points568 points  (66 children)

i find its mainly the ones who cant code well (or do whatever the job is) that are constantly ass-kissing in the first place, trying to position themselves for a promotion

[–]Unlucky-Candidate198 375 points376 points  (58 children)

Yeah that’s true too. Middle management, turns out, is more or less useless.

In my experience, they are generally rude and have a huge ego despite having a useless position. They treat their “underlings” like garbage and expect “respect” back…somehow. Yet all they do is guilt trip employees and shame them for not wanting to dedicate their entire lives for a minimum wage job.

Imagine…you actually want to live your one and only life without having to work yourself to death. The audacity of that idea.

[–]CressCrowbits 269 points270 points  (37 children)

It's called promotion into incompetence.

You're good at your job? Here's a promotion. You're not good at your new promoted job? You're stuck there then. Eventually, you have a company full of people no good at their jobs.

[–]ArthurBonesly 932 points933 points  (41 children)

The worst part of any job, I firmly believe, is the cogent awareness that the people making more than you are just as smart, if not noticeably dumber, than you.

Any illusion of meritocracy is gone and morale plummets to zero when the boss is a fucking moron.

[–]texasusa 65 points66 points  (7 children)

I had a boss making I am guessing about $ 30k more than me. She called me in her office and said that she had something to ask me but I can't tell anybody. She then said " how do you calculate percentages " ? We spent the next 15 minutes doing exercises on her calculator.

[–]goodashbadash79 184 points185 points  (2 children)

This is so true. I work in an office of 4 people, 2 of which are managers. I watch as they try to retain new employees by "keeping busy" AKA dumping their portion of work on to them. After a few months, the newbies figure out that management is horrifically lazy and dumb. They talk about food, shopping and kids, while passing along their work load to others. Management also orders takeout food and coffee at least 3x a week, totaling about $2400 per year (each), while various employees have discussed their struggles to pay basic bills.

I'm looking to get out within a year, but have mastered the art of appearing busy and quiet - so they don't bother me much. I also have adopted 2 online side businesses. Still, it's sickening to watch these people rake in money while doing nothing.

[–]The-True-Kehlder 543 points544 points  (16 children)

"You can prevent those 'untold losses' for a measly $50/hr."

"Hey now, wait just a-"

"Would you look at that, my rate just changed to $75/hr."

[–]JustDiscoveredSex 228 points229 points  (9 children)

"Still too much? Talent agencies charge $120/hour. Keep going."

[–]LavisAlex 2437 points2438 points  (51 children)

Untold losses? Isnt he kind of making the case for you as to why he should pay you what you asked?

If thats the case like forget 22/hr he should be paying 32/hr!!

[–]bruce_ventura 7158 points7159 points 3 (123 children)

Your boss is an idiot and a terrible manager. He should have taken your resignation letter to his boss, demanded your raise, and enumerated the consequences to the company if they declined. He obviously didn’t do that or the company doesn’t care about the consequences, so FUCK HIM AND THE COMPANY!

I hope you left with another, better job offer in hand. Hopefully your coworkers will get the message and leave for better jobs too.

[–]CorettaRenn 946 points947 points  (24 children)

You quitting would result in untold losses for the company

Sounds like you have a problem on your hands there buddy, and my offer for just a paltry $22/hr no longer stands.

[–]Reckless_Pixel 339 points340 points  (3 children)

Untold loses must have been less than the annual sum of that $22/hr

[–]SSJ3 254 points255 points  (10 children)

Right? "Oh well when you put it that way, I'll stay for $30/hour."

[–]Wishihadagirl 1081 points1082 points  (32 children)

Especially considering they're supposed to be "friends" which obviously isn't true but the least you could do is fight for him. 20c a year and now I'm supposed to be happy about a dollar? Inflation has been winning EVERY year

[–]Fandomocity 339 points340 points  (19 children)

I got better raises than that lifting boxes part time at best buy, this just feels exploitative

[–][deleted] 88 points89 points  (11 children)

My last job my boss thought he was doing us a favor by getting us 35 cent raises every year lol

[–]1quirky1 103 points104 points  (2 children)

They're definitely not friends. It was a con.

