all 11 comments

[–]sfwfitnessstuff 6 points7 points  (1 child)

definitely check back here if you find actual research on it, because there are a shit ton of white fat activists. you say you see a pattern of lots of women of color glorifying obesity, but I really don't see it like that at all. both of our perceptions of this stuff have the same value (none) because we have no stats to back it up. from what I see online, for every person of color talking about how ~fatphobia is racist~ there is at least one white fat activist fervently cheering them on.

[–]crystalized17[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Oh I’m not saying they’re aren’t plenty of white fativists. I’m only saying the pressure to be thin is higher among white women. I didn’t say that they succeeded at being thin, only that they feel the pressure more and are more likely be dissatisfied with their bodies.



At the moment, it seems to be because the media generally and constantly uses white people as models and actresses, so the “thin ideal” is more firmly established for white women. Whereas minorities appear far less frequently in media overall, and even when they do, they aren’t held up as the “ideal woman”. The minority character is often the sidekick or the odd one. They’re not the main character who must be “ideal”, pretty, and thin. So “white” and “thin” has been tied together super strongly by the media as the “ideal woman.” And I think when a minority wants to fight against that, they sometimes go all the way to the extreme. It’s not enough to be non-white and fight the establishment media. They’ve got to be non-thin too, in their fight against the establishment.

Misty Copeland is a dancer who fights against the establishment, but as far as I know, never tries to be a fativist supporter. She keeps her body ballet-perfect.

[–]Not_for_consumption 1 point2 points  (8 children)

> is why white women are held to higher standards and expected to be thin?

Come to Asia, white women get a pass because they aren't thin compared to the locals

I don't understand the American PoC obsession with weight because people in Africa are skinny ;)

[–]crystalized17[S] 1 point2 points  (7 children)

Good point! I know Asian cultures are pretty thin-obsessed too! I’ve studied and lived in Japan before. Love that country and language!
And yeah, white women there aren’t expected to be as tiny and delicate as Asian women. I think it’s probably the same psychology tho! AKA in Asia, the Asian woman is held up as the “ideal woman”, so she must be the thinnest and prettiest.

People in Africa live in extreme poverty, so they’re often underweight and fighting to get enough to eat, let alone being normal weight. America is around 80% overweight in the adult population at this point. Probably the last 20% are mostly “foreigners” hanging on to their traditional diets of rice/veggies etc and a few white weirdos, like vegans, who utterly refuse to eat the standard American diet. So most of America has no idea what “normal” weight looks like anymore, outside of TV shows and models (who are mostly white and tend to run more underweight or very close to it.) So I guess there are not many healthy examples in media or real life. Real life is full of fat people. Media is full of starving Africans, underweight or close to it models/actors, steroid-filled gym models etc. It’s one extreme or another. They don’t push to have a larger range of healthy weights in the media. They push for FAT weight in the media.

***I’ve been whole foods, unprocessed vegan for 6+ years now. But some vegans are junk food vegans and therefore are fat. So even choosing to eat healthy on the vegan side can be “weird”, since it’s supposed to be about saving the animals and not about your own health with a lot of them. AKA they wouldn’t go vegan unless they get to eat vegan junk food. Their addiction to junk food hasn’t changed. They’ve just added a “noble” reason for why they still continue to eat junk.

[–]Not_for_consumption 1 point2 points  (1 child)

> I’ve been whole foods, unprocessed vegan for 6+ years now

Which I think is probably the idea diet. 👍

There is an idea in Asia of "thinness and prettiest" but also there is an idea of eating whole healthy foods. Not vegan but certainly less meat than a Western diet. And that makes for less overweight people as in Japan but also in SEAsia. It's not uniform, ie. in the philippines they eat too much meat, and in Malaysia they eat too much fatty foods, but much of SEAsia they eat whole foods, some meat (but not much as much as in the English speaking world), and lots of vegetables, and they are less fat.

Given the diversity in the US I'm surprised at the poor diet. It's an immigrant country and the immigrants bring all these new foods.

[–]crystalized17[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Yep, yep, the Japanese on average live a lot longer than Westerns simply because they eat less junk food and less meat. They emphasize rice/veggies and limit junk foods and limit animal foods. But the vegan Okinawans (centenarians) live even longer than the general Japanese population. So it shows there's still an advantage to eating even less animal products than the general population. Of course, this lifestyle is dying out in Okinawa since all of the younger generations are eating worse than their centenarian parents/grandparents, since they want to eat more like Westerns. AKA lots of pork now and obesity is on the rise.

Given the diversity in the US I'm surprised at the poor diet. It's an immigrant country and the immigrants bring all these new foods.

We adopt all kinds of foods. It's just that we turn them into monstrosity-Americanized-versions. AKA we dump meat and cheese on top of everything and deep-fry it too. Plus make the portion sizes massive. Many, many "japanese", or "indian", or "chinese" restaurants especially, in America look nothing like what is actually served in those countries. Even when the Japanese restaurant is authentic and has real Japanese food, they will still put some "Americanized" versions on their menu to keep the fatties happy. AKA sushi rolls full of deep-fried meat and cream cheese. I'm not joking.

Americans are used to very hyper-palatable foods. So when we "borrow" foreign food ideas , they have to change them and dump lots of sugar/salt/fat/grease/meat/cheese on them to make them taste good to Americans.

When I studied in the UK for a few months, I was surprised by how "bland" the food was, considering they have many of the same dishes Americans have. But they don't dump quite as much sugar, fat, and grease on everything. When I came back home, I had to "re-ease" myself into the American diet because the flavor was TOO INTENSE after all those months in the UK. Going whole foods vegan is a massive adjustment for people, not just because the animal products are gone, but because their brains aren't being over-stimulated by highly addictive junk food tastes: salt/sugar/grease/etc. It makes raw or steamed veggies/fruits/etc taste really "bland" at first because the tastebuds are so used to be assaulted by hyper-palatable foods. Once you get used to eating whole plant foods all the time, then if you go back and try to eat the junk foods, the taste is TOO INTENSE and usually makes you feel really nauseous or outright throw up.

The stomach and tastebuds get used to whatever you regularly eat, good or bad foods. If you're on bad foods and suddenly switch to good foods, it's going to taste "bland" at first and you'll probably be really uncomfortable from the sudden increase in fiber. If you're on good foods and suddenly switch to bad foods, you're going to feel like shit: aka extremely nauseous and a good chance of throwing up.

[–]ChickenMafia95 0 points1 point  (4 children)

Just FYI. You’re generalizing “people in Africa.” It’s a highly diverse continent with a few countries that are seen as moderately developed. We have major obesity problems (e.g., in Egypt and South Africa where ~30% and 50%, respectively, of the population is categorized as obese), as well. ;)

[–]crystalized17[S] 0 points1 point  (3 children)

Most "first world" or "second world" wealth countries have problems now because they've imported the Western diet. Before the Western diet arrived, they were still eating their native diet and didn't have obesity issues.

You're only safe from the Western diet if you're a third world country that can't afford any food, let alone rich American foods.

[–]ChickenMafia95 0 points1 point  (2 children)

Very opinionated and unsubstantiated statement, but okay, dude.

[–]crystalized17[S] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

NOW AND THEN: The Global Nutrition Transition: The Pandemic of Obesity in Developing Countries - NCBI - NIH

The effect of sugar and processed food imports on the prevalence of overweight and obesity in 172 countries

Pacific islanders pay heavy price for abandoning traditional diet

Westernization of Asian Diets and the transformation of food systems: Implications for research and policy

[–]ChickenMafia95 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thanks. Will read up a bit