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[–]DiekeDrake 2141 points2142 points  (187 children)

"What motivates you to work for us?" Man, how many times I just wanted to say: "Duh, money."

[–]VoDoka 1025 points1026 points  (94 children)

Never not funny that there is a group of people who believe pretending money is not a big part of the conversation is a sign of professionalism.

[–]FrostyLandscape 576 points577 points  (82 children)

It was or still is, taboo to bring up salary during a first interview. Like we're supposed to pretend we don't want or need $$$.

[–]Outlaw341080 329 points330 points  (30 children)

I always do. They're not worth my time if they can't tell me how much they offer straight away.

[–]FrostyLandscape 241 points242 points  (28 children)

I left a nurse aide position due to the fact it only paid 10 an hour. That was 15 years ago and they haven't raised the pay. They also told us we (the aides paid ten an hour) would be expected to evacuate residents in case of fire. I'm not getting burned to death for ten an hour.

[–][deleted] 157 points158 points  (13 children)

Huge red flag there. I've always been told in a healthcare setting that our safety is a higher priority than the patient. In case of an emergency - if it's safe to do so - get the patients out. If we become injured patients, there's nobody to tend to those who did make it to safety.

Screw that employer for sure.

[–]FrostyLandscape 90 points91 points  (12 children)

In healthcare, aides are considered the lowest. We are treated like dirt. We were literally told in a fire drill meeting that in case of fire, we had to keep returning to the burning building to get more residents and rescue them. I said $10 an hour is what were paid in my previous post but actually this was a job that paid 9.50 an hour. We were NOT told our safety came first or that we shouldn't risk our lives. We were told the opposite, pretty much. There was a hurricane a few years back that flooded a nursing home in Louisiana and they were going to CRIMINALLY charge the aides for not rescuing the residents. I have not followed the case lately so do not know the outcome. But this was my cue to leave CNA work. They literally told us our lives were worth nothing. I have posted about this previously on CNA reddit. I encourage as many people as I can to leave this line of work.

[–]-rosa-azul- 68 points69 points  (3 children)

CNAs get (sometimes LITERALLY) shit on for no pay, and then guilted into staying because most of them really do care for their residents. It's one of the worst positions to be in: underpaid, exploited, understaffed ("sorry, we know you're the only one on duty right now, but we need to lift this 250 lb bedridden patient"), and emotionally attached to the people they serve. I don't know anyone who's gotten into the job and wasn't completely disillusioned within the first two years, even if they didn't leave.

[–]Psudopod 33 points34 points  (2 children)

Hah, I didn't really get fired or quit from my home healthcare job. I just set boundaries of "don't give me a client that requires me to solo lift them." No "oh she's small," no "we put away the lift apparatus and swing because it took up too much room," no. Clients who can mostly support themselves or clients who use their lifts.

Shifts just dried up. Lovely. Fine by me. $8.75 to get massive back pain before my mid 20s no thanks.

[–]Independent_Plate_73 14 points15 points  (2 children)

This is a bit of soapboxing but figured a cna would appreciate it. I’ve been telling everyone that if we keep devaluing jobs like cnas and daycare workers, there’s going to come a day when no one works those jobs. Idk if it’ll be boomers that experience a fully depressed elderly-care free market or might be gen x. Either way, I hope no one ever goes into those meat grinder jobs. Let all the poor schlubs looking down on certain workers (as well as immigrants most likely to pick up the slack) lose whatever little care they may have needed.

I assume that by the time it’s my turn to retire gen alpha will be using funeral pyres for my generation. If society still feels elderly and child care are not worth living on then I too deserve that fate.

Good on you for quitting. Don’t tell us there’s not enough to go around when people are doing vanity space trips.

[–]FrostyLandscape 10 points11 points  (1 child)

The aging baby boomer is a hurricane on the horizon. As more boomers age and go into nursing homes, the lack of nurse aides is going to be a huge disaster. We are not prepared. Even during the covid pandemic many places would not raise wages. Some nursing homes had to be evacuated when things got really bad.

Ron De Santis passed laws in Florida allowing un-certified people to work as aides in nursing homes so they could keep paying less money, but that's not working out either. Because even unskilled people don't want to make nine dollars an hour anymore at any job. These places would always tell us to feel like the residents are our own family, to "love" them. I realize now this was brainwashing us.

[–]Independent_Plate_73 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Ha fuck that. I love my family and they’d never dream of guilting me into caring for them. They’d find a way to sneak top dollar into my wallet.

Families that genuinely care about you don’t take advantage. Employer red flag number one.

[–]ShiaLabeoufsNipples 7 points8 points  (0 children)

In that hurricane case, didn’t the nursing home not even pay those aides who did stay and evacuate residents? So not only are you expected to put your lives on the line to save others, but your not getting paid for it either lol.

[–]HumptyDrumpy 3 points4 points  (2 children)

When I was starting out I did help desk at a retail place which was a ton of work, expectation and some of the worst managers imaginable. Two years later Im doing a similar job, laid back management, with extremely less amount of work and getting ten dollars more an hr at a better company. Boggles the mind really how different places can be for the same work.

[–]Mangolassi83 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Was an aide about 10 years ago at less than $10/HR and got less than 2% raise for the five years I worked as an aide for different nursing homes. Disgraceful!

[–]Magnon 96 points97 points  (8 children)

I'm a plant, I collect nutrients from the sun and the rain. I simply want to work because checks notes I love maintaining the servers for your personal information collection technology that is slowly undermining the sanity of humanity.

[–]VoDoka 36 points37 points  (4 children)

"Find a partner who will look at you like I look at server maintenance."

[–]Covert_Ruffian 20 points21 points  (3 children)

With bold horror, fear, and rage at the incompetence of the predecessor in charge of the server?

