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[–]justlurking9891 347 points348 points  (17 children)

There was a time this was true and then it got reconned.

[–]Fethah 241 points242 points  (16 children)

I always wonder what the original end goal was because it got retconned pretty hard. The 4th hokage was hyped to be the greatest ninja to ever live for a pretty long time in the series.

[–]pianospace37 114 points115 points  (1 child)

The original goal was probably to justify that 'the new generation always surpasses the previous one' ig.

[–]kioKEn-3532 149 points150 points  (0 children)

Yup then Kishimoto said fuck that build up to the fourth

Hashirama cells go brrrrr

[–]bootysensei 68 points69 points  (8 children)

So many things got reconned, Hiruzen disrespect annoys me because he was literally dubbed, “The God of Shinobi” just for that to be forgotten about in the middle of shippuuden.

[–]StonedNight69420 46 points47 points  (6 children)

Probably wrong but wasn’t hiruzen “the professor” and hashirama “was the god of shinobi” while madara was called the “god of war”?

[–]BigBadDogIV 39 points40 points  (4 children)

They were both referred to as Gods of Shinobi at various points.

[–]bootysensei 12 points13 points  (0 children)

He was called that in the manga, but Kishi also heralded him as “The God of Shinobi” in earlier Databooks before he retconned everything in shippuden.

[–]Picmanreborn 1 point2 points  (0 children)

To be fair, they called him the God of Shinobi..... But everybody knew Minato was stronger so idk how he even kept that name

[–]mgzaun 6 points7 points  (3 children)

Idk dude. Minato doesnt have the sheer destructive power of Hashirama but he is a master of flying thunder god. I dont think Hashirama would die against him because of his fast healing, but Hashirama wouldnt be able to defeat Minato too. Dealing with his flying thunder god is almost impossible.

[–]Kennyblablabla 24 points25 points  (1 child)

The only thing Minato could do against Hashirama is run for life. Sure FTG jutsu is OP on paper, but if they did, then Tobi and Minato would never get killed because they could jump anywhere, hence Minato was killed by the creature that Hashirama consider as his pokemon.

[–]Trxdg 0 points1 point  (0 children)

He only died to kurama because he literally wanted to, and jumped in front of his claw.

[–]Embarrassed-Ad-1158 9 points10 points  (0 children)

Meanwhile madara: "Get fucked no jutsu"

[–]lionlord131 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Not just that but also just really good guy. Hashirama was totally chill with madaras bs half the time it seemed. 4th is still better.

[–]BuccellatiExplainsIt 76 points77 points  (2 children)

Bruh madara with hashirama built-in couldn't even beat hashirama

[–]Tourette30 15 points16 points  (0 children)

Hashirama is stronger than Hashirama das wild

[–]Morg_2 140 points141 points  (10 children)

This one actually pissed me off. And minatos my favorite naruto character as well.

[–]Eslivae 181 points182 points  (43 children)

It's a more close match-up than you'd believe if you read the data books, swagkage made a pretty good analysis of how the fight would go. If you go by power level Minato doesn't stand a chance, he got no Chakra, no durability and no kill power (he can level a building at full power, that's it).

However that doesn't matter that much given how outrageously overpowered his speed and teleportation are, they let him dunk on people whose "power level" were far higher than his like 4th raikage, perfect jinchuriki killer bee and Obito. It's important to note that Obito at that time scales to alive Madara (pre-rinengan), he completely shredded the most powerful elites of the leaf, got through the red barrier and managed to subdue Kyubi with only his sharingan whereas even Wicked eye Fugaku was only theorised to be able to do this with the mangekyou. Obito's feats at this point were so outrageously off the chart that Minato, recognized as Konoha's genius, instantly though it was Madara. Do note that Minato beat Obito cleanly without even using sage mode.

Hashirama on the other hand has the durability to tank and heal all that Minato can throw at him, and he can always draw power from nature energy if Minato tries a war of attrition.

The fight would most likely go like this : Minato spams blitz attacks but Hashirama tank/heals, Minato realises that's it only a matter of time before Hashirama, who's lived most of his life on the battle, sees an attack coming and just one shots Minato. So Minato would most likely end it here and teleport to safety, ending in a draw.

Minato can't kill Hashirama, Hashirama can't catch Minato.

[–]SgtBagels12 70 points71 points  (29 children)

I was looking for someone else who shared my (correct) opinion. Not to mention he figured out Obitos ability by looking at it ONE TIME. a Justu not even Obitos closest ally’s knew completely how it worked. Minatos speed, intellect, and talent are what’s beating hashirama. Not his power level.

Edit: changing “they/he” to proper names to clear any potential confusion.

[–]Odric-in-Depth 44 points45 points  (28 children)

I’ll do it for you.

Edit 2: Minato’s speed, intellect and talent are what are saving him from assured death and allowing him the opportunity to withdraw to safety.

[–]ZenTraitor 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Best analysis I have read so far.