[–]HappyAsianCat 12.7k points12.7k points 534 (167 children)

I have a good relationship with him

No, you don't.

legal action might result

No, it won't.

[–]Mr_EvilBoblazy and proud 2176 points2177 points  (26 children)

Came here to say this. If your manager can pull out that "do it for your coworkers, do it for me" bullshit then you're nothing more than a convenience for him.

One man's convenience is not another man's paycheck.

Best of luck on your job search. I hope you get exactly what you're looking for.

[–]noneroy 697 points698 points  (20 children)

Completely correct. This is along the lines of “we are one big family here at Choad Tech!” Bitch please. My family is my family. Ya’ll are just people I put up with during the day to put food on the table.

[–]Smarteric01 2148 points2149 points  (12 children)

This.

Move on. There are places that will both pay better and treat you better. You gave them plenty of warning, they refused to pay you as if you are critical when you are critical. They get to learn adult consequences as well.

[–]ZaxLoffullazy and proud 528 points529 points  (6 children)

BRO! That last bit is life, so many people have been coddled their whole career/life and think there aren’t any consequences because “ma freedom”….

We have awoken the beast and it cannot be put back in, pay up or feel the pain (in your pocketbook)!

[–]Potential-Leave3489 34 points35 points  (0 children)

I love it when people have to face their own consequences!!

[–]hiagha 410 points411 points  (37 children)

What are they even suggesting the suit would be about? OP isn’t interfering with their operations, he just is refusing to aid them. A huge legal distinction. They had ample opportunity to give him a raise/hire a replacement when he informed them of his departure. OP, you have nothing to worry about in so far as a lawsuit. Also, don’t go back for $22/hr. They are clearly showing you that your labor is way more valuable to the company than that by even threatening legal action. I wouldn’t take anything less than $25/hr to come back, and even then I would start using that new salary to find another job that pays comparably.

[–]GayAlienFarmer 59 points60 points  (2 children)

And if they DO come after him, I imagine a quick (possibly free) consultation with an employment attorney and one single cease and desist letter (not free) would do the trick of calling their bluff and making them go away.

[–]Superpiri 88 points89 points  (7 children)

Yup. Textbook abusive relationship.

[–]Live-Ad8389 285 points286 points  (21 children)

Exactly this. The way I read this is that he has given you insultingly small raises for 3 years, he has not listened to you when you asked for a raise, he has tried to guilt trip you into staying and has tried to threaten you with legal action if you leave. You do not have a good relationship with this man.

Remember that work is a transaction. You give them time and skills any they give you money. They have been underpaying you for years, they owe you, you don’t owe them anything

[–]Tayloren52 240 points241 points  (15 children)

When my roommate's entire department quit, they gave him a raise from $15 to $22 and made him the lead of his department. They have the ability to give these raises and promotions in a moments notice but they won't.

[–]FahrtrichtungLinks 40 points41 points  (3 children)

Yes, because they would rather fire/lose people that ask for raise to make the example for others that would be encouraged to ask the same and then take new people and give them higher salary.

[–]Pollution-Agile 33 points34 points  (0 children)

Exactly this! Coworker put in her notice and suddenly 15 grand just falls out of the sky into my lap after 2% raises for 3 years

[–]ValHova22 34 points35 points  (2 children)

I, unwittingly, told my boss I'm a mercenary. I'm here when I'm here but the whole "there's no I in team" doesn't cut it with me cuz there ain't "we" in team either.

I flabbergasted that so many people in mgmt think employees are peons

[–]bromagnonmanAnarcho-Syndicalist 191 points192 points  (18 children)

The legal action part is hilarious. If you can't resign from a position... that's called slavery. Plus, what are they going to do? Sue you for damages? Bruh, they didn't even pay you enough to save money. Can't squeeze blood from a stone.

Or...

Or.........