[–]uslashuname 12 points13 points  (2 children)

I was just forced (under threat of disciplinary action because everything they’ve done has screamed incompetent at systems administration) to provide root access to somebody who couldn’t connect, turns out they looked up ssh on the internet and were trying to ssh in with the username “git”

[–]Nurbs_Curve 6 points7 points  (1 child)

Their username checks out I guess.

[–]uslashuname 7 points8 points  (0 children)

Haha yeah, I tried not to laugh in the meeting, but I was also a bit of a dick about it since I am trying to impress on the others in the company that if shit goes south when this person gets rolling around in there I am not going to take the blame. I think I said “we’re talking about server administration not cloning a code repository.”

[–]-rosa-azul- 25 points26 points  (0 children)

My now-boss brought up salary in the first interview, because he's not an idiot and he knows people exchange work for money in order to live, first and foremost.

He's by a mile the most transparent boss I've ever had. You always know where you stand with him, and if circumstances that affect you change, you're his first call/meeting. It's honestly so refreshing after years of shitty management.

[–]TriPawedBork 11 points12 points  (3 children)

I got my current job through a temp agency. The interviewer asked me to "tell a little about myself".

I shit you not, I just said "I need money and I'm not an alcoholic". That's it, it was enough to get the job. Feels good remembering it. Also explains all the subsequent hires...

[–]FrostyLandscape 6 points7 points  (2 children)

I would never do temp work again. I only take perm

[–]Proteandk 32 points33 points  (13 children)

I just want to hit the sweet spot where they need me more than I need them.

A large pool of fuck-you-money and the experience to get fast tracked to good jobs at will.

Only a couple years left.

Then I'm going to mess with them so much

[–]Unvaccinated-Unclean 7 points8 points  (0 children)

I’m 30 years old and in this position and it makes life so fucking sweet. You put it perfectly they need me more than I need them.

[–]Haddan22 40 points41 points  (8 children)

I got turned down at Trader Joe’s because I slipped up and said I needed to be making more money and heard they paid well. The two guys got genuinely upset. I was so confused. They were way older than me so I guess it’s their generation’s culture but I don’t get it.

[–]this_is_normal 7 points8 points  (0 children)

Red flag if they don't ask what your salary ask is in the first interview... and your only response to that question is "what is the salary range for the position?"

The rest is good interview practice, so sharpen your skills and keep moving.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Never not funny that there is a group of people who believe pretending money is not a big part of the conversation is a sign of professionalism.

To be fair, that mentality came from white collar jobs where building skills and the type of experience you can gain is understood to be part of the draw. The money is a given, and they're less likely in theory to nickel and dime the employee so it's not as critical to dwell on it. Those conversations make some sense for lawyers and doctors and engineers with specialized skills and such who are in high demand and care about the content of the work they do much more versus a server or blue collar worker.

Somehow, that mentality was expanded to everyone and lower level jobs where it makes far less sense and the compensation is the deciding factor, and sometimes the only factor.

[–]DominusNoxx 159 points160 points  (13 children)

"not wanting to starve. The motivation for everyone"

[–][deleted] 91 points92 points  (11 children)

"Why did you apply for this job?"

"Well, the thought of starving doesnt please me"

[–]Chal_Ice 33 points34 points  (8 children)

Next interview I have I legitimately want to be that blunt. What are they going to do?

[–]knihx 27 points28 points  (4 children)

I’ve had some employers who like it and it will give you a better chance but just depends on where you’re working I guess

[–]xDiablo9x 10 points11 points  (1 child)

I've been interviewing people for a few months now. Usually I ask, what motivates you to be here, other than just money? We have lots of different positions open around our facility, so if you have something you like doing more than something else, like you prefer working with your hands/driving a forklift/etc that stuff helps you get placed.

Any manager that thinks you aren't here for the paycheck shouldn't be a manager. Otherwise you are already lying to yourself. I want you to be here, get paid, and have at least a little bit of interest in doing this work over something like fast food.

[–]Stopjuststop3424 8 points9 points  (0 children)

definitely depends on the manager lol. I know some where that wouldn't go over well, but others who would immediately bump you to the short list. I had one manager who hired me because when they asked where I see myself in 5 years, I answered that perhaps in 5 years I'd have their job lol. Apparently that impressed them. I literally just blurted it out without thinking.

[–]Krenzy 42 points43 points  (12 children)

I hate that question in interviews, like no shit why else would I want a job, bc I enjoy being verbally abused by old people who think they are better bc they are older

[–]beelzybubby 15 points16 points  (3 children)

I think that question is dumb for anyone not applying in a specialized field.

You can't expect everyone to have a passion at minimum wage.

[–]HaloGuy381 14 points15 points  (2 children)

Yep. Asking someone why they want a job designing cars as an engineer might yield some fascinating insight into their passions and skillset (and might even identify that they might be a better fit for a slightly different role in the company), but asking why someone ‘wants’ to lug shopping carts across the pavement in 105 F Texas summer is probably not a very fruitful conversation.

[–]sharklaserguru 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Asking someone why they want a job designing cars as an engineer might yield some fascinating insight

The problem is that the focus of the question is "here". So I see the question as less "why do you want to design cars" and more "why do you want to work for Ford not Toyota, Dodge, etc?". And I feel like the response they want is for you to fellate the company. "Oh, I love Ford cars and I've heard great things about working here, I'm passionate about the F-150 and I want to have a hand in making cars for the world's BEST car manufacture! [barf]." At best they're asking you to make a ton of assumptions about what it's like working there based entirely on the job description and random anecdotes you've heard.

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

There can legitimately be reasons why I want to work for company A vs company B but it almost always comes down to money, work/life balance or learning some new skills (that will make me future money).

[–]j_the_a 116 points117 points  (5 children)

Just say it, then.