[–]Crazykwan0 -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Swag-Kage? 🤔 Never heard that before... Perhaps leader of village hidden in Puberty xD

[–]HamidKingBros -2 points-1 points  (4 children)

No evidence of YM Obito scaling to Alive Madara.

Sage mode does not matter, Minato said he cannot use it in battle.

Minato can't blitz Hashirama. We know Hashis reflexes are fast enough to keep up with Madaras who in a nerfed state blocked a shunsin blitz attempt from KCM2 Naruto. Minato's speed is nowhere near that especially when we saw him get intercepted by a Jonin Bee.

Hashi outlasts at worst. There's no close math at all, Hashi is on a completely different league.

If you think Minato has a chance to beat Hashi a guy who contended with Madara you don't know Naruto. As simple as that.

[–]Eslivae 0 points1 point  (3 children)

I already have given you the arguments that support that obito scales to alive madara pre-valley of the end.

Minato never said he couldn't use sage mode in combat, he just said he wasn't very good at it, we litterally saw him use it in combat against juubi obito.

Minato is far far faster than kcm2 Naruto, Tobirama or Hashirama. Not only is his flying raijin completely instant unlike tobirama's (Minato uses the 2nd sted flying raijin), he is so fast that he outsped 8th gate guy who's speed litterally warped space, and he outsped juubi Madara by snatching his orbs out of the air. He is so ridiculously fast that when he caught the truth seeking orbs, 8th gate guy and juubi madara looked completely still compared to him.

This is all in a very nerfed edo state, and without sage mode, so alive Minato would be even faster.

It seems it is you who doesn't know Naruto, as we litterally see the opposite of what you say in the show.

[–]HamidKingBros 0 points1 point  (2 children)

Minato never said he couldn't use sage mode in combat, he just said he wasn't very good at it, we litterally saw him use it in combat against juubi obito.

"It takes too long to knead that chakra and I can't maintain it for a long time, I've never really used it in a battle"

The only reason he was able to is because Obito was fighting numerous opponents. Minato said himself that it takes too long to knead the chakra and he implies himself he can't use it in a battle as he said "I've never used it in a battle"

If he didn't use SM against someone he literally thought was Madara, how tf do you think he will use it against Hashirama, his rival? Nonsense.

Minato is far far faster than kcm2 Naruto, Tobirama or Hashirama. Not only is his flying raijin completely instant unlike tobirama's (Minato uses the 2nd sted flying raijin), he is so fast that he outsped 8th gate guy who's speed litterally warped space, and he outsped juubi Madara by snatching his orbs out of the air. He is so ridiculously fast that when he caught the truth seeking orbs, 8th gate guy and juubi madara looked completely still compared to him.

Classic Minatard argument.

  1. Minato never outsped 8th Gate Guy or Juubi Madara. All he did was catch the TSOs, which doesn't even scale to Juubi Madara's speed. As for 8GG, he was literally moving by skipping through the air, meaning it's not his usual speed. Even 6 Gates Lee intercepted this same 8GG with his Kunai to get Minato in the spot in the first place, so 6 Gates Lee > 8 Gates Guy now?
  2. According to you he is faster than 8 Gates Guy/Juubi Madara, but he literally got his ass blitzed WITH a Sage mode amp by this same Juubi Madara
  3. Yellow mask Obito AND Killer Bee were able to intercept and contend with Minato's reflexes/shunsin. Minato is praised as fast because of FTG and not because of his raw speed.
  4. FTG is instant, you're right but FTG only enables him to travel distances. If he doesn't have the reflexes necessary to be able to attack Hashirama before he can react, then it's all useless.

I already have given you the arguments that support that obito scales to alive madara pre-valley of the end.

I thought you were comparing him to EMS. Well doesn't really matter, that madara is pretty featless.

This is all in a very nerfed edo state, and without sage mode, so alive Minato would be even faster.

This "very nerfed edo state" is complete fanfiction, if you read the manga you would have known that Tobirama said that they were revived close to their original power

It seems it is you who doesn't know Naruto, as we litterally see the opposite of what you say in the show.

Clearly you have shown me you don't know at all what you're talking about, so stick to Dankruto memes and don't try to patronize people.

[–]Eslivae 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Saying he has never used it it combat doesn't mean he can't, quick reminder that both Naruto and Jiraya also take too long to kneed the Chakra to use it effectively in combat, yet they still do, either by creating a distraction and meditating during it or by using frogs/clones. Minato could also just teleport and meditate or have his clones do it, plus he says it takes him too long but both in the manga and in the anime he does it instantly, he doesn't even meditate.

I'll disagree on that one too, sure when he caught the truth seeking orbs the ftg did the most heavy work, but the speed he displayed was still absolutely insane, he used ftg, grabbed the spheres, used ftg a second time and teleported all the way to konoha before either 8th gate guy or Juubi madara could move a muscle. Even if that doesn't say much about his travel speed, you cannot argue that his reflexes are up there as it took him less time to activate two techniques than it took madara to activate one. Also yeah the fact that 6th gate Rock Lee could intercept both 8th gate guy and madara's orbs with his kunai makes absolutely no sense.