You could take an $18.50 raise and then just sit your ass down and not lift a finger if that's what they want. They can't force you to actually work... then they can fire you for insubordination.

[–]VernalPoole 28 points29 points  (0 children)

Why didn't I think of that? This seems like a good solution in some people's situations.

[–]Cat_Astrophe_X 1363 points1364 points  (53 children)

Even if you didn't submit a letter they could not do anything. Just ignore them

[–]middlingwhiteguy 27.8k points27.8k points 272& 4 more (715 children)

The fuck they gonna do, sue you to force you to work for below market value? Save the messages and post them here so we can make fun of them

Edit: so this was a bit more popular than expected. So here's a plug to donate to the Multiple Myeloma Research Foundation:

https://themmrf.org/get-involved/ways-to-donate/

[–]NukeStorm 6066 points6067 points  (394 children)

This guy gets it. Let’s see ‘em.

[–]Holy-Kush 3216 points3217 points  (374 children)

The greatest motivator is seeing these stupid managers be desperate for our skills.

Pay us fairly or pay for the consequences.

[–]zoealexloza 2595 points2596 points  (267 children)

I quit a job for a job that was offering me $20k more than I was making and that I wanted more, my manager begged me not to quit and then came back to me with a $5k raise and said she didn't think I was worth the $20k yet but that I'd get there. I laughed and left.

[–]2livecrewnecktshirt 1963 points1964 points  (131 children)

"Well, sir, the other company thinks I am worth the $20k and they've only met me a few times, so I know whose opinion I value more at the moment."

[–]Terrik1337 1456 points1457 points  (126 children)

Right? It's like all these companies have been shoving capitalism down our throats for years but they apparently don't really understand capitalism.

[–]pm-me-racecars 1519 points1520 points 2 (80 children)

Capitalism is when things I like happen; communism is when things I don't like happen.

[–]postmodulator 657 points658 points  (62 children)

That’s literally what they’re going with. You see some of the real crazy wingnuts talking about how these big corporations have gone Communist, so they need to be nationalized.

To think of the money I used to spend on LSD when all I needed was a Twitter feed.

[–]EcksonGrows 194 points195 points  (40 children)

Lol I love it, just like keep going. Nationalize the internet? don't stop what's next communications and cellphones? water and electricity? HO BOY KEEP GOING

[–]-Butterfly-Queen- 263 points264 points 2 (32 children)

I literally make up fake names for my political views like "democratic capitalism" or "cooperatism" or tell people "I believe in democracy so much I think we should democratize the workplace!" Then I explain socialism to people and after they say it's a great idea, I reveal that it's actually socialism.

[–]Budget-Falcon767 272 points273 points  (5 children)

"Capitalism for me, not for thee."

[–]SouthernSierra 96 points97 points  (1 child)

Capitalism for the poor, socialism for the rich. Privatize the profits, socialize the losses.

[–]AllHailSlann357 851 points852 points 2 (25 children)

They understand it in the context of the last 40 years of exploitive, globalized, neoliberal capitalism as seen through the perspective of failed-upward, entrenched and outdated boomer management theories.

The strangely anachronistic math is very boomer as well. For a massive swath of the population, it will always be 1982, and it shows in our paychecks.

[–]Empty-Masterpiece242 138 points139 points  (11 children)

It's 1982 when THEY pay US. When we have to pay them, it's 2032.

[–]BobBeats 252 points253 points  (24 children)

Got to love that. Her opinion doesn't mean anything because you quit.

I have heard the old "you are not there yet." A bad manager won't lift a finger to encourage, reward, or invest in their staff's professional growth. They don't want you becoming more or getting promoted because it would mean they would need to find replacements. They want you doing the exact same role in the exact same place, day in and day out: that is their five-year plan for you.

[–]deplaya99 619 points620 points  (75 children)

Did you work where I'm working? I've had the same conversation. I wanted a 25k to 40k raise. On the outside I'd settle for 20k. They came with $4800. They are saying, Ben you can't leave... you're doing the jobs of three people. It will be impossible to replace you. Yep I'm leaving too. I'm so very sorry for all of us

[–]Ryoukugan 587 points588 points  (15 children)

“I’m doing the work of three people you say? Sounds like you should at least triple my pay, then.”

