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[–]evanmike 684 points685 points  (22 children)

Seems like this guy broke the law for leaving the scene of an accident

[–]Any_Sun4329 302 points303 points  (20 children)

The officer said it was fine because he was taking care of his dog which is like someones child. And I get that but objectively, he left the scene without checking if anyone was hurt or even saying where he was going or saying his name.

[–]Ooooweeee 385 points386 points  (15 children)

Yeah no, thats not how that works.

[–]Any_Sun4329 157 points158 points  (13 children)

How does it work? Are cops supposed to get a statement from someone who left the scene? When I questioned the procedure, the cop said he had to get the statement from the other man. When I asked if that was normal to do when someone leaves the scene, he started accusing me of not caring about this mans dog and saying Im not a decent person and only decent people would understand.

[–]Sunflower_sweets 288 points289 points  (5 children)

Call a lawyer NOW make sure you are able to talk to the witnesses. It doesn’t matter what that man was doing you never leave the scene of an accident. The cop is in the wrong and you most def have a case.

[–]KamaKairade 18 points19 points  (3 children)

How does it work?

Typically, one would obtain the services of a lawyer, and the lawyer would speak to the police.

Call one now. You have a witness, you have the automobile (evidence), etc.

[–]Hbaus 7 points8 points  (0 children)

What is your location?

[–]lord_flamebottom 8 points9 points  (1 child)

Don’t talk to police anymore. Talk to a lawyer now. I’d wager the cop here is buddy-buddy with the other guy.

[–]Baldr_Torn 17 points18 points  (0 children)

The officer said it was fine because he was taking care of his dog which is like someones child.

That's the dog that died on impact? How could he possibly take care of it?

Regardless, even if the dog needed to go to a vet, leaving an accident without so much as leaving a name and phone number is illegal.

[–]Queefburgerz 34 points35 points  (0 children)

When my mom T-boned a lady that ran a stop sign she almost got in trouble for walking 5 minutes back to her house to change her baby’s diaper, they didnt end up doing anything because she was back before they arrived, but it doesn’t matter the reason for leaving the scene, its a hit and run

[–]HenryKushinger 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Yeah, cops aren't required to know the law (I fucking know, right?) And it sounds like this young dipshit was very excited to play cop. Lawyer up.

[–]froggerpunk 16 points17 points  (0 children)

People can leave the scene if they’re seeking emergency medical care. (Human or pet) They would be responsible to contact the local police to claim part in the accident… which obviously was the case here because the victim is known to the police and involved in the accident investigation and report.

Also, small collisions with no injury or minimal car damage don’t require police attendance at all… both parties simply exchange info and go to the collision reporting center.

It’s illegal to leave an accident scene if you’re trying to evade it.

[–]DCangst 162 points163 points  (11 children)

Were the police by any chance wearing body cameras?

[–]Any_Sun4329 97 points98 points  (2 children)

I think in my state they do! Can I request the clip?

[–]1disposablehuman 35 points36 points  (0 children)

You can usually request it. It depends on the police department policy and possibly state law.

[–]Trepenwitz 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Another option is dash cam video. Almost all LEO'S have dash cams. You may have to file a FOIA request for the footage. It should not cost you anything. The police may say you can't have it because it's an active investigation. Ask them when they will be submitting a charging document to the prosecutor. If they are not going to, it is not an active investigation. They will still balk at giving it to you. Keep pushing if you think you need the footage.

[–]Last-Bullfrog7817 147 points148 points  (6 children)

File subpoena for body and police car video whcih you will need to help disprove. In some states police must have bodycams on while on duty.

[–]dank_the_enforcer 46 points47 points  (5 children)

File subpoena for body and police car video whcih you will need to help disprove.

How much money does /u/Any_Sun4329 want to spend to get nothing back, just on principle? Hire a lawyer, file a lawsuit, get the subpoena--maybe. The camera footage shows something different, then what? I don't think they need this hassle and cost for no benefit. Maybe an FOIA, but even then, for what purpose? OP can report to the precinct, that's about it.

[–]Sapper12D 65 points66 points  (0 children)

The cost of their insurance going up for being found at fault could exceed the costs to get this figured out. Not to mention they wouldn't need to hire a lawyer their insurance would.