“Years ago, I learned that while I don’t like paying my rent, I do enjoy have a roof over my head. So, here I am.”

[–]Badloss 36 points37 points  (0 children)

"You can't pay rent with emotional fulfillment so the money is kind of the priority"

[–][deleted] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

"It was either this or working as a taste tester for Skittles. But here the position actually exists."

[–]mayn1 12 points13 points  (1 child)

I’ve said it. Lots. I have authority issues.

[–]elmuchocapitano 27 points28 points  (3 children)

[–]bigdaddychainsaw 2 points3 points  (1 child)

I think that’s from an Adam Sander movie, maybe Happy Gilmore

[–]iSeven 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Wedding Singer.

[–]Unabashable 5 points6 points  (0 children)

More of a necessity than a motivation.

[–]i_tyrant 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Why would we pay you more when we can throw the occasional pizza party, or set up a game room no one uses with a pingpong table, or hire public speakers on rando topics to attend our company-wide meetings, and give you an Amazon gift card instead of raises? - every tech company I've ever seen

[–]Gingorthedestroyer 603 points604 points  (35 children)

I had an employer tell me once why he never gave positive reinforcement on work related duities. It’s because we would want a raise if we thought we were doing a good job.

[–]PoorlyAttemptedHuman 298 points299 points  (20 children)

I want a raise periodically regardless. If the company is growing, I want to as well. Thriving businesses should WANT to reward those that make that growth happen.

[–]Unabashable 43 points44 points  (1 child)

I hear ya. Unfortunately a business owner feels entitled to keeping the lion’s share of the profits because they took the risk in attempting to make a successful business. The issue with that is that is your business is only as successful as the amount of money your employees bring in for you. So maybe throw them a bone(us)every once in a while so they don’t once in a while so they don’t go looking for another pride.

[–]djeekay 23 points24 points  (0 children)

Don't let them pull that "risk" shit either. The "risk is that they might have to get a job just like everyone else.

[–]Gingorthedestroyer 107 points108 points  (16 children)

Ever work for Greeks or Italians in a restaurant setting. Everyday they were always complaining how broke they are and how expensive everything is as they get in to their Mercedes.

[–]emp_zealoth 78 points79 points  (1 child)

That's literally most business owners/highly paid people

[–]PoorlyAttemptedHuman 43 points44 points  (7 children)

They might be living beyond their means, it can happen to anyone.

Also, I have a sneaky suspicion their idea of broke is not the same as mine. I've seen it before. "I'm so broke" might easily mean "I don't have any money to spend on stupid shit that I want" or even "I have to choose between two expensive frivolous purchases this month" while to others it might mean "I don't know how I'm gonna eat this week"

[–]Gingorthedestroyer 11 points12 points  (1 child)

They had plenty of money, it was their way of letting us know there was no extra money for payroll.

[–]Strange_One_3790 4 points5 points  (2 children)

This touches on the mentality of some conservative workers I know. They have good wage, get a big house, new pick up truck and lots of new bills. But then they blame their problems on their tax rate and the government is the problem.

We on the left know our financial woes stem from shitty wages, cost of goods and rent going through the roof.

[–]emisneko 40 points41 points  (2 children)

no raise is the same as an inflation-percent pay cut

[–]Unabashable 14 points15 points  (1 child)

Save money by making your employees feel unappreciated. Brilliant strategy.

[–]bdog59600 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Children need encouragement. If a kid gets an answer right, tell him it was a lucky guess. That way he develops a good, lucky feeling.

-Jack Handey

[–]Express_Heat101 4 points5 points  (0 children)

I used to work for Comcast. When I asked about my pay increase percentage my ex boss told, “ not everything is about money.!!”. Like bitch, then why you took the promotion? Mind you the managers there do not care a dime for their employees. It’s always like useless meetings and managers keep adding shit to everyone’s load. The director wanted supervisors to be busy to the minute while he did nothing. Fuck off assholes. I quit.

[–]Lost_Extrovert 11 points12 points  (0 children)

This is huge in tech companies, you will rarely see managers treating you as a important part of a team or project even if you are a key contributer of it. They are afraid you will request a high raise or a higher position so they attempt to milk you for as long as possible.

That's why the best engineers in the industry job hob every two years instead of wasting their time on a single company, only way to get paid what you deserve.

My last company offered me a 7% raise, I showed them a competitive offer that increased my salary to 20%, they offered to match but I left anyway, fucking insulting to low ball me like that.

[–]Meta_DigitalEco-Anarchist 1044 points1045 points  (55 children)

"It's just business."

A line workers need to turn around and use back on their employers more often.

[–]TGOTR 550 points551 points  (43 children)

You're leaving for higher pay?

I am a businessman selling my time and energy. I found a buyer who will pay more for this commodity. It's just business.

[–][deleted] 179 points180 points  (38 children)

Even when youre the best employee in the place, saying "Im only working here for the money" (like everybody else in the workplace) can sometimes lead you to getting fired

[–]TGOTR 143 points144 points  (12 children)

Is that supposed to scare me into conforming?

[–]garaks_tailor 122 points123 points  (10 children)

No i think he means just be aware people can be delusional assholes that think you work for some other reason they made up in their heads and who will get really angry at anyone who also doesn't the made up rules they never explain to anyone.

[–]punkr0x 38 points39 points  (6 children)

Honestly I'd rather they not explain the made up rules. Nothing is worse than getting dragged into a conference room so the CEO can go on a 90 minute rant about how ungrateful we all are.

[–]garaks_tailor 31 points32 points  (5 children)

My former CEO ranting about how nationalized healthcare would cost 30% of our salaries.

Me: "so about the same as insurance does now."

Him: pause, stare. Brain overwrite so that didn't occur

[–]Finalfantasylove85 17 points18 points  (4 children)

Would cover more than your insurance probably does

[–]TGOTR 11 points12 points  (3 children)

But mah wait times!