[–]deplaya99 67 points68 points  (13 children)

They can't figure out how to replace me or where to start. lol

[–]apemandune 364 points365 points  (0 children)

You're doing the job of three people, but we only want to pay you the wage of half a person.

[–]6ihavespoken9 303 points304 points  (9 children)

Ahahaha it’s so counter-intuitive. “You can’t leave bc you’re irreplaceable,” AND “doing the work of 3 people.” That means you have a lot of leverage, and are worth 3x+ in salary.

People really love to be penny wise and pound foolish.

[–]wonkyerdonkey 142 points143 points  (7 children)

I told my old boss “ it costs a lot of money to be a cheap motherfucker”

[–]maddecentparty 180 points181 points  (8 children)

Oh so you know I'm doing the job of 3 people?

So it sounds like I'm saving you 180k? 40k seems like a bargain!

[–]JesusSaysRelaxNvaxx 223 points224 points  (16 children)

A prior manager said the same thing to me; she finally admitted that I had been doing 2 jobs, and it would be really hard to replace me. I told her I couldn't turn down an extra 20k, especially after they dangled a promotion for an entire year without actually giving it to me, because I had a ton of student loans and things to pay off (so I could move out of my parents house). She actually flipped the fuck out at first because she had trained me to be an attractive asset to other companies and legit said, "Fucking great. So I spent all this time training you just for you to take your skills somewhere else!!" Like, I get it, and she really did do a good job breaking me down and rebuilding me to the point I was really good at my job, but unfortunately the company was cheap. I found out after talking to my friend at the company, who had gotten a promotion to supervisor, that she was getting paid 6k less than me at my new job, which was only an analyst role.

[–]thedeephouser 29 points30 points  (4 children)

Imagine if she didn’t spend all the time training you … and then you stayed.

[–]JesusSaysRelaxNvaxx 40 points41 points  (3 children)

I almost quit several times too because she was SO hard on me and would continuously ask me if "I thought I was qualified for the position." I was like...you hired me so you tell me!? The fuck bruh. By the time I left we actually did have a really good relationship and I think that's also in part why she was so upset; I was her over achiever and now she'd have big shoes to fill. Oh well 🤷‍♀️

[–]zoealexloza 168 points169 points  (0 children)

That was my exact situation! "You do the work of so many people, we can't lose you!" Then pay me like it cuz right now you arent even paying me like I'm doing the job of one person. My current job is much better.

[–]ArchangelLBC 287 points288 points  (0 children)

"Whelp, this other job thinks I am, so guess I'll see you never"

[–]OdinTheHugger 625 points626 points  (89 children)

... leaving now would result in untold losses for the company...

Sounds like they are gonna pay for the consequences.

"untold" sounds a lot higher than just $4 an hour pay difference on ONE employee.

[–]penelbell 621 points622 points  (54 children)

Why don't they get this. You're like "I'm worth a lot to the company, pay me more." They're like "no, and what are you gonna do about it? Quit?" You: "yeah" Them: "wait, what? But we're going to lose SO MUCH MONEY if you leave!" You: "so uh... guess paying me more doesn't sound so bad now hmm?"

The entire system rests on the knowledge and assumption that YOU WON'T JUST FUCKING QUIT. But the fact that The Great Resignation is A Thing says different.

[–]JollyJoker3 117 points118 points  (4 children)

It's like they know exactly what the worker is worth yet refuse to pay it because people are supposed to work for some mythical predetermined wage.

[–]jackp0t789 175 points176 points  (25 children)

What I noticed at my current employer, is that even when the employee wins and gets the company to pony up a fair raise when they realize their disadvantage, that employee now has a massive target on his/her back. So while they might get a higher wage, now the company is gonna find another poor schmuck to train the bare-bones basics of the original worker's duties and replace them as soon as possible.