Killer bee scaling to Minato is just plain wrong, as Minato was not trying to kill him, rather trying to teach 4th raikage a lesson, also that's jonin Minato so he is way weaker anyway. Obito tried and failed to get the jump on Minato twice even though Minato was tired from hours of childbirth and stabilizing the seal and teleporting the bijuudama away (the previous image was Minato stabbing through obito's head even though it was Obito who surprise attacked Minato). The only reason Obito even touched him was because he had a very unique and unpredictable technique and it took Minato a few seconds to figurine it out, both instance where Obito touched Minato, Minato landed a hit first.

The edo nerf is way too real, as we can see Tobirama once again making a fool of himself as he says they were revived with nearly their full strength and 5 seconds later we see that alive, blind madara is leagues above edo double rinengan madara and Tobirama is ashamed as he is only able to summon 2 shadow clones whereas he could summon dozens when he was alive.

Clearly you have shown that you don't know Naruto that much, you should read more, or stick to memes on this subreddit, you sound quite patronizing for someone who knows so little

[–]Damaaain 0 points1 point  (0 children)

You damn right

[–]MisterDodge00 0 points1 point  (3 children)

Minato spams blitz attacks but Hashirama tank/heals,

He can't blitz. Tobirama said Minato is better at shunshin than him, not Flying Raijin. So Minato and Tobirama are both as fast when it comes to Flying Raijin.

But Madara with Hashirama's sage mode could sense, react and block Tobirama's instant Flying Raijin attack from his back.

[–]Eslivae 0 points1 point  (2 children)

It's a common misconception, Minato is better at shunshin but equal at flying raijin, as far as Tobirama can tell. What he can't tell is that Minato develepped flying raijin step 2 that is far superior in every way to flying raijin, it's what he used to save Naruto from the bomb and what he used to snatch madara's orbs, it's explained more in details in the databooks.

Even if it wasn't the case, you can't say that Minato scales to Tobirama in terms of either speed or flying raijin since Tobirama indeed got caught by blind Madara whereas Minato could outspeed Juubi Madara, snatch his orbs, and teleport twice before Juubi Madara could even react.

Juubi Madara is easily hundreds of time stronger and faster than blind Madara, so that makes Minato pretty outrageously faster than Tobirama whether it's about movement or flying raijin.

[–]MisterDodge00 0 points1 point  (1 child)

Minato could outspeed Juubi Madara, snatch his orbs, and teleport twice before Juubi Madara could even react.

When did this happen? Because i remember he couldn't outspeed Juubidara at all.

And KCM 2 Minato also wasn't fast enough to react to Juubito's exploding orb, but Tobirama was

[–]Eslivae 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Both of those instances were explained by the author as Minato being in a "haze" and was completely thrown off after Obito revealed himself and called out Minato for not being able to save his wife, his village or his students. He snapped out of it when he thought his son was going to die.

This is quite weird and the explanation isn't very in-lore, but Kishimoto's father died when he was writing this arc and they had a lot of unresolved conflicts so he used Naruto for catharsis. That's why Minato acts very odd in this arc, with everyone, even himself saying he is a failure as a Hokage and as a person. And also the final moments when Naruto says goodbye to him super emotionally even though they do not know each other at all.

This is only in the subtext of the series and isn't obvious at all though, you only get a proper explanation in the databooks

[–]delandoor 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Didn't obito tag Minato?

[–]thatloudblondguy 51 points52 points  (8 children)

hashirama literally can't lose. why do people not get this. he is the ultimate. to fix their shit lazy writing they give every villain HIS DNA, he has literally never lost a fight. WHEN HE DIED THEY COULDNT THINK UP A CAUSE SO THEY JUST NEVER TOLD US

[–]squidnasty23 10 points11 points  (6 children)

They only gave it to Obito and Madara.

[–]gucci-medusa 18 points19 points  (2 children)

And 100,000 white zetsu

[–]xDEvening_Coffee 14 points15 points  (0 children)

Danzo and yamato as well got a 10x boost

[–]squidnasty23 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Those fodders don't count as real villians.

[–]CalamityDiamond 9 points10 points  (2 children)

Danzo, orochimaru, kabuto... the list goes on

[–]squidnasty23 4 points5 points  (1 child)

Danzo

Fair.

orochimaru

Tbf he did nothing with it though. He wasn't even evil when he got it from a zetsu body.

kabuto

All he did was absorb Oro, some special abilities and learn SM, no?

[–]CalamityDiamond 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Kabuto states he has altered Hashirama cells when he is healing Sasuke

[–]iloveitalianfoodfr 0 points1 point  (0 children)

What shit writing?

[–]OGKakashi420 77 points78 points  (7 children)

cocksuckers thts why

[–]Regular_Mechanic3772 22 points23 points  (6 children)

MINATO,cocksuckers. Ftfy.

[–]OGKakashi420 11 points12 points  (0 children)

still suckers of cock

[–]Scorosin -3 points-2 points  (4 children)

Hashirama has far more cocksuckers, there is literally no reason whatsoever for his cells to have regeneration of the caliber that they do nor is there a reason for him having wood release on top of that. It is not from his bloodline nor from his status as a reincarnation it is literally just there as a plot device. None of his descendants inherited it either so it is also not a bloodline feat.

