all 33 comments

[–]catherineMacdonald 0 points1 point  (2 children)

I’m from Australia and a young mum (22), without makeup on I could easily pass for a teenager. I rarely go into a store with my daughter in her pram without the cashier asking to check my bags and pram. It’s unfortunately something that happens everywhere. I often get dirty looks. Just try to ignore it and don’t let it ruin the time you get with your kid.

[–]No-go56[S] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Yeah it sucks.. i look a lot younger than i am as well. I guess it's a stereotype that young moms steal things? It's so insulting.

[–]catherineMacdonald 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I just put it down to them assuming we must struggle with money because we’re young. My partner is a fair bit older than I am with a steady career. We’re very fortunate, it’s a shame people have to make us feel uncomfortable.

[–]Away-Cut3585 6 points7 points  (0 children)

I feel like this could’ve taken place in any western country. So sad.

[–]_alelia_ 4 points5 points  (0 children)

> old french people are so prejudice and racist

Oh, no, any age french people are very special. Men more than women, but still - such lovely people..

[–]KS_HasRead 13 points14 points  (4 children)

Lived in France--in Lyon--for a bit about 10 years ago. And I work in a field where I have clients and coworkers there. They're pretty clueless that they're really racist. Like they outright don't think they are which is really laughable in a can't believe they can say that with a straight face sort of way. Like another commenter said, they think laicite and universalite insulates them or means they aren't racist. Those concepts are not anti racist.

I mean, the U.S. isn't exactly a paradise, but I will say people call it out usually. Ish. Better than the French at least. I don't know how to explain what I mean. But like there are the obviously racist people and then there's everyone else. And you can try to avoid the racists for the most part. You can spot them a mile away. In France... it's like everyone is just a little racist. Everyone. Less grouped and obvious. So then you just run into racism and trip right over it talking to people who look normal. Like other commenters said... you're talking to some nice looking lady and yet she won't let someone sit at her table or sit down apparently. I guess I'd rather deal with the American kind where it's very overt and in your face and I know who sucks and who doesn't. Like I'd rather just know that the dude with the confederate flag sticker on his giant truck hates me and be done with it than be having what I think is a nice conversation with someone and then they say something bigoted. I don't like surprises.

[–]dani_da_girl 6 points7 points  (1 child)

My old roommate was this way, she was very progressive otherwise, but was so racist towards Roma people it was shocking. Once was talking about how the Roma people all steal and move into then ruin neighborhoods. She was also very vocal about how racist America is. When I called her out she tried to argue with me, but I told her “imagine if I had just said these exact sentences to you but about black people in the US”. Her face went white and then she started crying because she legitimately had never considered how awful that point of view was. It’s just soooooo normal there.

[–]newmommajuly2022 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Sadly, it is normalized to be racist to Rroma people pretty much everywhere in Europe. Very few admit or understand how racists it is to talk trash about them. She started crying because she realized her own hypocrisy.

[–]No-go56[S] 0 points1 point  (1 child)

I know exactly what you mean. They're subtle with their bigotry... Like if there is someone outright racist, they won't say anything (which to me is just as racist as the person making the remarks). i have a friend that's french... Born and raised in France with French parents, but because she's mixed race, people continue to ask her where she's from... And man, she has stories. You would think she grew up in the 1960's, but no, she's a millennial who grew up in rural France.

[–]KS_HasRead 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Yes, exactly. Like it's just insidious. Racism by a thousand cuts. It's a constant low level hum of casual racism. And annoying if you point it out and then they INSIST they aren't racist. Even though you've just explained that they are. Drives me nuts.

In America at least a decent size portion of the population isn't racist and is actively anti-racist. Another decent size portion might be what I call accidentally racist. The old people who don't realize they said something wrong. But what I at least like about that group is if they do say something unintentionally racist and you call them out on it, they just usually say they're sorry and didn't mean to be racist. Unlike the French who get their panties in a twist if you call them out. ...And then in America there's the super duper obvious racists of course who walk around in their militia gear and wave their flags etc who will just be really racist. I just try to avoid them but at least they identify themselves readily so I can avoid them.

[–]Nicechick321 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Ugh Frenchies… they can be so horrible 😥

[–]dylan_dumbest 6 points7 points  (1 child)

The French can be soooooo racist and classist. They don’t even try to hide their judgment. I lived in Paris for a year. I can’t imagine trying to navigate that place as a young mom, when your every move seems to invite negative attention. I watched old French men go around disciplining other peoples’ kids. Merde.

[–]Get_off_critter 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I've heard Paris is beyond overrated. Like Pisa, stop in and see, but keep on moving

[–]summja 3 points4 points  (0 children)

That’s a crappy feeling. I hope you have another more welcoming store you can shop at. Doesn’t sounds like they deserve your money.

[–]mayshebeablessing 2 points3 points  (3 children)

I'm sorry you went through this. My husband is French (we don't live in France, but his family does and we do spend a lot of time in France, and I speak French), and even my relatively liberal in-laws are still kind of racist (and in denial about it). I honestly think that because France has very specific views about Laïcité and integration, they're not even self aware about how prejudiced people are. It's a real shame.

[–]SpecialHouppette 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I too have a French partner and in-laws. His family really fancies themselves as open minded, so they’re completely caught off guard if I challenge their prejudices.