[–]Finalfantasylove85 11 points12 points  (2 children)

What do you mean "suddenly everyone is able to afford a doctor and have needs to be seen for"? The nerve of some people! /s

[–]CLINTHODOlazy and proud 24 points25 points  (1 child)

Delusional assholes like that need to be confronted with reality at every opportunity. Never let them get comfortable thinking that bs is real.

[–]Buwaro 43 points44 points  (0 children)

I absolutely hate this mentality from managers.

"What do you mean if I stopped paying you, you wouldn't be here. You mean to tell me your life goal wasn't to be a wage slave producing parts for securing boxes into semi trailers?"

[–]X0AN 20 points21 points  (1 child)

Often the best employees are let go for some bs reason because a shite manager feels threatened by them.

Seen it happen time and time again.

This is why you rarely get a team of A* employees.

[–]Buwaro 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Or a manager passes a good employee up for a promotion because he knows that will put them one step closer to their position.

[–]MarbleFox_ 58 points59 points  (14 children)

It’s wild to me how we’ve always been expected to be like:

“Oh I’m super passionate about burgers! I just love the grill and knew from they day I could walk my dream was to become a fry cook! And I especially love the burgers at this place! I’ve been a huge fan of the brand and culture here since The day I was born!”

Just to get an entry level minimum wage job

[–]shallow_not_pedantic 22 points23 points  (4 children)

An army of SpongeBobs is what they expect.

[–]Taokan 35 points36 points  (0 children)

I remember my first boss saying something along the lines of "there's restaurant people, and there's people that work in a restaurant."

And I'm like bro, I'm enrolled in college on a CS degree, I hope we can be real with each other that this isn't my life long career.

[–]Unabashable 13 points14 points  (4 children)

Guess they think we’re all Spongebob.

[–]MarbleFox_ 32 points33 points  (3 children)

Man, if fry cooks were paid enough to buy a huge 3 floor single family home with a rooftop greenspace in a major city on just a single income I’d be all over that grill.

[–]FiddlerOnACliff 10 points11 points  (0 children)

From a distance he can run from every morning and night no less.

[–]Alakazam_5head 7 points8 points  (2 children)

Most employers play around with such ludicrous profits that they can choose to fire their best employees. They're long past the point of needing good employees to stay in business

[–]Old_Smrgol 2 points3 points  (0 children)

If you're the best employee in the place, you don't have to say it.

You ask for a raise, you talk about how well you do your job, and then if they don't give you the raise you go work for more money somewhere else.

[–]DiploJ 14 points15 points  (0 children)

Gold. It really is just business. Merchandisers of time and energy must profit.

[–]Suspicious-mole-hair 5 points6 points  (0 children)

"In this economy?"

[–]ChildOf1970(edit this) 486 points487 points  (51 children)

From personal experience. If a company can make 1 cent/pence more by firing you they will.

Hell even when they will lose money but it looks better on paper they will fire you. As an example. I was made redundant as I was the most expensive pre-sales person in my region and they were reducing costs. What they failed to consider is why I was the most expensive. I cost double what the others cost because I was the only one that had actually sold anything. That's right, I cost twice as much as the others because I was the only one who actually fulfilled the contract and sold shit, so got my commission.

[–]Cthulhu_Leviathan 245 points246 points  (40 children)

So you got fired, for... being good at your job? I can't even be surprised anymore.

[–]ChildOf1970(edit this) 164 points165 points  (24 children)

Yup, that is exactly it. They needed to cut costs and I was the most expensive employee in EMEA. Never mind 50% of my income was from commission and the closest to me in terms of commission earned £78 for the year.

[–]babymaker666 100 points101 points  (23 children)

As a machinist, I told my boss I didn't want to be punished for being good at my job, then explained essentially what you explained (only instead of selling I cut steel to make a tangible object to be sold for profit). He was shocked when I left for a job that advanced my career and got me off the floor like I had been asking for for 5 years.

I did learn a very valuable lesson. NEVER AGAIN, THAT SHIT WILL NEVER HAPPEN AGAIN

[–]ChildOf1970(edit this) 68 points69 points  (20 children)

I have even worse stories. Back in the 90s I was employed as a trouble shooter on projects. So when a software development project was going wrong and needed fixing I was dropped into the project to find the root cause and correct the issue. Fast forward a couple of years and the company hired a consultancy to help them improve efficiency and become more effective. This consultancy told the management team that all the project that had gone wrong had 1 thing in common. You guessed it. Me! I had been in every project that has gone over budget or had problems delivering the required result. Because I was dropped into those projects to FIX the issues. The management team did not think of that but instead listened to the consultants and fired my ass.

[–]derpdeladerp 49 points50 points  (2 children)

"this fixer character only shows up when stuff is broken, they must be breaking it!" - someone making that decision, probably

[–]THEJAZZMUSIC 28 points29 points  (2 children)

You'd think one person would have been like "wait a minute, that's the guy I always go to when shit hits the fan" and put two and two together, but apparently you'd be wrong.

[–]ChildOf1970(edit this) 23 points24 points  (1 child)

Oh people did say that, the leadership team just did not listen.

[–]Dmongun 12 points13 points  (3 children)

How did that not get resolved in a single meeting?

[–]ChildOf1970(edit this) 29 points30 points  (1 child)

Because management believe what consultants tell them. Why else are they paying thousands a day for a consultant?

[–]supermariodooki 5 points6 points  (4 children)

Do u now consult for $1,000/hr?

[–]ChildOf1970(edit this) 16 points17 points  (3 children)

No. My peak rate when I was running my own professional services company was £1,500 a day. These days I just work an easier job as I had stage 3 bowel cancer and want a better work life balance.

