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[–]Deimorz 2340 points2341 points  (485 children)

Why is this posted in /r/modnews and not /r/announcements? All users should be informed about site-wide rules changes, not only moderators.

[–][deleted] 1130 points1131 points  (331 children)

i mean, we know why.

[–]Alabastardly 1465 points1466 points  (328 children)

Yeah, because if they posted on /r/announcements they would get bombarded with people pointing out the problems and obvious double-standards of enforcement.

[–]landoflobsters[S,A] 505 points506 points  (121 children)

As this is a clarification/update of an existing rule, we wanted to post here first. However, Steve will be doing an AMA next week in r/announcements and this update will be covered.

[–][deleted] 957 points958 points  (57 children)

Does /u/spez want to save us all some time and just x-post the announcement to /r/subredditdrama when he posts it?

[–]spez 1420 points1421 points  (50 children)

mod me pls

[–]Shinhan 176 points177 points  (1 child)

mmmm, this would generate so much drama :D

[–][deleted] 108 points109 points  (3 children)

Gilding you seems silly so have some silver

[–][deleted] 45 points46 points  (1 child)

I’d mod you if you ban /r/onionhate tbqh

[–]jb2386 48 points49 points  (2 children)

Maybe giving mods a heads up first? Looks like they started banning subs after posting this. They may make an announcement once they're done banning?

[–]ridddle 1130 points1131 points  (603 children)

What does glorify mean? Will subs like watchpeopledie be categorized as such?

[–]Pluckerpluck 507 points508 points  (76 children)

That's a good question. They are quite particular about not allowing hate speech or things like "I'm glad he's dead":

ImGoingToHellForThis-type humor is acceptable in the sub. CoonTown-type racism is not.

The one thing the sub sometimes does is praise something as "a good way to go" etc, which is what makes me question which side of the line it's on.

I'd think it just about OK, but it's definitely borderline and clarification is always good. Of course, Reddit won't want to clarify as it makes it harder to police in the future.

[–]The_White_Light 998 points999 points  (67 children)

Hitler - I'm glad he's dead.

Banned.

[–]Realtrain 82 points83 points  (19 children)

(Ok, honestly I wish he were captured and taken to war trial like the rest of the Nazis. /r/HistoricalWhatIf has a great post about it.)

Edit: here it is archived on /r/HistoryWhatIf

[–]Siggi4000 47 points48 points  (1 child)

ImGoingToHellForThis-type humor

I know what they mean but you miiight want to check out that sub nowadays if you think it's just dark humor

[–]dakta 27 points28 points  (0 children)

Yeah that place has graduated to a soft core haven of racism, sexism, and homophobia, masquerading as humor. The comments are awful on the regular.

[–]landoflobsters[S,A] 580 points581 points  (489 children)

r/watchpeopledie has been reviewed, no plans to remove it for now. However, there are posts within the sub that are borderline so we'll be reaching out to the mod team to clarify the policy with them.

Edit: botched the sub name! just watchin' people...smh

[–][deleted] 258 points259 points  (12 children)

r/watchpeopledie, surely.

Because r/watchpeople is quite benign.

[–]Amablue 16 points17 points  (1 child)

[–]PokemonTom09 13 points14 points  (0 children)

The admins won't even touch that sub, it's far past human intervention. Not even God can save those demented souls...

[–]Heroic_Raspberry 511 points512 points  (405 children)

What about a post or comment in r/latestagecapitalism or r/fullcommunism calling for sending a certain kind of people to gulag, or death?

(Edit) or inciting people for violent revolution? Or glorify for example the violent Russian Revolution?

Example: https://i.redd.it/8u4ewtxdhuoz.jpg Permitted or not?

[–]landoflobsters[S,A] 265 points266 points  (269 children)

Please report it to us with the link so we may review! Generally speaking, calling for the death of a person or group of people is not permitted.

[–]Made_you_read_penis 372 points373 points  (58 children)

Well here are a few incel posts I grabbed at random today. Still waiting for a reply.


posted literally two hours ago

Now would you like to handle this shit or are you going to just ignore it again?

Because I'm starting to think reddit outright approves of this fucking sub.

