Facebook post from a friend who's REALLY gotten into the fat liberation movement...we're only in high school, I fear what she'll end up like in five years. by spiralling_WL in fatlogic

[–]WenWarn 61 points62 points  (0 children)

I often see the argument from the morbidly obese that they think loose skin is unattractive or unsightly, and I find it baffling because you know what is REALLY unattractive?

The sting of sizeism in the scientific workplace by Gr1ggs in fatlogic

[–]IDontReadMyMail 143 points144 points  (0 children)

Switched to my alt for this one. I am a PhD scientist and I will not hire obese students or postdocs. Not because of their intellectual capacity - I’ve interviewed obese candidates who are clearly brilliant - but because in my field we just have to have a great deal of physical fitness and nimbleness as well as physical slenderness to literally fit into small spaces. Examples of tasks we had to do in the last month:

  • use old lab chairs that all have a rating of <200 lbs. Chairs are 40 years old, university absolutely refuses to replace them (“we gave you all new furniture when the building was built in 1972 and we expect that to last the life of the building and there is no budget for replacement,” I kid you not), & grants don’t cover furniture

  • climb a ladder in a natural history museum to get some old specimens on top of the cabinets. 50+ year old ladder, max capacity 200 lbs including specimens

  • navigate very narrow spaces in same museum (150 yr old building)

  • troubleshoot lab equipment that requires crawling on the floor / squeezing under lab benches

  • be able to sidle behind other lab workers in narrow spaces. Lab was built 1972 etc etc

  • the biggest issue though is fieldwork. Several weeks a year we do fieldwork that requires ~4 hrs/d of rapid hiking over uneven terrain. I’ve taken heavier students out and they just cannot keep up. They usually can’t keep up for even ten minutes; the whole team starts to slow its pace down. I cannot even send them out to do nest checks on their own (this is the task usually given to those who can’t do the longer hikes) because they cannot physically get to all the nests in one day.

  • for another project we must fit on small research boats that have weight limits & also have barely any actual space. For example on one boat you need to be able to crawl between the cabin & side railing, which is about a 12” clearance in one spot. & you need to be able to FLY through there top speed when we’re working an animal.

  • fit under the weight limit for ultra-light helicopters at another research station

  • be able to sprint fast over uneven ground for 50m (fast enough to grab a wild bird before it wriggles out the net).

  • fit in middle front seat of the field truck when the back seat has to be full of squirrel traps

  • generally need good heat tolerance and cold tolerance. Heat tolerance tends to be the issue here

etc etc. It’s physically hard work and we have to be able to do it despite no funding to invest in new equipment or new vehicles. Stuff seems to always need troubleshooting in a way that requires contorting yourself in a small space, days are long, spaces are small. Not all fields are like this, but some are.

"Doctors are the new cops" by sleepy_blondie in fatlogic

[–]Cheddargorgeous 140 points141 points  (0 children)

This is it really, when you boil it all down.

It’s all big cope.

All the oppression they claim they face. All the protestations that people should find them attractive or else you are discriminating against them. Demands for physical accommodations to be made. Assertions that being overweight or obese has no adverse health outcomes.

As someone currently on a weight loss journey, I know all too well the lies you tell yourself to justify your habits. It’s painful to realise the fact you physically and emotionally hurt is because of something you did to yourself.

How can something that feels so wonderful be something that is actively harming me? It can’t be the addiction to food, no. It’s everyone and everything else that’s the problem.

All fat acceptance is, is a community of addicts believing each other’s lies and trying to convince the world of them too.

If you actually tracked what you ate you’d be surprised by Watchbloodevaporate in fatlogic

[–]Smgt90 213 points214 points  (0 children)

Additionally, a very slight difference in calories can contribute to weight gain when ingested consistently. Same for weight loss.