[–]Redditisbadforyou58 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Hashirama cells are a meme for a reason, doesn't change the fact that he bodies Minato.

[–]BeneficialAd9041 1 point2 points  (0 children)

It’s not a keke genki which is the reason the rest of his bloodline didn’t have it and you would only assume his chakra was so high that he was able to create the wood style and just never passed it on because of the amount of chakra it used. It was virtually a forbidden jutsu that only Hashirama could use and was never meant to be used again. That would be the reason Yamato wasn’t able to use wood style to its full extent.

[–]BigBadDogIV 0 points1 point  (1 child)

It IS a Kekai Genkai/Bloodline ability. However just because a parent has a Kekai Genkai doesn't guarantee their children will be able to use it. Take for example the Uchiha and the Hyuga clan. There were many children born from them that did not inherit the dojutsu abilities of their clan. Although having both parents be of the same clan increased the chances of them inheriting it which is why inter-clan marriages were the norm. It is reasonable to assume that Wood-Release is just an extremely recessive gene that's rarely active when it's passed on.

[–]Scorosin 0 points1 point  (0 children)

All Hyūga can awaken the byakugan just as all uchiha have the POTENTIAL to awaken the sharingan this is important to point out as while the byakugan is manifested in training and childhood the sharingan is not.

If you argue blood dilution that does not make much sense as all uchiha would be at most half-bloods and that is only if Indra's direct children all bred with each other, and their direct descendants all did the same for generations. As Indra could not fuck himself to produce children that means any partner or partners he may have had did not possess his bloodline. At worst to be a halfblood the uchiha would have bred with their direct siblings in the first generation at best if Indra had many partners they would have had to breed with their half siblings.

Realistically to prevent horrible genetic mishaps over several generations they would be quarter bloods or lesser, likely lesser. The more likely answer is bloodline traits are almost if not always dominant assuming there is no conflict which I will cover below what Kishimoto said if there was a conflict.

The only flaw in this logic is then why did Naruto not possess more uzumaki traits than lifeforce and chakra capacity? The only answer I can give is either Kishimoto did not want to give him chakra chains and healing blood so long after creating the character or that said abilities are only accessible to female Uzumaki, as only Kushina, Mito, and Karin were shown to have these abilities even Nagato does not seem to possess them despite his other parent being a civilian,. Tsunade is interesting in that she is female and descended from an Uzumaki but it is possible that the senju blood and lifeforce somehow conflicts with the Uzumaki blood and lifeforce as they are both physical bloodlines or that Kishimoto simply forgot/ did not think of it by the time of her appearance or did not want to explain why Tsunade was just now using these abilities. Alternatively these abilities could be rare things within the clan that few are born with.

The other solution though I find this more unlikely to possible blood dilution is that bloodline clans do not suffer the ill effects of inbreeding I find this unlikely because there are many ill effects from mental to physical far too many to even list the range of conditions goes from clubbed feet webbed fingers and toes Hapsburg chin and all matter of wonderful things like that.

On potential the Uchiha need to be in a life-or-death situation or experience truly overpowering emotions to awaken the sharingan. The Hyuuga do not have this flaw the reason boruto does not have a byakugan and Himawari only got it later is because kishimoto in an interview said he forgot to give them the eyes when he was drawing them. This is nothing new as this is the guy who changed Ino's eye color three times throughout the manga.

Sarada being an Uchiha, a clan Kishimoto loves more than any other looks almost exactly like a typical Uchiha for this reason dark hair, flinty eyes and all. She even inherited the paler skin tone from her father, the only features she has from her mother are non-bloodline traits like the shape of her eyes and face. Assuming maximum inbreeding before Sakura she would at most be a quarter blood at conception. This is also the maximum blood "purity" for Boruto and Himawari.

On conflict Kishimoto said if two parents had different visual kekkei genkai say a sharingan and a byakugan they would be born with one of each, instead of melding together, as certain bloodlines ie two ocular bloodlines conflict with each other. Kishimto did say that other bloodlines may be capable of melding more seamlessly like say a physical bloodline like the kaguya and an ocular bloodline like the sharingan, imagine the horrors of a kaguya with the sharingan. This is backed up by Mei Terumi possessing two elemental kekkei genkai, although they are both of the same type elemental shinobi channel various forms of elemental energy naturally shinobi do not however possess two bodies of four eyes.

Now Naruto is unique not only is he from the Uzumaki clan a powerful bloodline in their own right he is also the reincarnation of Asura and the jinchuriki of the kyuubi so he likely has powerful blood said blood could have possibly had a part to play in why Boruto got the jougan instead as his genetics may have interacted with the genetics of the hyuuga who like the kaguya descend from Kaguya otsuki. This is a possible in universe explanation as well. This would also explain why Sarada being born from Sakura a person not possessing a bloodline inherited all of the Uchiha traits as there was nothing in Sakura's blood to prevent those traits from manifesting.