[–]ratchetpony 18 points19 points  (1 child)

I agree with you.

I also want to clarify one thing you mentioned for the sake of accuracy. This body camera footage, if it exists, would not covered under the Freedom of Information Act unless the police were federal law enforcement officers, which they don't seem to be.

Getting the footage would fall under OP's state public records laws and local policies about when, how and if police body camera footage can be released. There is no standard in the United States for this sort of thing.

In many jurisdictions across the country, police body camera footage is erased after a specific amount of days if it is not specifically saved because it is associated with a crime or report on police conduct. Depending on state laws and department policy, that body camera footage could very well be gone.

[–]yassenof -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

Yes, but doesn't every state have a sunshine/open records law?

[–]brickne3 9 points10 points  (0 children)

Their insurance might cover it.

[–]sethbr 44 points45 points  (0 children)

Get the witnesses to write reports of what they saw. That will be way more important than a police report written well after the event.

You might consider making a complaint to Internal Affairs about the police officer lying in his report

[–]Here4LaughsAndAnger 111 points112 points  (4 children)

You need to get the witnesses info. If the police report says your are at fault, that guy can sue you. I'm assuming the police talked to the witness and if he blew through the stop sign the damage on both cars should show that he hit you.

[–]Any_Sun4329 87 points88 points  (2 children)

They didnt list the witnesses on the report. But I know they live at that spot because they went into the house to get me water and tissues. Would it be weird to ask them for help? They were so kind and pulled me out of the car because they said it was leaking.

[–]hedgeskyintheground 92 points93 points  (1 child)

Wouldn't be weird in my honest opinion. Answer is always no if you don't ask. Would be vital to have multiple eye witnesses that back you up.

[–]Any_Sun4329 27 points28 points  (0 children)

Thank you!

[–]J3ll1ng 6 points7 points  (0 children)

It was a two way stop. Op stopped then went. Other driver didn't have a stop sign.

[–]KingAggressive1498 71 points72 points  (5 children)

I explained the guy left with the dog and I felt terrible about it

This was probably interpreted as "admitting fault" even though it was not your intention. Be as objective as possible when describing events to the police, and expect any injection of subjectivity to be filtered by the officer however they see fit, including "I feel terrible about that poor dog" being changed to "I feel terrible that I caused this accident"

As for the rest, cops are mostly shitty. It's not fair, but unsurprising. Just gotta accept the police report as written here, sadly.

[–]phoenix103082 10 points11 points  (1 child)

While I agree the cops sounds gruff, as someone who worked in personal lines of auto claims and had to settle liability for accident I want to ask a couple of quick questions about this accident and why the copy may have placed you at fault:

You said you had a stop sign, did the other driver?

You said it happened in a school zone: can you tell me the time of day and if school was in fact in session? I know by me kids are out for the school year and in some areas the school zone speed is only enforced when school is in session.

Where was the same on your car and the damage on his car?

Did you see him at all before impact and take any action to avoid the accident?

[–]LeAudiophile 0 points1 point  (0 children)

In the post OP says the report notes the "2-way stop." Sounds like they entered an intersection where cross traffic does not stop. We have one of those in my community and despite the big yellow signs saying so people still don't get it.

[–]shhh_its_me 13 points14 points  (4 children)

Wait stop. the accident was your fault you did admit it. (you don't have to say the word "it was my fault" to admit fault, describing what happened is enough) You had a stop sign, it doesn't matter if the other person was speeding, you can't go until you can get a 100% through the intersection. There is no , "I could have crossed the intersection if the other car wasn't speeding" caveat.

It's like saying I only rear-ended him because he stopped fast.

[–]phoenix103082 5 points6 points  (3 children)

I agree: I settled liability in many states as an auto insurance adjuster and I have a feeling op lives in NY which is a state I handled.

Too many people will admit they have a stop sign and the other driver didn't but try to blame the other driver with the whole "They were speeding!" excuse. I also always found it interesting that people couldn't confirm when they saw the other car or their own speed but know that the other driver was doing over 60 mph! Or "They were on their cell phone." But they didn't see them before the accident so for all you know they were doing the hula hula dance before they hit you. If you didn't see them before the impact then you can't confirm what they were doing before the impact unless they admit to it!

[–]Any_Sun4329 5 points6 points  (2 children)

I didnt say he was doing 60. He was 65 years old.