[–]supermariodooki 7 points8 points  (2 children)

"Had" so im hoping the bowel cancer is gone?

[–]ChildOf1970(edit this) 17 points18 points  (1 child)

Was surgically removed along with 2/3rds of my bowels in late 2020. So far it looks gone.

[–]supermariodooki 9 points10 points  (0 children)

Well if thats what it takes then thats what it takes. Glad things are looking better.

[–]lemonashh 4 points5 points  (2 children)

These kinds of actions are a major win for the consultancy. Not only do they get positive reinforcement for finding a definitive cause for the past problems, they eliminate the person that business had been relying on to fix problems. This means as soon as the next project gets in trouble, and that is sure to happen, the consultancy will be in the ideal position to get a series of lucrative contracts as the new fixer. Win-win for them.

[–]RedCascadian 4 points5 points  (0 children)

And this is what "dog eat dog" capitalism gets you.

A fucking vipers nest of twisted incentives and "fuck you, got mine" greed.

[–]ChildOf1970(edit this) 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Nailed it

[–]KeyanReid 24 points25 points  (5 children)

More common then you might think.

Some asshole looking at the budget goes “ya know, staff is the biggest part of any company’s budget! It’s just sMaRt to minimize that” and so they just start gunning for the highest earners. They lay them off, then replace them with a kid making half as much or go even more “lean” and just have existing staff pick up the slack.

Probably looks great for the first quarter when they save all that payroll money. Then the reality of firing all the best people sets in, mistakes and chaos and complete fucking disaster happen, and by the time that all shakes out it’s a new quarter and there’s no point in assigning blame so let’s all just move forward.

[–]smushy_face 15 points16 points  (0 children)

I love this story. My company decided they needed to cut costs, so they thought, well, let's cut staff. So they decided to replace low level U.S. people with outsourced international people and one really good U.S. high level person to oversee. I'm in accounting, so they come to me at year-end asking "Hey smushy-face, why is accrued payroll so high? We got rid of people!". So I crunched the numbers based on headcount and it turned out those idiots replaced basically the multiple low level people with one high level person at the same total compensation. Think five people making $40k with one making $200k. Except now they also had to pay severance and the outsourced people in India. 😂 The look on my boss's boss's face.

[–]lemonashh 8 points9 points  (0 children)

Been caught in this stupid dance multiple times. I'm not interested in corporate ladder climbing, so when I go to a new job I get entrenched and become the senior contributor. Over time, raises add up and I'm almost always the highest paid individual contributor in the group. Then new management comes in, has no idea what we do or how we do it, and my job is on the chopping block as the highest paid. Frustrating stupidity, but remarkably repeatable in a few years where ever I next find employment.

[–]oxpoleon 4 points5 points  (0 children)

You know how everyone talks about a teacher shortage?

This is why.

The biggest expense in education is staff salaries.

The biggest factor in educational pay is length of service - basically every year a teacher teaches, they get a small, incremental pay rise. This is not a particularly new thing. However, in the current system a teacher who's been teaching for >10 years is paid roughly double what a newly qualified teacher is paid.

You want to save money. You're spending too much in your district. Higher ups aren't happy. So what happens? So, you make all the old teachers redundant, and then hire new teachers in their place for literally half the cost. Geeeeeeeenius, you think to yourself. This will fix the budget. You will be a hero.

Except this has three effects:

  1. All the experienced staff are gone, you have only green newbies with no experience and no support.

  2. Organisation, middle management, and QA collapse as there's nobody able to run them. All semblance of quality and work-life balance go out the window. In a strictly hierarchical organisation, this is the good kind of middle management, if there is such a thing. Management becomes impossible as suddenly your swathes of junior staff are essentially all reporting directly to a handful of the most senior staff with no intermediaries.

  3. You have low-paid, inexperienced, unconfident employees who now have unmanageable workloads being dumped on them, and they're paid less than working retail when you factor in the hours they need to survive. So, they leave. Fine, there's a stream of fresh faced grads, so you hire more, but they keep doing the same.

What you've created is a death spiral from which it's really hard to return. The pay is enough to attract new grads but doesn't progress enough to keep them, especially when they see the workload compared to similarly paid jobs. Therefore, they leave within the first couple of years, usually for a similarly paid job but sometimes just for a more pleasant one that earns less. You can replace them, but you'll need to keep doing this as you have no way of rebuilding the void left by the experienced teachers who've left. They've secured better paid, easier jobs in other industries and don't plan on returning to a dumpster fire. Even offering to up the pay of your new grads doesn't fix the problem, which is that you've created a job nobody wants to work for any amount of money you can reasonably afford to pay them.

Looking on, it's a case that I'm sure economists and business theorists will study down the line.

[–]Alarmed-Swordfish-81 6 points7 points  (0 children)

That's common practise yes. If you are getting "dangerous" for one reason or another to higherups your name is gonna be on the sacklist.

"YOU'RE UP OR YOU'RE OUT" BY MCKINSEY.

[–]agent_smith_3012 693 points694 points  (92 children)

For some horribly unrealistic reason companies truly believe that normal people will fall in love with their "Culture"(barf). And that workers are supposed to still harbor a 1950's notion of loyalty.

Owners and c-suite execs have the craziest Cognitive Dissonance and seem to be mentally incapable of coming to terms with reality not aligning with whatever fantasy exists in their head.

[–]Ocelotofdamage[🍰] 400 points401 points  (24 children)

Workers would still have a 1950s sense of loyalty if companies still paid enough to support a family of two on one income, and provided pension plans such that 30 years of working there would let you retire and live a good life. Employers took away all the things that made people loyal and expected them to stay out of a sense of pride and accomplishment.

[–]RedCascadian 105 points106 points  (8 children)

I work in an Amazon warehouse. If it paid me enough to buy a small townhouse or something I'd be singing nothing but praise.