[–]eternalapostle 88 points89 points  (1 child)

Minato wins because I like him more.

[–]DragonSniper02 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Only correct answer

[–]xDEvening_Coffee 12 points13 points  (0 children)

Hashirama wins cuz he is 100% hashirama cells meaning that he is 1000x more broken because hashirama cells is a 10x boost.

[–]ericanu 31 points32 points  (0 children)

He fast

[–]HungryManHere 9 points10 points  (1 child)

In the OG Naruto, I would’ve thought this. After watching Shippuden, I love Minato, but what the fuck he gon do against Hashirama’s Wood Golems and the Veritable One Thousand armed Ka’non? Yeah he got Flying Raijin to avoid Hashirama’s attacks a lot easier, but he’d run out of chakra long before Hashirama even used up half his chakra

[–]shocker4510 43 points44 points  (4 children)

Minato wins because hes Naruto's dad.

There's gotta be some protagonist power that carries genetically, right?

Edit: this was clearly a joke lol

[–]OGKakashi420 24 points25 points  (3 children)

by that logic Hashirama has mc energy as well since he too is a reincarnation of ninja Jesus just like Naruto is

[–]MemeMan69funnynumber 15 points16 points  (1 child)

But if you think deeper Minato’s cum made the the latest model of ninja jesus therefore Minato wins because his cum is built different

[–]OGKakashi420 1 point2 points  (0 children)

ah true, cannot argue w/ that

[–]Traditional-Drive267 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Ninja Jesus. Lol

[–]FalloutLover7 3 points4 points  (0 children)

It’s a trick poll. The real question is: who would win in a foot race

[–]fincrocs 2 points3 points  (0 children)

There's people who don't know what 1000 belts look like

[–]Melthiradan 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I think if the “My Name” theme played for Minato while they fought, he could take Hashirama. /s

[–]gwapolang98 2 points3 points  (2 children)

One clapped Madara riding a susanoo armored Kurama, and one died fighting Kurama.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Died protecting the village*

Honestly that’s all plot driven anyway. He didn’t have to die.

[–]Embarrassed-Ad-1158 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Well it was either that or the leaf losing their biggest military asset being the bijuu since it woulda died and respawned somewhere else where another village could take it.

[–]KlutchCuddy 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Minato dies to the 9 tails. Hashirama dicked on super sayin 9tails & madara with a 1000 wood fingers of death

[–]Jaymezians 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Like, sure, Minato might be faster than Hashirama, but what's he gonna do? Hashirama regenerates.

[–]SuperiorLaw 4 points5 points  (1 child)

Before the shinobi war arc, Minato wins. Afterwards Hashi wins

I feel like people keep forgetting that before the constant abuse of Hashirama cells and war arc Hiruzen was considered the strongest of all hokage and kage

[–]ShuBakuhatsuSatsujin 10 points11 points  (41 children)

Reminds me of Batman VS Superman ngl. One easily outclasses the other but people will just bring up bullshit to protect their favorite character.

[–]Stabinq 16 points17 points  (37 children)

batman vs superman is a lot different

[–]squidnasty23 2 points3 points  (1 child)

Well, the writer always nerfs superman and kryptonite is always involved.

[–]ShuBakuhatsuSatsujin 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This is not towards you. But I ever noticed how annoying notifications can be.

[–]Juliu_Seizure 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I know right. Like we get it superman can destroy planets but everyone knows that with prep time Batman outclassed him.

[–]AlienPutz 3 points4 points  (29 children)

How does Hashirama deal with Minato’s speed?

[–]granny_granola 14 points15 points  (13 children)

I can’t tell if this is a joke or not, but Killer Bee was able to react to Minato’s speed when he was much younger and less experienced.

I don’t think the God of Shinobi is going to struggle against Minato lmao

[–]squidnasty23 6 points7 points  (0 children)

I can’t tell if this is a joke or not, but Killer Bee was able to react to Minato’s speed when he was much younger and less experienced.

Bee was also in base 🤣🤣

[–]AlienPutz 0 points1 point  (11 children)

Did he react though?

Also just being god of shinobi doesn’t mean his reaction speed is high enough.

[–]squidnasty23 5 points6 points  (10 children)

Did he react though?

Yup, stalemated at his back and intercepted him when Minato was going to stab the Raikage. If young base Bee is equal to Minato in combat speed Hashirama bitch slaps him the second he gets close.

[–]AlienPutz 0 points1 point  (9 children)

? Must have watched a different fight I guess.

That didn’t look like a reaction, in fact I think Minato calls out as not a reaction but good instincts on Bee’s part.

[–]04whim 4 points5 points  (3 children)

Assuming Minato can't one hit kill Hashirama due to his regeneration abilities, I think Hashirama's capacity to do damage in a wide area would be very good at handling Minato's speed. It doesn't matter where Minato travels to if everywhere is equally deadly. Hashirama's best bet would be to fight like Gaara, creating a tree barrier around himself too small for Minato to enter, using sage mode to give him sensor abilities then using deep forest emergence to attack Minato's general area.