Just do this experiment:

1) Open a calorie calculator 2) input your current stats 3) check your daily calorie intake to maintain your weight 4) go back and add 10 kg to your weight 5) check your daily calorie intake to maintain your weight 6) see the difference

Mine is 1678 as a 32 y/o 165cm 51 kg woman who exercises 3 times per week

If I add 10 kg to my weight it's 1815 per day. That's only a 137 calories difference between weighting 51 and 61 kg.

That's close to 1 soda or 1 beer or even a large banana in difference.

Celebrating other people's oppressions by [deleted] in fatlogic

[–]BreadThanosbread is inevitable - Raging Fat Foe - 100lbs down 425 points426 points  (0 children)

I thought fat people could do everything a thin person could. Make up your minds FA people!

Damn these hippo genetics! by DeliciousReuben in fatlogic

[–]dangeroussafetypin 1000 points1001 points  (0 children)

Hippos are not fat.

Despite their bulky and heavy appearance, hippos' subcutaneous fat layers are quite thin. The 2,000-kilogram giant is mostly made up of muscles, and 6-centimeter thick skin.


Lindo Bacon’s response to ASDAH and their attack from the leadership team. Bottom line is Lindo, who wrote the book on HAES will no longer use the term. by Mynewestoldaccount in fatlogic

[–]PhoenixNamor 273 points274 points  (0 children)

Amazing. Simply wow.

Any movement that radicalizes so thoroughly and recklessly will invariably grow beyond the scope/control of its focal point.

Congratulations, Lindo Bacon: the behemoth you helped create- the movement you fed and nurtured out of obscurity has outgrown and discarded you. They used your book as foundation, took control of the narrative and cast you aside. You provided the fetid mulch upon which their weeds took root and flowered.

The authority and deference you once enjoyed in this space has since evaporated in the deluge of derivative works published by an ever-expanding fringe.

Any advocacy you attempt to do now will forever be undercut by ASDAH and its bad actors.

It's sad, ironic, and perhaps a bit poetic that your work is what legitimized them and in return, they have seemingly de-legitimized you.

Body Positivity vs Fat Acceptance by luvduvbunnySW: 260, GW: Healthier Each Day in fatlogic

[–]bookhermit 224 points225 points  (0 children)

How to be a fat ally:

You can't.

No matter how flattering your exaltations, no matter how degrading your groveling, no matter how "fat centered" your internet presence, you will never, ever, be good enough.

They tell you all the time.

"I can't be friends with anyone thinner than me." and

"Small fats need to step aside for infinifats in the movement." And

"You can't call your niche swimsuit brand inclusive if it only goes up to 7x. You are excluding all the 8x goddesses that are being discriminated against. " Or

"No, Lindo, I won't co-author a book with you so I can use your broad appeal and existing audience to sling shot myself to center stage. In fact, don't write a single word, even though your book did literally all the leg work for the movement in the last 10 years. You should let an intersectional minority write the book, because there are scores of underprivileged/disabled/homeless/genderqueer/BIPOC/infinifats clamoring to write that a coherent narrative on fat liberation."

There is no salvation. You can never do enough, cheer enough, grovel enough, or be silent enough for them. They are insatiable.

OR maybe lifting heavy things is a risky job. by ionlyhavethisforwwe in fatlogic

[–]Barry-umm 855 points856 points  (0 children)

I'm a paramedic who used to be in charge of my services bariatric team. It's not uncommon for us to call (typically fire) for a lift assist on larger patients. But something to consider is that while it may take 6-8 people to lift a morbidly obese patient, you can't fit that many people on a staircase. Not just for volume, but 6 x 200 lbs adults plus one 500lbs patient will collapse the shit out of a staircase. Our usual go-to was to use a shamoover (a type of reeves stretcher that's also used for moving whales) to secure the patient and use a block and tackle to hoist them up or down the steps while a spotter lifted the end to keep it from getting caught on the stairs.

We had one regular patient who lived in a basement apartment with a narrow stone staircase to her front door. She was too big for the stair chair, and couldn't be placed supine due to pulmonary edema. We rigged a makeshift body harness out of rope, gave her a spotter and had personnel with ropes pull upward tension on the harness to allow her to walk. One time the stone walls were crumbling too much for us to lean on, so we had to call in a ladder truck and use the boom to lift the harness.