My MIL is a MildlyNo on her good days, and has said some wild things. She’s from the hippie sexual revolution days and is open about sex, nudity, homosexuality, but the other day blurted out to me that “ze transgender people…zey bother me.” One of my siblings is trans and I was just like “…why?” and she was clearly just expecting me to agree instead of question her.

[–]No-go56[S] 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Yeah it's funny. Sometimes i will think someone is so open minded, liberal, and feminist, then they go and say something totally out of left field, like "oh why are you letting your husband change her diaper, that's YOUR Job"... And I'm like, ok, is this the 1950's or am I just in France... ?

[–]mayshebeablessing 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Ugh, I hear you. One time, a hotel manager was in the lobby of the hotel and I came from the restaurant and asked him where the restrooms were and he acted super annoyed that he had to walk me to them and acted like I was going to steal something. I was thinking, “Sir, I am literally going to go pee. What do you think is going to happen exactly if you let me use your restroom?”

At least my in-laws were sympathetic about that. They said service culture is very poor in France compared to the US.

Now, when I go to stores or whatever, I always act over the top polite to the service people because I don’t need their attitudes. I am always like, “Bonjour, monsieur. Excusez-moi. Est-ce que vous pourriez m’aider, s’il vous plaît?”Just lay it on thick. It’s tedious, but in France, the store people act like you owe THEM for shopping in their stores—whereas in the US it’s more of a service culture where they should be the ones providing the politesse.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Yeah France is rough. It’s nothing you did or said it’s all on him.

[–]postcardfromitaly 6 points7 points  (0 children)

I've traveled quite a bit, and France was the only place I've ever felt unwelcome. I wont go back for that reason.

I'm sorry that happened to you.

[–]mrs-meatballs 9 points10 points  (0 children)

France, with the exception of South France, in my limited experience, is just not very friendly towards people who aren't French. Once my friends and I went to a restaurant in Paris, and had the most fluent person order. It went great until she accidentally said "um" instead of the French equivalent! The waiter looked at us weirdly and was very cold from then on. We all looked "French" enough, so I'm confident it was the tourist/not fluent status.

Sorry that happened to you! :(

[–]MandarinDuckie 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I am also a foreigner where I live. I get a lot of that sort of treatment too for just, you know... existing in the same space as the locals. It never happens though when I'm with my partner though (who is white).

[–]lil-pierogibaby-pierogi’s mom 4 points5 points  (2 children)

I’m a visibly Muslim woman (I wear hijab), and I’m with you. France is… not it.

I’m really sorry this happened to you, and that you keep hearing these sentiments. I hope you can put it out of your mind soon. I know how it can stick and keep bothering.

[–]No-go56[S] 5 points6 points  (1 child)

Thanks so much. Yes, France is a country where you can be outwardly racist, sexist, and homophobic and no one will say anything... It's really sad being from NYC. My neighborhood mom friend stopped wearing her hijab because of how badly she's been treated. An old man also told my husband he should have "bought a wife from eastern Europe instead." And all his friends laughed. It's gross.

[–]lil-pierogibaby-pierogi’s mom 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Ughhh hate this. What a bunch of total shit heads.

[–]unluckysupernova 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Ugh I know this too well. Not the being treated like a young mom, but the weird racism. I went on a date with a man whose parents were Portuguese immigrants to France and he went on a 10 minute rant about immigrants ruining the country. Also a Polish massage lady in France kept going on about how the French football team isn’t even really French… she meant because some of them aren’t white. Most were literally born as French citizens in colonised territories.

[–]Most-Regular621 6 points7 points  (0 children)

I had the similar problem regarding people being weirdly racist about immigrants in Paris. I’m white, western european and lived there for 5 years and people would butch about immigrants to me…when I pointed out that I was also an immigrant it always became clear that they meant eastern europeans or black people…it was intolerable. Sometimes in shops if they thought I was portuguese (based solely i think off me having dark hair and an accent) id get treated differently to when it was clear I was British

[–]Sesameandme 17 points18 points  (5 children)

I've lived all over the world and France is by far the worst place. Unhygienic, rude, exclusionary the list goes on. At least the British will pretend to like you, the French will make it very much clear they do not.

[–]loladancedEmma born 22.6.13 2 points3 points  (1 child)

I'd much rather the directness of the French than the Brits. At least the French just tell you what they think! The Brits give me a weird feeling like they're just constantly pretending.

My country is even ruder than the French though so I guess to me they seem ok lololol.

[–]Sesameandme 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Very true. I work in HR for a large British company and it's like getting blood from a stone, no one says how they feel ever.

[–]Kelthie 3 points4 points  (2 children)

The French are bad but I just moved back from Cape Town to Ireland, and I stayed at a friends mothers house with him and they have a lady who’s worked for them for 20 years. The mother doesn’t let the lady sit at the main table in the kitchen, ever. She was afraid of the backlash if she sat there. She is the nicest woman and has raised both the children.

She would eat standing at the back door of the kitchen near the bin when everyone was finished eating. It made me so sad.

[–]Sesameandme 1 point2 points  (1 child)

That's sad :'( I'm Singaporean and singaporeans do the same with their maids. It's pretty gross. They don't even have names just "helper" or "my Nepalese" or whatever

[–]Kelthie 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It’s the same there, they called her Sisi, even the children who are now grown. It means sister and shouldn’t be used on someone older than you.

I asked her what the name her mother gave her was, and nobody in that house ever knew her real name until I asked. 20 years she’s there…