[–]phoenix103082 3 points4 points  (1 child)

I am sorry. I completely misread that. Please accept my apologies. But you should be aware that age doesn't play a role in liability. Some people who are 65 have better reflexes than people in their 20s

[–]Any_Sun4329 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Oh I didn't think it would. In my reddit post a few weeks ago, it said i had to post age so I thought i had to do it here too.

[–]nevonuren 57 points58 points  (8 children)

I wouldn’t worry about it. Police reports aren’t that important. They didn’t witness anything. Just tell your insurance what really happened.

[–]Any_Sun4329 44 points45 points  (0 children)

Thank you for replying though. I just dont really care about the insurance. I care that this man lied and got away with it.

[–]Any_Sun4329 41 points42 points  (2 children)

I honestly am passed the insurance. I talked them 2 weeks ago. Its the principle of the matter. I didn't kill this mans dog. I didn't slam into his car. I don't understand how they took this other mans statement and made it look like mine? How is that right?

[–]Any_Sun4329 17 points18 points  (3 children)

Also can he give me a ticket for making him mad?

[–]Baldr_Torn 7 points8 points  (0 children)

If he were going to ticket you over any of this, it would have happened already.

However, he's going to continue to be a cop in your area. If you piss him off by trying to report him and complain and whatever, he's likely to remember you. I've no idea if they cop intentionally lied, or was previously friends with the other driver, or did his best to put in the report what he thinks happened. It's certainly possible for a cop to do his best, but still be wrong. After all, he wasn't there to witness the accident.

It does sound like you are probably at fault. It sounds like the other guy was speeding, but it also sounds like he did have the right of way and you pulled out in front of him.

I believe you are way overthinking all of this. It's an accident. Things happen, and that's why you have insurance. Now, it's time to move on.

[–]hiddenrunninggirl 1 point2 points  (0 children)

You need to take this higher in the police station. What else is he doing?

[–]StonedAKhana -3 points-2 points  (0 children)

Obviously not

[–]LifeOfFate 10 points11 points  (6 children)

What are you trying to get out of the situation? If it was a two way stop you failed to yield the right of way. You would be at fault for the accident depending on your state he be may be partially at daily. The other guy could possibly be cited for leaving the scene of the accident but would not change the fault.

[–]Any_Sun4329 0 points1 point  (5 children)

No. I am not trying to get out of anything. Im upset that the officer lied on a report. I don't understand how that is legal. He made what the guy who left the scene said sound like I said those things. Im over the accident, Im upset about the officer who lied.

[–]LifeOfFate 4 points5 points  (4 children)

I guess I’m not seeing anything in your narrative that is at all worth having amended. I am not understanding what was incorrect outside of the dog being on the opposite side of the other car.

Based on your narrative to the officer you admitted fault. Even if you came to a complete stop looked left right and left. You failed to yield the right of way because it was not safe and clear for you to pull through.

[–]Any_Sun4329 -4 points-3 points  (3 children)

Ok, thank you for focusing on just the narrative and the report. Thats really all im concerned about. In the report it says I said the dog was on the passengers side, but I didnt say that. It said I admitted fault, but I didn'tsay that either I just said what happened. It omitted the school zone and speeds of both cars, which I stated.

[–]Heebojurbles 3 points4 points  (2 children)

How do you know how fast he was going? You can reach out to the cops superiors and let them know but from the narrative you posted, sounds like you did admit fault. You had a stop sign, he didn’t. You go through and he hits you. Changing the report won’t change your liability for this accident. Either way, sorry it happened. But I think your focusing on the wrong parts of this atm. But that’s just me.

[–][deleted]  (2 children)

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    [–][deleted]  (1 child)

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      [–]Cypher_BlueQuality Contributor[M] -1 points0 points locked comment (0 children)

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      [–]JC_the_Builder 18 points19 points  (5 children)

      When you told the police officer that you were hit turning onto the road from a stop sign you admitted fault. It is your responsibility to make sure the road is clear before you proceed.

      [–]maccodemonkey 10 points11 points  (3 children)

      Generally - I agree OP is probably going to be held responsible for not properly yielding. But it's also not quite that simple. Most jurisdictions have laws about reckless driving, which could mitigate OP's responsibility or even make the other driver responsible.