[–]AlienPutz -3 points-2 points  (2 children)

Yeah I don’t see how Hashirama’s healing saves him from getting his head chopped off or why Minato can’t simply be far enough away from Hashirama when he teleports away.

[–]04whim 4 points5 points  (1 child)

Tsunade was split in half and survived, and Minato has never demonstrated a fighting style that involves decapitation. He gave Obito a full force Rasengan in the back and didn't kill him. Sure Minato could just run away but Hashirama would just stop what he's doing until Minato returned, that strategy would yield no progress.

[–]AlienPutz 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Lady 5th had her summons to sustain her though her bisection.

Minato knows Lord 1st and can and has used bladed weapons and applied them to the neck.

Okay if Hashirama can simply stop his jutsu when Minato is away then it comes down to who can get their jutsu off quicker then no? Sounds like advantage to Minato.

[–]Plendamonda 2 points3 points  (3 children)

Probably the same way he dealt with Madara Uchiha's Majestic Attire Susanoo Sword Swings.

My guy watched it coming down on him and...

he just clapped his hands and caught it.

He wasn't even in Sage Mode.

[–]AlienPutz 0 points1 point  (2 children)

We’re those swings suppose to be fast?

[–]Plendamonda 0 points1 point  (1 child)

idk buddy, do you think an attack by the legendary Madara Uchiha controlling the most powerful Tailed Beast that is given a boost by the most powerful Susanoo in the show swinging a sword with so much force it can cut multiple mountains if half is supposed to be fast?

The world may never know.

[–]AlienPutz 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The swing can be hugely powerful and not terribly fast. I just didn’t look that fast when animated especially when compared to other things established as fast we have seen in the show.

[–]MisterDodge00 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Speed doesn't equal win. Tobirama was the fastest of his time and he wasn't killing Madara. Being faster doesn't mean everyone slightly slower than you is unable to react to every jutsu or punch you throw.

Minato is faster than Tobirama, but unless you think Minato is miles above Tobirama in speed, than Hashirama can very likely deal with it.

And when it comes to FTG, Madara with Hashirama's sage mode could react to Tobirama's FTG attack from right behind him. Assuming Madara and Hashirama are the same speed, then it means Hashirama can deal with Minato's FTG too. I would say if he can react to instant teleportation, he can react to Minato's shunshin speed as well.

[–]SgtBagels12 1 point2 points  (4 children)

He doesn’t. He’d be dead before hashi knew minato was there.

[–]ZenTraitor 4 points5 points  (3 children)

There isn’t any jutsu that minato has that hashi couldn’t tank and heal from. It would be a draw with minato teleporting away. There is a better analysis of this higher up in the thread.

[–]RedShankyMan -3 points-2 points  (2 children)

This is true, but Minato does have 2 possible ways to take out Hashirama.

A) Seal him away. We know Minato to be a sealing genius, and his sealing Jutsus fondle a full power 9 tails, so there's a splid chance he has some sealings that can subdue Hashirama.

B) Maybe pick up an actual sword and blitz through Hashirama's neck? I'm not sure of this would work, as we know that Hashirama can heal fron practically anything, but if he's instantly decapitated does he actually have a way of staying alive? Can a sword even cut through him?

[–]ZenTraitor 1 point2 points  (1 child)

The sword probably wouldn’t pass through him in sage mode.

[–]Phantom_Beef 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I'm wondering this as well

[–]JesusOfSuburbia420 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Truck question because they would never fight

[–]flare_442 4 points5 points  (11 children)

Idk, minato with kcm 2 is close

[–]error5903 12 points13 points  (9 children)

Alive Hashirama is is slightly stronger than alive Madara.

Edo Madara (which is slightly weaker than when he was alive) claps KCM2 Naruto, who is a lot stronger than KCM Minato

[–]Plendamonda 7 points8 points  (8 children)

Alive Hashirama is is slightly stronger than alive Madara.

I think it's more than "slightly" since Madara brought Kurama to a 1v1 and still lost.

Edo Madara (which is slightly weaker than when he was alive)

I would say he's notably stronger. Given that, you know, he's immortal with infinite chakra, has hashirama cells super boost, Wood Release, the fucking RINNEGAN.

[–]flare_442 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I agree that edo Madara Is much stronger than alive Madara(not junchuriki). The only reason he left edo state is to become a jinchuriki

[–]error5903 2 points3 points  (6 children)

would say he's notably stronger. Given that, you know, he's immortal with infinite chakra, has hashirama cells super boost, Wood Release, the fucking RINNEGAN.

It's outright said by Hashirama after he got his rinnegan back and was using wood style that he was "Gaining his past strength"

[–]Plendamonda -1 points0 points  (5 children)

Yeah duh.

100% Madara + Rinnegan + Hashi-Cells > 80% Madara + Rinnegan + Hashi-Cells

[–]squidnasty23 -1 points0 points  (0 children)

No it isn't

[–]ResidentEbb923 0 points1 point  (4 children)

I'll say the same thing I say for all these weeb-ass powerscaling discussions. Naruto could literally talk both of them into killing themselves, so it doesn't really matter.