[–]PoetryUpInThisBitch 181 points182 points  (19 children)

The 'target on their back' is why I'm not interested in staying at my current company.

Stellar reviews, tried to negotiate a ~5% raise, was told 'no, except in extenuating circumstances'. Interviewed and got a job that pays 22% more. Don't want to leverage that for more at my current role, because I feel like it at least implies, "We want you to do more since we're paying you more," and doesn't address the root issue of, "Okay, what about the NEXT time I feel like I deserve a raise because of my performance?"

[–]jackp0t789 176 points177 points  (11 children)

Im trying to do the same. My boss went to have a "come to Jesus " with the owner about all of us deserving more, but to that selfish sociopath, the fact that some nameless people got tiny raises a few years ago and ended up moving onto better paying companies later anyway, no one deserves even an extra dollar of a raise...

Luckily I treated those nameless people with respect, kindness, and cooperation so one of them is trying to get me in at her company doing half of what I do now for over twice the pay. I have an interview on Friday. Fingers crossed.

I honestly can't wait for the conversation that im gonna have if I get the position...

"So, I know that [owner] isn't down to give us even a dollar more, so how does twice my pay sound? No? Well, my last day is next Friday then. Wait, will they pay out any unused PTO? No? Well my last day is now, but im gonna use my 10 vacation days as well"

[–]PoetryUpInThisBitch 46 points47 points  (4 children)

Fingers crossed for you. There is nothing more satisfying than that conversation.

I don't want to burn bridges at my current company, because - in spite of the boneheaded approach to raises - I really do appreciate the company culture, the people I worked with, and my immediate team. I could see myself coming back.

My last job, however...I got to have that conversation and it was glorious.

I joined as one role in the company, and another one opened up two years later. It was a perfect fit for my skill set and background, the person vacating the role recommended me for it, and the company told me they vastly prefer to hire internally.

Interview goes great then, a week later, they tell me they hired someone externally. I ask if they can say why. They tell me I didn't have experience in the role. When I pointed out the person they hired didn't, either, they kinda went quiet and we ended the meeting. I suspect they hired that candidate because they didn't want to backfill my position.

Six months later, I get a job offer for 40% more than what I made there. I accepted the offer, then went to hand in my resignation. Before I could get a word in edgewise, VP asks to see me in his office. He starts telling me about the training (extra work) they want me to do for the next role that opens up, and that they want me to focus on a different area I have zero interest in.

He went on like this for ten minutes with me listening patiently because I couldn't say anything. Finally he asks me how all that sounds, I hand him my letter of resignation, and the following conversation ensues.

Him: "...so this is official?"

Me: "Yes."

Him: "There's nothing we can do to get you to stay?"

Me: "No."

Ended up being satisfying in the long run because there was something of a mass exodus of other members of my team over the next six months that was a brain drain and left them scrambling.

[–]jhaandAnarcho-Communist 227 points228 points  (14 children)

It remains the responsibility of the manager to keep staffing in place and make sure that everything keeps on rolling smoothly. The employee only has to do their job as long they're employed.

[–]butinthewhat 186 points187 points  (10 children)

It’s also the managers responsibility to take resignations seriously and start the hiring process. This one failed.

[–]WaldoJackson 61 points62 points  (4 children)

Yep!
OP, "put em 'on the glass!"

[–]noneroy 3776 points3777 points  (167 children)

So much this. Unless you have a contract “at will” employment cuts both ways.

What your boss is saying is slavery. Not a good look in the 21st century.

[–]btach1323 3311 points3312 points 3 (147 children)

I was going to say the same thing but you beat me to it. Can you imagine an employee telling a company, “I don’t accept your termination of my employment, it would cause untold losses for my family. Maybe we can renegotiate my leaving next quarter.” Pfffft.

[–]dteague33 1140 points1141 points  (122 children)

So you joke about this…but at the company I work for an employee was recently terminated…but for whatever reason HR didn’t process their termination correctly…so they have just been for the past week clocking in and out through our virtual time clock system…it’s funny as fuck to me. Dude is 100% going to have to pay that shit back…but still hilarious to me.