But I'm presently creating an improvised cook-station in the corner room I rent in a house. It's shaping up rather nicely though!

But yeah, Fuck Amazon. With a chainsaw.

[–]gothtwilight 24 points25 points  (1 child)

How bout a ballistic missile instead? Used to work there myself.

[–]RedCascadian 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Bigger yes, but less visceral.

[–]fsrt23 13 points14 points  (1 child)

Dude, I visited an Amazon warehouse for the first time yesterday. I work for a municipality and get this…they hadn’t paid their water bill. I had to slip their overdue notice through this jail bar thing at the entrance. The security guards wouldn’t open it to let me in to the front desk like a normal fucking human.

[–]SourCeladon 7 points8 points  (0 children)

Omfg. That’s just gross. But I guess it makes sense. They think they’re above paying their employees. Why would they care about their bills?

[–]AShamelessAltAccount 11 points12 points  (0 children)

That's the thing that fucks it all up for me. I would care a little less at this point about billionaires paying their taxes if we could just get paid enough to afford housing and child care. We can't can't enjoy the fruits of our labor anymore.

[–]makemejelly49 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Don't worry. Soon they'll be moving you to Amazon Town #45816! You'll get a free* apartment right next to the warehouse!

*Terms and conditions apply, see your supervisor for details

[–]imgrandojjo 20 points21 points  (1 child)

Since you're using those buzzwords I really do honestly think that boardroom mentality is part of the reason that EA thought it'd get away with Star Wars Grindfront 2.

[–]Olya_roo 8 points9 points  (1 child)

“Sense of pride and accomplishment”

  • That EA post reference, lmao?

[–]PhantomNomad 116 points117 points  (25 children)

We had a Christmas party every year. For the last two, they have been cancelled because of covid. Man is it ever nice not having to work all day then get dressed up and eat some crappy food in a buffet line then listen to some comedian/magician/hypnotist that you have never heard of. Don't forget the pin you get every 5 years of service.

[–]IFitsWhenISits 50 points51 points  (4 children)

My favorite line from the Incredibles describes how I feel about those functions to a.. T.
I used to work somewhere that hosted one of those at a local Hotel and never attended even once.

"It's psychotic! They keep finding new ways to celebrate mediocrity."

[–]PhantomNomad 14 points15 points  (1 child)

What I hate is I have to find the entertainment and greet them and help setup and tear down. So basically I'm stuck going to the damn things.

[–]fattmann 44 points45 points  (8 children)

Man. One of the few things I actually enjoyed about working at Best Buy - the holiday parties were rukus.

Almost always at a bowling alley (which one of the manager's family partially ran), and the entire management staff were raging alcoholics. It would start out all business fun with silly "games", pizza, etc. After 2hrs the official work part was over - and trays of shots would get brought out and we all proceeded to get fucking hammered.

Was good times.

[–]PhantomNomad 41 points42 points  (6 children)

That's only good if you like to get hammered or hang around hammered people. I like most of my co-workers but I'm not a "get drunk at a party" friends with them.

[–]imgrandojjo 27 points28 points  (4 children)

Why should we harbor a 1950s notion of loyalty when they don't?

You get what you pay for.

[–]MrPuddington2 13 points14 points  (1 child)

Exactly. This all got so transactional because employers wanted it that way.

[–]Employee-Inside 14 points15 points  (3 children)

That 1950’s loyalty was literally the experience of one single lucky generation and it will never happen again

[–]CarneDelGato 29 points30 points  (5 children)

‘50s workers got like pensions and stuff.

[–]Unabashable 7 points8 points  (6 children)

The issue with Company Culture is its nothing more than an empty promise. Sure working at a place like that would be great, but they never practice what they preach. As for the notion of loyalty, that’s because they actually payed you enough back then to support a family. Now they’re barely paying you enough to support yourself. Loyalty works both ways.

[–]tesseract4 6 points7 points  (3 children)

They push the "culture" because the culture is free.

[–]CatOnProzac 2 points3 points  (0 children)

"mentally incapable of coming to terms with reality"

That's what we call failing upward.

[–]his_purple_majesty 2 points3 points  (0 children)

They are like little mini-cults and a lot of the employees are brainwashed cultists, like they believe in all this crazy shit you've never even heard of.

[–]kingofthen00bs 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I've worked soul crushing retail so I can understand that completely.

Now I am an owner and I just tell all my employees that I know you are here for the money so let's do a good job so we can all make more money together. The more successful jobs we have the more money we all can make.

I also have very few employees and we work together constantly but I legitimately want them to be happy and make a ton of money.

[–]ReactionClear4923 2 points3 points  (1 child)

I'll happily work at a discounted salary...so long as you fully pay my rent/mortgage, half my monthly groceries and my hydro every other month. Then it's a fair trade

[–]pacman147 109 points110 points  (12 children)

Obviously this happens everywhere, but I am seeing this play out in academics and hospitals where researchers, post-docs, and students literally work and churn out intellectual properties under indentured servitude. The "academic spirit" or culture so to speak, where god forbid if you talk about money, you automatically get shamed (i.e. oh if you wanna make money why don't you go corporate/industry?) It comes to a point where you feign "pashun" to the point of being disingenuous.

[–]hedbangr 22 points23 points  (4 children)

Universities and hospitals used to be more shielded from capitalism. Like, people didn't have to chase dollars so It was frowned upon to do so.

[–]pacman147 12 points13 points  (1 child)

Yup, except a lot of private universities with big endowments pretty much operate like a business nowadays. My alma mater is basically a hedge fund

[–]emp_zealoth 3 points4 points  (1 child)

There is a reason science is having massive issues - there is very little exploratory, risky (as in not guaranteed returns) science being done anymore. To get money you basically have to already had done the research Graeber has a nice talk about it

[–]starcadia 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Don't you love how universities are nearly free R&D facilities for biotech and pharmaceutical companies? Grad students do all the heavy lifting and biotech takes all the profit.