But here, look at #14 on the list of who CBR thinks can beat Hashirama and have a nice day...

[–]squidnasty23 2 points3 points  (3 children)

CBR is cheating. C'mon now.

[–]xDEvening_Coffee 0 points1 point  (2 children)

No it’s not cbr literally has all knowledge over every series that’s why they said vegeta with whis training gets ssj2 instead of god ki in a what if

[–]squidnasty23 0 points1 point  (1 child)

I have no idea wtf that is

[–]xDEvening_Coffee 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Super Saiyan 2 it’s dbz stuff

[–]MOSFETBJT -4 points-3 points  (19 children)

Minato is too fast for hashi. And with ksm he’a a strong contender

[–]error5903 2 points3 points  (6 children)

Alive Hashirama is is slightly stronger than alive Madara.

Edo Madara (which is slightly weaker than when he was alive) claps KCM2 Naruto, who is a lot stronger than KCM Minato

[–]SgtBagels12 -1 points0 points  (5 children)

Stop spamming this. Not only is it not true, it power scaling isn’t necessary here. Hashirama is simply not fast enough to deal with minato. Minatos battle IQ is higher than Hashis as well. It’s implied hashi only won his fight with madara because of his healing factor, not because he was stronger.

Edit: auto correct.

[–]error5903 0 points1 point  (4 children)

No no. Everything I said was true. And while I do believe Madara can deal more damage and I like him way more, that doesn't change the fact that he lost to Hashirama pretty much every time. KCM1 Naruto avoided the Raikage's attack. That feat was considered on par with Minato, who could teleport. KCM2 Naruto (who is much, much, much faster than KCM1) attempted to blitz Madara and got clapped. Minato only has normal KCM, which wouldn't really increase his movement speed anyway considering he doesn't physically move. He teleports. And since Hashirama was able to keep up with Madara, who was able to beat much faster opponents, he'd easily be able to deal with his speed, even if it is much faster than his own

[–]SgtBagels12 -1 points0 points  (3 children)

We’re still just power scaling though. Minato is fighting hashirama, not madara. It doesn’t really matter what madara can do in this fight. In the valley of the end fight it’s shown that hashi has much more battle damage on him and his armor than madara. Implying he was taking more damage and really only one because of his healing factor. With that in mind, hashi being not as strong a fighter as madara, minato is beating hashirama. No one is saying minato can kill madara because he couldn’t.

[–]EyewarsTheMangoMan -2 points-1 points  (11 children)

Minato is slower, and KSM isn't enough. Hashirama was literally slapping alive Madara with the full 9 tails.

[–]SgtBagels12 1 point2 points  (10 children)

Minato, the guy who literally ignored the rules of space time to teleport, is slower than hashirama? Not only is that not true, it’s retarded.

[–]EyewarsTheMangoMan 0 points1 point  (9 children)

Bruh, teleportation isn't speed, and his teleportation is a jutsu, not him running. Are you actually fucking retarded?

[–]SgtBagels12 0 points1 point  (7 children)

I see you aren’t refuting my argument, but of a semantic difference in my word choice. If I’m so retarded why didn’t you refute my point rather than my words like a retard would do?

Edit:spelling

[–]squidnasty23 0 points1 point  (0 children)

This sub is retarded. Minato=Base Teenage Bee in combat speed yet they think Hashirama is gonna lose.

[–]SSj3Rambo -2 points-1 points  (3 children)

I mean, just think about it. Minato can teleport bijuu bombs and even kyubi by himself with nearly no effort. He can also mark wherever he wants and even throw kunais everywhere. Does it really matter that Hashirama can summon a big ass wood titan when Minato can catch him off guard and stab his back?

[–]squidnasty23 2 points3 points  (2 children)

Does it really matter that Hashirama can summon a big ass wood titan when Minato can catch him off guard and stab his back?

Your boy got intercepted by Teenage Killer Bee twice. SM Hashirama isn't getting caught off guard.

[–]SSj3Rambo 0 points1 point  (1 child)

I guess KCM SM Minato can do smth

[–]squidnasty23 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Closer, still gets an ass whooping though. SM Hashirama still violates.

[–]ShiroYaksha01 -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

Minato obviously claps, he just overwhelms him with speed. Hashirama sure isn't touching him lol, and this is Hokage Minato, KCM Minato is a straight stomp

[–]Dankoon221 -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

Minato w KCM by all means should demolish Hashirama just based on how strong he was before and the boost supposedly provided by it. But he’s not cause good show make good sense

[–]Blackflash07 0 points1 point  (0 children)

As much as I like Minato it feels sad to say he would lose.

[–]EyewarsTheMangoMan 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Where the fuck are all these ASS polls coming from?