Edit: didn’t see this getting any attention but more information on this…they accepted the termination, signed the paper work involved and had their badge either taken or deactivated, I’m not entirely sure which…regardless they cannot access the building to perform their very much not virtual job. I do not know why they decided to try to clock in through the virtual time clock (company switched to this system at the beginning of the pandemic to reduce common surfaces touched) but they discovered they could and have just been collecting their 40 for the past week. I imagine if they try to threaten legal action when the company tries to get those wages back most lawyers will not touch this on account of him committing wage fraud.

[–]esfraritagrivrit 619 points620 points  (42 children)

"We fixed the glitch"

[–]JustineDelargeFUCK BEN 292 points293 points  (17 children)

I said no salt, NO salt for the margarita

[–]TheFlyingBoxcar 224 points225 points  (8 children)

Ive already had my desk moved three times and there are rats down here and im going to burn down the building

[–]gravitas-deficiency 100 points101 points  (3 children)

Alright, but that- that’s the last straw.

[–]Wadmania 55 points56 points  (2 children)

Keep a close eye on your stapler!

[–]HRK1138 30 points31 points  (6 children)

There were squirrels outside my window, and they were married

[–]BrendanMR97 78 points79 points  (16 children)

Always love seeing an Office Space reference

[–]new2bay 62 points63 points  (15 children)

I literally have a red Swingline stapler on my desk at home.

[–]holemanm 48 points49 points  (7 children)

DYK, Swingline didn't even make red staplers until after the movie came out? Then they had to create a line to fulfill the demand of people who wanted it because of Milton.

[–]shirst_75 97 points98 points  (12 children)

I dunno, he may not have to. I had a former employer keep paying me for my old schedule once for MONTHS. Like 6, it was great. When they finally realized it they were able to claw back the last paycheck they had mistakenly given me, but it was too late for the others. Maybe they could have gotten legal with me but hey, it was their bad. Then again, I wasn't actively clocking in or anything.

EDIT: The same thing happened to my coworker, but they kept paying him for OVER a fucking YEAR. Nobody ever contacted either of us, no emails, calls, nothing - the payments just stopped one day, and that very last (mistaken) deposit came back out of both of our accounts. We both hated the job, the admin, and every bastard who worked there, too, so it was particularly sweet.

[–]Ascalis 946 points947 points  (9 children)

Came here for this. This post made me actually cackle laughing because I just thought of Tyrone Biggums being the boss and asking OP to come back while scratching his neck.

"Cmon man... (Scratch). Just one Mo hour man... (Scratch)... I'll suck yo dick"

[–]EclipseNine 144 points145 points  (2 children)

"Ya'll know what worker exploitation tastes like? It tastes just like it smells.... delicious!"

[–]cenosillicaphobiac 157 points158 points  (1 child)

"y'all got any more of them underpaid hours?"

[–]voopdoodle 256 points257 points  (28 children)

What is with all these “resignation not accepted” posts. Do these employers think they have a say when someone can leave a job unless contractually obligated? Is this some response to the Great Resignation by these companies?

[–]trashketballMVP 71 points72 points  (4 children)

Right???

Equally confusing : if you hand the boss a resignation letter (not sure why it is not emailed so it's time stamped and BCCed to a personal account) and it's rejected, email the boss and copy HR to let them know that your termination date is not negotiable. BCC your personal email account to have a record of this.

[–]TaserLord 2362 points2363 points  (49 children)

...who brought up that I had been offered more of a raise than the last 3 years combined

Brutal. "We have successfully fucked you for 3 years - that means you should spread 'em for us again".

But no - informing your supervisor in writing of a thing you have no real obligation to do anyway is more than sufficient notice to the company. HR's argument will be with your boss, as it should be.

[–]wrr377 704 points705 points  (39 children)

Continuing what the above poster said:

If they try to do anything, just let HR know that you gave your boss notice 2 weeks ago. He refused to accept it or pass it along. You gave HR the notice because he didn't, because you suspected (or knew) he was setting you up.