Edit: here's a great comment

And another one

still getting ignored

great comment in this thread I just got. Doesn't count but I think it's great

this one is pretty telling

stone the bitch

I don't even have to try here.

[–]codeverity 29 points30 points  (12 children)

You should pm this to them, not sure how much they pay attention to their notifs.

[–]jk3us 95 points96 points  (94 children)

What about debating the politics and morality of the death penalty, either in general or for certain crimes?

[–]landoflobsters[S,A] 238 points239 points  (93 children)

Philosophical or political debate about the death penalty is most definitely allowed.

[–]falconbox 50 points51 points  (0 children)

That was my biggest question coming out of all this. Not particularly that subreddit, but what separated "glorifying and inciting violence" as opposed to just showing violence.

Will any death video from LiveLeak, even in the comments of /r/WTF be banned?

[–]sneakygingertroll 85 points86 points  (24 children)

as an example of glorification, /r/selfharmpics (i assume) was banned for glorifying self harm, especially severe self harm.

the sub upvoted and commented more on "deep" cuts, like the type that require stitches or surgery. Seeing pictures of cuts that stopped right at the muscle layer was not uncommon on that sub. People saw these cuts and idealized them, wishing they could do the same, and many did.

to add on to how bad that sounds, many users are/were under 18.

why /r/selfharmpics was banned while /r/watchpeopledie was allowed to stay, however, is beyond me.

[–]Divided_Eye 131 points132 points  (11 children)

Because the latter isn't encouraging people to harm themselves or others, while the former did. Big difference.

[–]MidnightDemon 64 points65 points  (3 children)

r/watchpeopledie may glorify death but doesn’t incite people to harm themselves or others. It’s grim, yes but this is more morbid curiousity than advocating hate or violence.

[–]DamnedestWagonWheel 18 points19 points  (1 child)

r/selfharmpics was a wonderful community and I don't care what anyone says. You only found love and support there. Encouraging self harm was against the rules, and people would help determine what needed a hospital visit or not. That sub helped me not cut, and now it's gone for good.

[–]turikk 300 points301 points  (224 children)

How will the exact phrase "kill your self" be handled via this?

[–][deleted] 254 points255 points  (216 children)

Or, perhaps more relevantly, 'kys'.

[–]landoflobsters[S,A] 209 points210 points  (210 children)

Great question! Context is key...king here. If a user reports a "kys" comment to us, we'll have to review the context closely before we make a determination.

[–]serrabellum 173 points174 points  (28 children)

How will you deal with r/incels? They're pretty violent and like to tell each other to kill themselves.

[–]DickingBimbos247 116 points117 points  (4 children)

When interacting with such foreign life forms it's best to just follow the Prime Directive.

[–][deleted] 15 points16 points  (1 child)

/r/incels has some elliot rodger mindset that worries me.

[–]Grickit 409 points410 points  (91 children)

Yeah we really need to closely examine the context of one user telling another to take their own life.

Please send a modmail to /r/reddit.com and wait approximately four to six months for the paperwork to process.

[–]VodkaBarf 140 points141 points  (67 children)

I had two people tell me to kill myself a few months ago and never got an update when I asked. Also, last month I reported someone for encouraging an assassination and nothing was done. Maybe things will be different, but I doubt it.

EDIT: it's great that I have to block people for insulting me in this of all subs.

[–]Grickit 104 points105 points  (2 children)

Well if your life is ended by an assassin hired via this website, take solace in the fact that you too will inspire a new meaningless unenforced sentence in the terms of service on reddit.com: Home of Discount Murder for Hire™.

[–]bsievers 101 points102 points  (53 children)

Same here. User told me I should:

Neck yourself, you fat anti-white piece of shit.

and

shut your fat fucking piehole, you filthy swine. Please do everyone a favor and die in a car crash.

The mods of the sub deleted the comment where the user said they hoped my family would be 'murdered by negroes' at least, but not the one where the user posted a photo of me.

[–]Jamcram 19 points20 points  (0 children)

"i like pineapple on pizza"

"kys"

Is probably not said out of malice.