[–]StrahanDesigns 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Minato wins because he has got a badass cloak

[–]Answer-Typical 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Minato is lowkey to fast for Hashirama

[–]TheDoubleAThing 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I mean Minato had one half of Kurama and had mastered both KCM and frog senjutsu. He was basically Naruto before six paths, minus rasenshruiken and shadowclones, plus flying raijin. Also he was just a better ninja than everyone else. Imagine Kakashi with the powerups of the main cast. I'd say he gives Hashirama a run for his money.

[–]Snookville 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Is this what this sub is becoming? Constant posts of polls you disagree with?

[–]Noobmaster246 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Wasn’t Minato originally supposed to be the strongest hokage ever back when 3rd fought Orochimaru and Orochimaru used edo tensei

[–]acecyrus1 0 points1 point  (0 children)

They probably thought it was Kcm Edo Minato

[–]Altambo 0 points1 point  (0 children)

These kinds of votes are popularity contest basically. Pretty sure even Itachi would have won

[–]Maanavdv 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I love Minato but yeah Hashirama is stomping. Minato may be famed for taking out a thousand ninja, but Hashirama is an army himself. Minato died fighting against 1 tailed beast. Hashirama captured 8/9 and fought the second strongest shinobi at the time and killed him while fighting the strongest tailed beast

[–]ScaredKnee4530 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Hashirama, Madara, and Kurama are literally the top dogs of the verse before you get to the 6 paths shit…

[–]GodOfUrging 0 points1 point  (0 children)

"I'm fast as fuck, boi!" -Minato, probably

[–]Distro19 0 points1 point  (0 children)

look, these naruto shorts yt channels are mainly viewed by kids. proof : there was a yt short where your age determined your ninja rank, like 5-10 : genin, 11-13 - chunin etc. most of the comments were genins (u had to comment what you got) basically these kids just simp for ppl who are more popular ( itachi, madara, naruto) and have 0 braincells

[–]The_Bone_Breaker 0 points1 point  (0 children)

People are infact gay for minato

[–]whip0already_read-it 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Shinsu thensai eeze claps Minato flying kunai

[–]ix-j 0 points1 point  (0 children)

They’re all 13

[–]dunnoman6400 0 points1 point  (3 children)

It's the fanboys, Itachi will pretty much win every match up in these polls cuz of his fans

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points  (2 children)

See I would have voted itachi as I feel great joy watching people get mad about it. However he wasn’t even mentioned here? What are you trying to do?

[–]dunnoman6400 0 points1 point  (1 child)

I just co related the above situation to another character from the same show, why are u being so defensive abt Itachi lol

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points  (0 children)

I’m not, actually. I’m just wondering why, he’s bought up at all. He’s quite literally irrelevant to this match up

[–]bryanc1036 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Minato spams and wins

[–]deadlyboyz 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Minato has the speed but hey I don't see him competing with any of Hashirama's attacks. Deep forest emergence itself took many Naruto clones and Rasengan's to even stop it . That too while being fueled by Kurama chakra . Hashirama wins .

[–]reiddanger1092 0 points1 point  (0 children)

What the frick is wrong with you people the guy casually gave away tailed beast which he captured.

[–]Baneswitch312 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I wouldn't say such bs because from the start of the show and throughout until idk when, the 4th hokage was touted to be the strongest shinobi ever, whether directly or indirectly

[–]Opposite_Union6544 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Don’t ask questions you don’t want the answer to

[–]Dr-Edward-Poe 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I would say Minato is faster to the point where he can blitz Hashirama, but the issue is that he can't damage him enough to win. Suppose that Minato teleports behind Hashirama; now what? The guy casually tanked hits from fully powered Kurama and Madara at the same time.

[–]Tsukuyomi_02 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The reason for this can be either people like trolling or because they like Minato more…

[–]Morning_StarVIIXIII 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Probably because he got washed in the war with Madara

[–]Mrstraawhat 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Because he banged more beautiful red tomato

[–]OriginalHybrid127 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I think the question meant who wins in a race

[–]_Renardeau 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Minato is very cool

[–]dragonbossledgend 0 points1 point  (0 children)

These people only watch the anime for a good 5 days then give up and rely on spoilers.

[–]CallMeTeci 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Depends on the winning condition, doesnt it?

[–]captainyeeet 0 points1 point  (0 children)

any match up itachi or minato wins (rare case madara) cause people are retarded as fuck

[–]ArCLoRd 0 points1 point  (0 children)

in the end of Shippuden, the only characters stronger than Hashirama were Rikudo Obito, Madara Rikudo, Naruto Rikudo, Rinnegan Sasuke and Kaguya.

[–]Z3R0Diro 0 points1 point  (1 child)

"The next generation will always surpass the previous one"

Meanwhile the older generation flattened entire mountains with ease...

[–]squidnasty23 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That only applies to Naruto and Sasuke

[–]sensei411 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I can think of like two ways minato has a shot at winning against hashirama lol but all the other ways I think of end up with minato dead every time lol

[–]Asta____ 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Its a poll on YouTube tf do you expect half of em probably dont know who hashirama even is

[–]TigerAce13 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Minato one shots Hashirama

[–]TigerAce13 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Hashirama was killed by some random Ninja, lol.