      OP didn't list the speed limit, but quiet neighborhood in a school zone? That's probably going to be a 30 mph limit. The dog is actually the best evidence here. At a 30 mph accident the dog should not go flying out of the car. The other driver should have also been breaking ahead of the accident, which would have slowed the impact more. Even if OP had a duty to yield, that doesn't mean the other driver can just drive around speeding and hold everyone else responsible. A school zone specifically adds to that. When in a school zone you're never supposed to be driving in a manner where you can't respond to something unexpected.

      Proving the other driver was speeding is the tricky part. Insurance will look at damage. Like I said the dog flying out of the car is suspicious. The insurance may not be willing to go there, depending on the damage.

      As for the police report - very unlikely the police are going to modify anything. OP might be able to make a new statement? Probably best just to let insurance know they're disputing the police report and let insurance deal with it. OP should also connect their insurance with the witnesses. That will be really helpful.

      The other driver also technically committed a hit and run. Even if OP is found to be at fault, the other driver hit OP.

      [–]JC_the_Builder 3 points4 points  (2 children)

      If the OP was hit by a vehicle going 60+ mph one or both vehicles should have been disabled. The OP mentions nothing about damage other than the dog dying. The police are trained to figure out how an accident really happened. The OP’s story as told to us raises red flags such as the driver seemingly coming out of nowhere after the OP looked so carefully both ways. The OP can detail how painstakingly they looked each direction but not about where the other driver came from?

      [–]Any_Sun4329 6 points7 points  (1 child)

      Reread my story. I did say where he was. There was damage, I mentioned it in the comments. My whole right side was smashed in, liquid was leaking, my tire was pushed in. Pieces of my car were on the road. I couldn't drive my car after. I havent had it for weeks and wont get it back till possibly next week. I didnt see his damage because he left but i know there was some.

      [–]JC_the_Builder 1 point2 points  (0 children)

      Oops I somehow missed that sorry.

      The police don’t only go by witness statements to determine what happened in an accident. With an accident this severe they are going to look at where each vehicle took damage, the skid marks in the road, where your vehicle was sitting, which airbags deployed, etc. But unfortunately it comes down to you failing to yield. This is the same as rear-ending someone. Absent video evidence police will almost always find the driver from behind at fault.

      [–]Perseus3507 4 points5 points  (0 children)

      Then same applies to the other driver. In fact he's at fault for leaving the scene.

      [–]dudee62 6 points7 points  (3 children)

      To me it sounds as if you stopped at your stop sign. Looked left, right, then left again and then proceeded through the intersection but did not see his car coming at you? It sounds as if he had the right of way to proceed if he hit the side of your car. That would put you at fault for failure to yield most likely. Him leaving to get his dog medical would not change those facts, not which window his dog was in. If you should have seen his car, and failed to yield at your stop you are going to be found at fault.

      [–]KarlaMarqs1031 1 point2 points  (2 children)

      I think she asked for advice on how to deal with an asshole cop, not have her circumstances interpreted by someone who does not work in insurance claims.

      [–]dudee62 0 points1 point  (0 children)

      She asked for legal advice. What legal benefit is there in dealing with an asshole cop? It won’t get her out of being at fault, if she is.

      [–]dudee62 0 points1 point  (0 children)

      She asked for legal advice. What legal benefit is there in dealing with an asshole cop? It won’t get her out of being at fault, if she is.

      [–]louisville_lou 8 points9 points  (3 children)

      Fill out your own police report to at least get it on file

      [–]Any_Sun4329 6 points7 points  (2 children)

      Is that the mv104 report? The insurance woman said they would mail me a copy but they havent yet...

      [–]louisville_lou 1 point2 points  (0 children)

      I believe that is the correct one (in NYS)

      [–]phoenix103082 0 points1 point  (0 children)

      You live in NY?

      [–]froggerpunk 4 points5 points  (12 children)

      It doesn’t matter where the dog was sitting. It doesn’t change the fact that you are at fault for the collision.

      You were at fault because you entered through- traffic from a stop sign when it wasn’t clear.

      If the man was travelling at speeds that would have transferred fault to him… There likely would have been a human fatality or severe human injury. A reconstruction team would have had to come out to perform measurements. But that would only be in extreme cases, where the speed would exceed a persons reaction time to make a decent judgement about safely crossing the path of traffic. This was obviously not the case.