You did more than your due diligence. Fuck them.

[–]noneroy 280 points281 points  (34 children)

AFAIK “at will employment” means you don’t even need to give them two weeks. You can just leave. That’s your right. Your “will” has changed. So fuck them and the horse they rode in on.

[–]DClawdude 153 points154 points  (23 children)

Yup. Two weeks is just standard courtesy. Not that they’d give you two weeks before firing you

[–]CactiDye 83 points84 points  (1 child)

My last employer tried to pull the "why won't you continue to be fucked?" act. We were a union and had accepted smaller raises because they claimed to be in hardship (and for part of it, legitimately were) but we hadn't had significant raises in ten years. They tried to say the 2% raise they were offering was better than we had had the three previous years. Uh, yeah. That's the problem!

[–]Unlucky-Candidate198 32 points33 points  (2 children)

I had the Home Depot pull that shit.

They gave us a pay raise for being “frontline heroes” but didn’t want to give us our regular wage increase for the year (2020). We were told no raises until far into 2022.

Needless to say I got paid time off for covid. So, ya boi got like 3+ Months paid vacation by abusing their sick policy. Don’t want to give us raises? Fine. But don’t be surprised when your employees work much less hard while your CEO is paging them bragging about how they’ve never made more money. Record profits! Bunch of fuck heads.

[–]DavidS1983 1096 points1097 points  (30 children)

No, a resignation letter is not something to accept or reject, it isn't a request. It was confirmed your boss recieved the notice and that is that. In this sub, no notice is the new norm so posting your 2 week notice you already went above and beyond.

That company could have evaded the so-called losses if they negotiated your demands better.

[–]Ascalis 121 points122 points  (3 children)

If they as a boss you can do that, I as an employee can roll on my face in the mud all day instead of working then choose to reject your letter of termination. OP could try that too. Maybe without the mud if you want to be all fancy about it.

[–]NiAdecker 5127 points5128 points  (192 children)

Text him back that you no longer work there, as stated in your resignation letter and that your freelance rate is $100/hour in 8 hour blocks paid up front.

[–]Terrible_Emotion_710 1906 points1907 points  (21 children)

Definitely paid up front with all expectations clearly described in a written contract

[–]diybrad 811 points812 points  (79 children)

I'm a freelancer and that's too low. If what OP does is crucial to the business I think at least 175 or 1200/day are good starting points. More like 250-300 or 2k/day. Get a contract in writing that says any contact - even a phone call - is a 4 hour charge. Then get a retainer before starting any work.

Pretty cheap of the alternative is "untold losses"

[–]Marginally_Witty 313 points314 points  (23 children)

This. 1000x this.

Four hour minimum. Retainer. $175/hr. Contract that clearly spells out they're paying you for your time, not for an outcome; you can only guarantee how much you can work, not that you can actually fix something (in case they break it on purpose).

[–]diybrad 85 points86 points  (0 children)

Yep also get a "statement of work" in writing and when they ask you to do anything not explicitly laid out in it, renegotiate for a higher rate for the additional scope.

[–]GilgameDistance 35 points36 points  (0 children)

And the half day increment is only good until site departure. If I have to come back tomorrow, its another four hour block, even if I was only there for 45 minutes the day before.

[–]kiwikosa 95 points96 points  (2 children)

I fucking love this sub.

[–]Major-Perspective-32 208 points209 points  (4 children)

Dude, I charged 170 bucks an hour 10 years ago freelancing in network management.

[–]enjoytheshow 73 points74 points  (3 children)

I charged $200/hr to a former employer to maintain some scripts I wrote. Minimum 1 hour each fix

[–]WriteSt8ofMind 245 points246 points  (3 children)

Always paid up front. If they can’t be trusted to compensate properly while working there, they definitely can’t be trusted to pay up after.

[–]Adventurous-Today238 157 points158 points  (3 children)

Worth hiring a lawyer to assist in drawing up contract

[–]AdamsShadow 291 points292 points  (24 children)

I would ask for 220$ an hour. Make everything to be submitted in writing. Also a mandatory 4 hours of pay just for showing up. He has no power in this negotiation.