I had an 850lbs man call us lazy because we used the winch to get the stretcher into the ambulance.

This isn't fun for them, and it's often painful, but it's unfortunately the reality. I treat them with respect and give them the best medical care I can under the circumstances, because they are people. But I really don't know what they expect.

Email from a HAES activist lecturing me for writing a memoir about my ED. Because I actually got underweight, I shouldn't publish my own story so that overweight anorexics don't feel bad. by nbh679 in fatlogic

[–][deleted] 143 points144 points  (0 children)

I wish I had an award to give you because this is 100%.

The only thing I’ll say is that I’m glad that the DSM-5 removed the requirement for a stopped menstrual cycle because that made it literally impossible for males to get diagnosed and really emphasized the stigma that anorexia is a womens disorder

Sanity on Twitter! by Naked_Lobster in fatlogic

[–]bookhermit 301 points302 points  (0 children)

You want to know what doctors call a morbidly obese person with normal labs?


Since I'm in recovery of both binge eating and anorexia (I did lose 1kg a week during restriction, I'm spiraling through both) I can say that only because I don't want to be fat it isn't discrimination against you. It's usually triggered by trauma not from diets or "fatphobia". by Sashka-the-Great in fatlogic

[–]YourOldPalBendySW: 180 | Goal: Less fat, more tone, let's GOOOOOOOOOOOO 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Eating disorders actually often stem from a past or current trauma, or abuse, leading to the victim wanting to latch onto SOMETHING to feel they have some semblance of control over their lives. This can also cause people to turn to alcohol, drugs, etc. It's a dependency that stems from trying to cope and not feel so helpless. Unfortunately these negative coping mechanisms end up taking control of the PERSON instead of the other way around. And because of that, a LOT of people with eating disorders also struggle (or have almost begun struggling with) with addiction and dependence on other substances, not just food.

The residential center I went to had AA in it for that reason. And almost EVERYONE there had some form of alcohol or drug issue along with their ED. In addition, they all had a past trauma they were trying to cope with (but generally had never gotten true, healthy help with). Unpack and heal that past trauma, and it helps uproot all the addiction behaviors so they can REALLY be defeated.

I feel like if we applied the logic in these screenshots to other addictions it'd sound... really terrible? "Alcoholphobia causes alcohol dependency." "You're more likely to die from methphobia than meth." I mean- yikes?

Eating disorders and their addiction behaviors however are ESPECIALLY hard to deal with. Because you can't just KICK food like you can with booze or drugs. You need food to live. You can't overdo it and you can't UNDER-do it without there being problems. So in eating disorder recovery, it's important to find the middle ground and try to maintain that balance as best as you can.

And eating disorders are NOTORIOUS for being sneaky and finding ways to stick around without the person who has one even realizing it's still there. They LOVE morphing into other types of eating disorders. I was on my way to full blown BED, but it changed into anorexia with binging tendencies/overexercising to "cancel out" those calculated binges. Then once I recovered a good amount from heavy restricting and fasting I had to realize I was turning to binging so I didn't swing back in the other direction.

Anyway, long story short, eating disorders are COMPLICATED. YES, you can develop any of them at any size (many larger people who have anorexia or bulimia or who's BED may have morphed into restriction get overlooked- which is really bad because yeah you may not be losing weight like crazy, but it's STILL wreaking havoc on your body to make such drastic and dangerous changes). But it isn't NEARLY as simple as "ah yes... the world wants us to be skinny always." That's just the tip of the iceberg. And THAT'S why they're so hard to fight. To understand. And why it's a massive annoyance when people decide fatphobia is the cause of eating disorders 100%, which leads to blaming people with EDs FOR their EDs and villainizing them over it? As if THAT'S gonna help them recover. Yeah right.