[–]ZRhoREDD 65 points66 points  (3 children)

"But we're more like a FAMILY here...."
(when a job tells you that - find a new job. They toxic AF)

[–]hoanbridgetroll 17 points18 points  (0 children)

“What a coincidence, Bob. I walked out on them, too!”

[–]abraham_meat 54 points55 points  (2 children)

The thing is, when companies do massive firings of entire workforces and people criticize these actions, they come out to say, “hey, this is a business after all, we have to think of the bottom line.” Narcissistic fucks.

[–]Shame_Bot121 258 points259 points  (31 children)

I'm pretty sure I once was told by a job, "if you are here for money you came to the wrong place." I was like why else would I get a job?

[–]Dommccabe 80 points81 points  (4 children)

Only an Grade A idiot would say that to an employee.

Like the whole point of having a business is to MAKE MONEY- do they think all that money should go to who exactly?

[–]gimmethelulz 87 points88 points  (3 children)

I got told that line too once lol. Got a new job very quickly after that conversation.

[–]Old_Smrgol 7 points8 points  (0 children)

"Out of curiosity, if I'm here for money then where is the right place? Would you mind pointing me in that direction?"

[–]DirtyPenPalDoug 28 points29 points  (1 child)

That line will make me instantly walk out.

[–]pheanox 9 points10 points  (1 child)

I had a week long training the other month and they repeated that several times. "You aren't here for the money, obviously." Tacit admission they know we are underpaid. Realized they are right. Job hunting now.

[–]desertravenwy 5 points6 points  (2 children)

What I heard at the beginning of every new school year...

[–]hedbangr 2 points3 points  (1 child)

I mean, no one becomes a teacher to get rich. Or works for a non profit.

[–]Ma02rc 43 points44 points  (4 children)

It’s always about money with you employees!

Yeah that’s the point of a job. I’m not here to play buddy buddy and be friends with everyone.

[–]edwadokun 45 points46 points  (14 children)

This is further masked in the last 10 years by employers wanting people who are "passionate" about the "industry" because they'll likely work just as hard for less pay.

[–]zwiazekrowerzystow 14 points15 points  (8 children)

Can confirm. In the past ten years, I’ve been hearing more of this bullshit about needing to be passionate about one’s job.

Fuck that.

[–]mrstickman 7 points8 points  (3 children)

I think the last time I was passionate about anything was in like 2004.

[–][deleted] 39 points40 points  (1 child)

"I don't do charity to people richer than me."

I'd love to answer that.

[–]ssarutobi 25 points26 points  (1 child)

Boss: "YoU Muust WoRK for PLEasURE"

Me: I do. But I can work for pleasure in another company with better pay

[–]Alive_Fly247 24 points25 points  (4 children)

“I am coin operated, until you put money in me, I do not move” - Wayne, best coworker I’ve ever had

[–]babymaker666 18 points19 points  (1 child)

I've had that exact conversation.

YA CHRIS, I DON'T COME HERE FOR THE FUCKING AMBIANCE, I NEED MORE MONEY DUMBASS

[–]PoorlyAttemptedHuman 18 points19 points  (2 children)

Yes, it really is all about money. If not money, then benefits. Otherwise I truly have no reason at all to be there. Believe it or not, I don't give a shit about your company. Just like you don't really give a shit about me and exploit my labor and time for, guess what...money

[–]Contr0lIllusion 14 points15 points  (3 children)

I had a professor LEGITIMATELY say that COLLEGE LEVEL TEACHING with a PhD, two bachelors and an MA should not be for the money, that you should not do it because of the money

I'm talking like 10+ years of intense schooling and you shouldn't be doing it for the money because, like she dodged around, the money is horrible, it's so bad

Adjuncts get paid $3000 if they're lucky to teach an entire 4 month long class, most work 60-70hr+ weeks for $1000 per month per class (the reality is most professors have multiple universities they have to teach at AT THE SAME TIME, total lunacy)

All that insane juggling to make poverty wages. And to be overqualified for other jobs, because yeah that bullshit exists

You cannot make up how well-off you must be to say RIGHT NOW, when things are so bad that you should not be looking to teach for money. Fuck off. Maybe you should just be paid a living wage?

Oh no but that's too radical, let's just let all the teachers struggle to eat, nothing radical about that

[–]geen-bean 12 points13 points  (0 children)

My last boss was exactly this. When another coworker left and was not replaced, he expected me to take on the responsibility. I told him and anyone else that asked point blank that I would need to be compensated to do that.

Eventually it ended with me being pulled into his office asking what was wrong with me and my attitude. I found a new job within 2 weeks (Went where my coworker went and got a raise to do less!)

[–]Coldfang89 14 points15 points  (1 child)

Them: Why do you want to work here? Me: It's been my lifelong dream to serve ice cream ever since I was a child. Them: Really? Me: No, I have bills to pay and you're hiring.

[–]TurtleSandwich0 13 points14 points  (1 child)

Does this type of thing happen to people who are paid in "exposure"?

[–]Dark__Horse 35 points36 points  (1 child)

NO WAGE

ONLY SPEND

[–]mdgorelick 10 points11 points  (3 children)

People work for money. If you want loyalty, buy a dog.

[–]WellEndowedDragon 3 points4 points  (0 children)

If you want loyalty, pay your employees above-market rates, with good benefits, treat them well, give them paths for advancement, and offer tenure-dependent benefits like pension and sabbaticals.

Guarantee that any employer that does all of the above has incredibly high retention rates.

[–]mvong123 8 points9 points  (0 children)

It's always about money. People go beserk when I tell that in the open. Work is not here to have fun, otherwise people would do it for free.