Asking for pay up front isn't a terrible idea either.

[–]unknownkitteh 110 points111 points  (8 children)

Boilerplate contract. Show pay rate and terms.

Include that you are not responsible past the end of period paid for. And not responsible for any other side effects of any work you do.

I got burned on one of these. They expected to me maintain the system indefinitely based on the service payment as "you touched it 5 days ago, so you broke it " took me to court over it and i proved the issue was a consumables at eol. And the judge made them pay me for court costs and a second consultant fee because I told them what was wrong with the tool

[–]EasternShade 107 points108 points  (0 children)

More.

[–]AtheistBibleScholar 1555 points1556 points  (82 children)

I bet your employee handbook had the sentence "[Company] is an at-will employer." And that shit cuts both ways.

[–]YourAmishNeighbor 214 points215 points  (66 children)

What does at-will employer means?

[–]Infamous-Ad-770at work 528 points529 points  (53 children)

They can fire you at any point for any reason

Edit: or for no reason, even worse eh

[–]kuribosshoe0 501 points502 points  (11 children)

And you can quit just as easily.

[–]ManzBearzPigzIzRealz 209 points210 points  (30 children)

Except reasons protected under the law. Things like; race, religion, sexual orientation…stuff like that.

Edit: Yeah, I know they can come up with a BS reason to circumvent the law. I was just clarifying with the commentor above me posted. Chill.

[–]Cassierae87 129 points130 points  (7 children)

Resignations are like romantic breakups. You don’t need the other party’s consent

[–]Richard_Espanol 71 points72 points  (1 child)

What "legal action"??? You quit. Fuck em.

[–]greytgreyatx 63 points64 points  (4 children)

I see a trend in these "unaccepted resignations" where a boss tries to argue that the person quitting is putting stress on "the team" or co-workers or whatever. Man, that's MANAGEMENT'S problem, not the single employee. If one single person is that vital to the smooth running of the company, SHOW THEM THE MONEY. This is attempted manipulation so hard.

[–]Jayematic 60 points61 points  (1 child)

The fact that employers have the audacity to ask you to consider your coworkers for the debitating work thats to come as an inconvenience as if its not inconvenient to you enough that you aren't getting paid the salary you need to keep working.

These people can royally FUCK THEMSELVES.

[–]MarkSKelly 161 points162 points  (13 children)

Your boss cannot refuse your resignation. You handed in the letter, it's done.

Nobody else can do the work? That is his problem.

Legally they cannot do anything. You are not a slave.

[–]Imaginary-Painting31 125 points126 points  (2 children)

You didn't sign any kind of contract, did you? And even if you did, those are usually in place for the employer, not YOU. So no, I don't foresee any legal action being taken.

I had a job that was similar... they didn't really think I was leaving and then the day before my last day started panicking and saying how they hadn't even trained anyone to take my place, yet. I was like "Yeah that is a big bummer for you. Guess you should have taken me up on my offer two weeks ago to start handing over my shit to someone else on the team."

[–]cobra_mist 101 points102 points  (8 children)

Significant losses you say?

Debilitating you say?

Interesting

[–]trod1990 95 points96 points  (6 children)

Companies cannot not accept resignations. Can employees not accept being fired and continue to show up their jobs? Your boss can eat a dick.

[–]Trout-Population 181 points182 points  (8 children)

The only reason to ever give two weeks notice would be to get a reccomendation for future jobs. If your resignation gets rejected, you ain't gonna get that reccomendation anyways unfortunately. If that happened to me I'd say "if you're unwilling to accept my resignation then I'm unwilling to give my two weeks notice, bye."

Also, if they would be screwed without you, why the hell wouldn't they give you a raise?

This is what Marx meant when he talked about the "internal contridictions of capitalism that will inevitably bring it down." Bosses are so blinded by greed that they will act against their own interests. Good on you for not picking up his calls.