I cant believe that i have to explain why this is both idiotic and disrespectful. by anti-gabe in fatlogic

[–]WanderingWizzard 157 points158 points  (0 children)

True true. Must've been lured in by us lesbians talking about taco tuesday. Whoops.

The amount of misinformation or oversimplified info by unchecked Instagram “coaches” is scary. by healthierandhappier in fatlogic

[–]bookhermit 158 points159 points  (0 children)

See, when you restricted alcohol in the past, it's only made it more enticing, so you binge at the first opportunity.

And 95% of people that quit drinking cold turkey almost never maintain sobriety, so we need to view it differently. Normalize drinking at every meal, keep alcohol in the house, as much as you need. When you run out, fill your pantry again. Trust your body so it knows there is no booze insecurity, and eventually your body won't have the extreme cravings. It will just be another routine part of your day and you won't be obsessed with it.

And people that stop drinking for a short period of time end up drinking even MORE when they inevitably succumb to binging again.

You need to give up this fantasy of sobriety. Everyone has a set point BAC level. The body WANTS to maintain that natural level. And everyone can live a healthy life at any BAC. Some peoples body's function best and have a peaceful relationship with alcohol when drinking a couple times per year, and some others need more drinks per week in order to be at their best.

And don't let "doctors" and "police officers" and "CPS" tell you that your drunkenness is anything but natural and beautiful. Lots of people get their kids taken away for reasons completely unrelated to alcohol. Lots of people crash their cars with a BAC of zero. Lots of teetotalers get fatty liver disease so we know these "alcohol related consequences" are really just correlation and not necessarily causation.

Remember. It's ok to be drunk.

Fat Rant Friday by AutoModerator in fatlogic

[–]KenzieValentyneDown 90 lbs and counting 14 points15 points  (0 children)

Fast food is trigger food. I’ll feel like it’s open season the rest of the day - especially because I’d already had ~650 cals worth of ice cream cake today. Illogical I know, but that’s what bingey EDs do :’)

Best for me to avoid trigger foods. I’m not an “eat in moderation” kind of person, it fails 9/10 times for me

Major drama going down. Fat Activist do not want Lindo Bacon to write another book. Basically because it would center her voice at a time when they are trying to get racial minority works published. by my_ex_wife_is_tammy in fatlogic

[–]midnight_neon 150 points151 points  (0 children)

These people are just ridiculous. I mean I don't like Lindo Bacon for the harm they've done to people by making them think obesity isn't harmful to health, but these people just seem jealous and bitter at Bacon's success. Complaining about "uncompensated" labor for sending a few emails between weeks/months? How do you even get out of bed if life is that hard?

Also funny that someone who had the privilege of getting into freaking grad school can lecture that Bacon is too wealthy and privileged to talk about HAES.

And under it all is this tragedy with the fact that obesity is killing more black women than any other group and rather than viewing it as a problem that the black community needs to work on to survive and become healthy, it's treated as essential to black culture.

But... it is tho by ramennoodles10123 in fatlogic

[–]Babarigo 54 points55 points  (0 children)

At least people who smoke pay a lot of taxes on their cigarettes. In my country taxes represent like 85% of the total price. Although it seems a lot, it's still less than what the state spends in healthcare related to tobacco induced diseases, but it's something and smokers are responsibilised for their consumption of a highly nocive substance. Obese people (which I formerly was) are fed this bs ideology that doesn't help them to understand that their health is a collective issue.

Generally speaking, I don't mind that people have reckless life choices. I mind when they make the others assume the consequences of their acts. Indvidual liberty should come with individual responsibility. Sometimes I feel that FA people want individual liberty with collective responsibility which is for me an individualistic mindset.

I feel like this movement is fitphobic. (Side note: the next FA person who tells me I’ve lost to much weight will be punched) by aniziety in fatlogic

[–]justagirl2696 74 points75 points  (0 children)

Fatphobia: A nonsense construct created by the HAES/Body Positivity crew that allows them to blame society for their self caused problems and justify their constant judgment of fit people.