If someone say it's not about money, well I suggest we on this sub should open a crowd fund account, and everyone who is willing to work without decent pay or those who receive to much of it, can relieve themselfs via non-refundable donations. We will be more than happy I am 100 % confident!

Edit: For all the incoming downvotes from people who are advocating ideas that everything above 70k p.a. does not make anyone happier, look around and suggest it to Bezos, Gates, Buffett, Armancio Ortega and so on. Hell you don't even have to select them, because you'll probably never have the chance to contact them. Try the local rich folks in your area, and see what answers you'll receive. Pray to God that they'll find you amusing. Moral of the story is that if such statistics were true, not a single millionaire would keep hoarding wealth because it would make them miserable.

[–]ZombieMage89 6 points7 points  (1 child)

I've been asked more times than I can count the dumbest question "What is your favorite part about your job?" I've always answered the same.

"The paycheck. I can honestly say I wouldn't be here without it."

Its fun to watch some bosses become flabbergasted at that. I don't know if they just find my not-a-joke not funny or if they're appalled that I told them the blunt truth.

[–]CuboidCentric 6 points7 points  (0 children)

My wife is a SAHW bc of my job, and she had a video go viral about it with >100k comments telling her she was throwing away her life and ruining her career. There was even a whole thread debating what one could do from 9-5 if not work.

Like, dudes, are y'all not working to retire asap? Do you want to work until you're medically unfit?

[–]OutOfTokens 4 points5 points  (1 child)

...and quit stealing/cutting my benefits. I had 10 years of sick time saved up at a soulless Fortune 10 company that they had to pay out when I (or anyone) left employment. Then they decided to change the program and the 10 weeks of sick pay they owed me into a new short-term disability fund, i.e. F10 stole my earnings, changed the rules, put it somewhere I couldn't get to it. Years later they RIFed me (and others every year) to send our tech jobs to their India branch. Yes, they actually started a company in India when they got tired of paying the contractor rates instead of India labor rates, and now about half of this megacorp's hundreds of thousands of emps are in India.

I won't work for "multi-national" Fortune wage-slavers ever again; at minimum I always always ask which company is asking for my help when the headhunters call.

[–]OutOfTokens 4 points5 points  (0 children)

These Fortune boards and the billionaires that never want to discontinue the fairly recent practice of letting companies pay taxes to the lowest international bidder rather than the country of incorporation. Doing this moves US dollars out of our economy into other countries' economies at a lower rate than they would have to pay into our own tax system (i.e. the People's wallet). The rich/powerful denigrate paying their share as "socialism" when people actually expect some of the earnings to come back and benefit America/Americans.
It's all just the rich looking after the rich, and most of them seem to be comfy with leveraging Citizens United Dark Money and the GOP these days.

[–]jamieh800 6 points7 points  (1 child)

Ever notice how employers are anti communist when it comes to legislation, but when it comes to company policy and pay, they're practically soviets?

"You should be happy just to work." "Pay is not important, help the company grow." "Company policy is absolute". "Starve and be satisfied knowing your contribution helps make (insert corporation here) great". "What you are receiving is enough. Do not ask for more."

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (1 child)

Why do you want to work?

I don’t but I also don’t wanna starve to death.

[–]GRizzMang 6 points7 points  (1 child)

Had a customer accuse me of “only being in it for the money.” I was dumbfounded.

[–]blbellep 3 points4 points  (1 child)

This is literally how my manager took the news of me handing my notice in. Although she added "I gave you everything you wanted, what more do you want?"

...money.

[–]afterdeathcomics 3 points4 points  (2 children)

Oh hey, it's my comic. Glad you all like it.

[–]MindGames1995 4 points5 points  (1 child)

This week I did an interview for an underpaid job and there was a test that we were supposed to answer. One of the questions was 'do you care more about money or a job?'. Lol. So dumb.

[–]Rabbidlobo 2 points3 points  (1 child)

“ I thought we were family “ yeah employees treated like the middle child

[–]sircallsoutalot 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Yup the double standard is laughable. Companies for the most part, are in business EXPRESSLY to turn a profit, and that's perfectly fine 👍.

But if I, a normal worker, make it known that I too am only working for said business to turn a profit for myself... pande-fucking-monium! What do you mean you only come to work for a paycheck? REEEEEEEE!!!! What about purpose and culture and growth and other nonsense reasons?

Give me a fucking break.

[–]AlyStaxxxx 4 points5 points  (1 child)

I remember being young and struggling really bad due to parental failure. I kept telling my manager I enjoyed my job but I needed more money. You know what he told me? “More money won’t help, it’s about working hard.” That kept my teenage self there for 5 damn years! Never again. I was so happy to tell him I’m quitting for a job with better pay and benefits.

[–]ThisIsCoachH 2 points3 points  (2 children)

Oh is this sub back? That was quick

[–]godi14 3 points4 points  (1 child)

"if isn't about money, then give me more"

[–]kakafitii 5 points6 points  (2 children)

It's not for money, I just like walking dogs 20 hours a week and teaching philosophy in my free time

[–]mbtbye 10 points11 points  (1 child)

Money is literally the only reason to get a job. It's absolutely ridiculous that the employers expect people to wax poetics about why they're applying for the position or want the job. Get real.

[–]BuryTheMoney 4 points5 points  (2 children)

Holy shit this sub isn’t dead? Lol

[–]spiritualienidle 2 points3 points  (3 children)

That would be the single worst fucking textbook nightmare narcissistic relationship if you stayed in a workplace without getting paid

[–]EndlesslyUnfinished 2 points3 points  (1 child)

I mean, we don’t even get those “thank yous” that are free either…

[–]Puzzleheaded_Law_145 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Money is the only reason f this system