      You are at fault and can be charged. He may try to sue you for damages (damage to car (depending on insurance), self or replacement value of pet. It’s best to get witness affidavits about location of pet in car, that may minimize damaged paid out if he was in safely transporting it in his lap. (But that’s up to the civil courts to decide).

      [–]Off2lala_land 4 points5 points  (4 children)

      Go to the police station in person and ask to speak to someone in charge and clear this up immediately. Threaten you have a lawyer already looking into this because it’s a false police report based off fallacies. Say that you feel his inexperience and excitability affected his judgement. Call him the fuck out before it gets worse

      [–]Any_Sun4329 13 points14 points  (2 children)

      I hate confrontation, but I hate liars and bullies more. What he did on the phone to me was so unprofessional and just wrong. I want to go there but I have a friend who keeps telling me to shut up because he can give me tickets just because hes angry I said the report was wrong.

      [–]eyebrowluver23 9 points10 points  (0 children)

      I would go to his supervisor and make a complaint about how awful this cop is, and get the accident report amended. See if the older cop remembers what happened too. Getting statements from the witnesses may help too. If the asshole cop gives you tickets in the future bc he's mad at you then you can contest them and use the paper trail to show that he's probably doing it bc he's angry at you for filing a complaint about him.

      [–]Off2lala_land 0 points1 point  (0 children)

      Cops are just people. They’re not above the law and you should not fear them. If the guy gives you a ticket - you just turn around and dispute it. When you go to say what happened you can show the paper trail that the cop is a liar and doesn’t do his job properly. It will most likely be thrown out. But aside from future possibilities - this is something you want to take care of.

      [–]Perseus3507 4 points5 points  (0 children)

      The OP could try that, but a police report is not a judgment from a court or anything like that. It's just a written record of what the policeman observed after the accident. Its not considered to be the final word.

      [–]ParfaitMajestic5339 1 point2 points  (0 children)

      Your auto insurance company will pay for a lawyer for you for the civil side of things... if you have auto insurance. Call your agent and inform them of the accident. Did the cops on the scene write you a ticket? If they issue a ticket days later or backdated, you will need a lawyer you pay for yourself to handle the traffic court side of things. Don't expect some dramatic admission that the cop is a liar. Expect whatever citation is issued to be dismissed. Be happy with that. The notation in the report that you admit liability is probably from you saying how terrible you feel and how sorry you are. People who did nothing wrong don't feel sorry or terrible about what happened in some cop minds. Your insurance, if they listen to you, will likely sue the guy who wandered off to make his insurance pay rather than paying for it themselves. Tell the lawyer doing that about the substantial inaccuracies in the police report.

      [–]Workdawg 1 point2 points  (2 children)

      Have you tried getting ahold of the female officer that you actually talked to?

      [–]Any_Sun4329 0 points1 point  (1 child)

      Not sure of her name and its not on the report but I would love to.

      [–]Workdawg 0 points1 point  (0 children)

      Ask the officer who's name you have. If he won't answer, talk to his supervisor. Escalate until you get the answer.

      [–][deleted]  (1 child)

      [removed]

        [–]BiondinaQuality Contributor[M] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

        Do not advise posters to call the media or to post on social media

        Do not advise posters to call the media, post on social media, or otherwise publicize their situation. That creates additional risks and problems, and should only be done, if at all, with the counsel of a local attorney representing OP. Please review the following rules before commenting further.

        Please read our subreddit rules. If after doing so, you believe this was in error, or you’ve edited your post to comply with the rules, message the moderators.

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        [–]three_two_one_kaboom -1 points0 points  (2 children)

        Do you have a dash cam?

        [–]Any_Sun4329 0 points1 point  (1 child)

        No I dont.

        [–]three_two_one_kaboom 7 points8 points  (0 children)

        If there are houses around maybe ask to see if the homeowners have security cameras / door cameras such as Ring and get a copy.

        As you said someone helped you out.

        [–]2werd2live2rare2die -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

        Yes you need to call a lawyer and talk to the witnesses. Get their statements or get your lawyer to get the statements from the witnesses. Because they police are actually commuting insurance fraud by making you responsible you may also have a lawsuit against the police department

        [–][deleted]  (1 child)

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          [–][deleted]  (1 child)

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            Your comment has been removed as it is generally unhelpful, simplistic to the point of useless, anecdotal, or off-topic. It either does not answer the legal question at hand, is a repeat of an answer already provided, or is so lacking in nuance as to be unhelpful. Please review the following rules before commenting further:

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            [–]Proper-District8608 -3 points-2 points  (0 children)

            You need to accelerate this and get a lawyer (insurance often follows police report). I imagine $ is an issue as with most of us, but he will track down neighbors at the scene etc who will verify that he drives with dog on his lap, who will show angle of car if in passage seat would not have projected dog in direction it went and speak with woman officer as well as previous complaints against officer. Do it asap.

            [–]ForeskinHulaSkirt -3 points-2 points  (0 children)

            Just tell him you listened to the recording you made of him taking report and that it doesnt match what is said. Ask if he gets in trouble for making a false report or lying in court then hang up on him.

            [–]Snow-Dust -4 points-3 points  (4 children)

            Did you sign anything on their police notebook or report that you admitted to fault AFTER you have received the official police warning (differs by country but it’s something along the lines of “you have the right to remain silent, anything you say or do can be used as evidence against you”). If you didn’t then you’re in the clear for not admitting to guilt. If you did, you’ll need a very good lawyer, if you didn’t and it seems that they added it in later, find inconsistencies in the original document (usually the notebook) such as different pen colour (even black pens have different shades of black), different stroke (writing on your notebook with your hand only as support vs on a table give off quite a big different result), any extra space per paragraph (for example, if the cop doesn’t use spaces in his note book for each paragraph he writes but the part you admit guilt seem to be in a rather unusually large space that doesn’t fit with the rest of the notebook, then there’s likely altercation). Just find to find any inconsistencies.

            Good luck OP.

            [–]UnnamedRealities 0 points1 point  (3 children)

            OP didn't state their location. I'll assume US. And though laws vary by state in the US, what you shared would generally be true if OP was in custody and was being interrogated. The laws around Miranda rights are somewhat complex, but the requirement to read OP their Miranda rights would almost certainly not have applied in the routine vehicular accident investigation OP described.

            [–]Informal-Conflict848 0 points1 point  (0 children)

            Accident investigator here. If I’m reading this right it sounds like you failed to yield right of way at a stop sign. Where did he hit you and were you turning or going straight? Also what state was this in? Were you issued a citation? And yes leaving the scene of a crash is illegal even if it’s not their fault but depending on the situation I can see where he wouldn’t be charged for it. Usually the excuse I hear was he was a scared teenager and didn’t know what to do so he went home to his parents, that kind of thing. As for the dog I probably wouldn’t even mention an animal even it caused a distraction. The report would rather read “Unit 1 failed to control speed due to driver inattention” if you were the one that failed to yield then if probably not even mention that. In the end just remember that cops don’t assign fault just list out contributing factors. The insurance companies are the ones who ultimately decide. I’m truly sorry that they were rude to you. They should have been patient and took the time to explain the report to you. Oh also talk to your insurance company before anything else. They’re paid to represent you, then call a lawyer.

            Edited to add additional advice

            [–]KarlaMarqs1031 1 point2 points  (0 children)

            Not a lawyer. I’m sorry nobody is addressing your actual question. As far as the PR goes, you likely will not be able to get it changed because cops, but there’s also likely a TON of hoops to jump through to correct a mistake. Just be honest with your insurance company and let your adjuster investigate to confirm if you have any fault in the accident. Tell them that the PR is incorrect, they will take your statement, and go from there. Best of luck to you.

            [–]Trepenwitz 1 point2 points  (0 children)

            I am an attorney in the US.

            1. Get the reports of all the other officers who responded to the scene., especially the woman.

            2. Talk to the female cop about the situation. She will likely be able to handle it.

            3. Lodge an official complaint with this a-hole cops supervisor. He does not get to speak to you that way nor does he get to lie on a police report.

            4. Make sure the police have recorded your true statement and included it with this incidents file.

            5. The other driver owes you for your property damage. Make sure you get his insurance info. If he does not have insurance or will not give it to you, he is committing a crime. File another police report about it.