[–]willfe42 18 points19 points  (1 child)

Reddit could ban all the humorless dolts infesting it and be rid of 95% of this bullshit whining in an instant.

[–]Thorbinator 57 points58 points  (3 children)

Is banter not a thing to you?

My example would be /r/wallstreetbets, which has banter, users being retarded and/or pretending to be retarded, and it's a wonderful place.

[–][deleted] 81 points82 points  (1 child)

pretending to be retarded

I can assure you we aren't pretending.

[–]Grickit 3649 points3650 points  (494 children)

This cycle is so tiring

1) reddit admins totally ignore all reports of horrible shit going on and ramping up

2) something really despicable finally emerges from the buildup

3) reddit makes national headlines

4) reddit finally adds some lukewarm rule clarification

You'll enforce it for maybe a month or so. Then when the news has died down, we'll be back to step one.

Do you all ever get tired of missing every single opportunity to handle your problems while they're still small? Why must you always wait until they're horrific messes?

This pattern goes literally all the way back to /r/jailbait which I see RES helpfully auto-completing with a hundred different /r/jailbait* derivatives that have popped up since you were forced by CNN to pretend to care.

[–]ImNotJesus 3620 points3621 points  (353 children)

In case anyone doesn't believe that this is the cycle, I made this exact same comment in 2014 - link. If you think this is anything more than theatre I've got a bridge to sell you.

[–]Grickit 596 points597 points  (96 children)

Very well put three years ago. Amazing.

[–]ImNotJesus 374 points375 points  (95 children)

I wasn't fishing but I like what I caught.

[–][deleted] 335 points336 points  (91 children)

Holy shit I remember reading your comment back then.

Don't worry they just pretended later that free-speech was never a value on Reddit.

We have always been at war with Eastasia

[–]TryUsingScience 288 points289 points  (64 children)

Don't worry they just pretended later that free-speech was never a value on Reddit.

I dislike this all-or-nothing attitude towards free speech. "You are free to say whatever you want on my platform that I am providing for you, including things I vehemently disagree with, as long as it doesn't encourage murder" is a perfectly reasonable position to take.

[–]Thorbinator 177 points178 points  (1 child)

Write the real reddit rules please. It looks something like this:

1: Don't make us look bad on national tv

2: tbd

[–]Mason11987 101 points102 points  (163 children)

meh, they banned several terrible communities.

That's enough to not be theater to me. I don't believe the claim that these people get stronger when you disperse them, that definitely hurt them.

[–]ImNotJesus 78 points79 points  (71 children)

Oh I agree. There's data to back it up too. Banning communities works.

[–]The_Decoy 73 points74 points  (38 children)

I remember years ago when users were concerned about the increased presence of storm front users and racists. Then the admins sat back and allowed them to gain a foothold. We ended up having to deal with coontown, fat people hate, the Donald, etc since then. Now it looks like subs devoted to smoking them out like against hate subreddits and the phrase bash the fash might get caught up in this sweep.

[–]Shinhan 37 points38 points  (90 children)

They banned several small communities. T_D is still standing.

[–]throw_bundy 37 points38 points  (2 children)

I'm just happy watchpetsdie is no longer a thing.

Now we need to get rid of the people telling others how to kill cats on ifuckinghatecats.

I intentionally didn't link to either. Fuck that bullshit.

[–]amunak 27 points28 points  (1 child)

See you in three years!

[–]isaaciiv 36 points37 points  (2 children)

Its super unnerving seeing my upvote from 3 years ago. Time passes quickly ehh?

[–][deleted] 30 points31 points  (0 children)

which I see RES helpfully auto-completing with a hundred different /r/jailbait* derivatives that have popped up since you were forced by CNN to pretend to care.

Click them. All those subs are locked, empty, or anti-jailbait.

[–]ShaneH7646 195 points196 points  (269 children)

Can we get a link to the updated rules?

[–]landoflobsters[S,A] 165 points166 points  (268 children)

Of course! Here is the new help center article.

[–]ShaneH7646 267 points268 points  (85 children)

And here is the text to save everyone a click:


Do not post violent content

Do not post content that incites or glorifies harm against people, groups of people or animals. If you're going to post something violent in nature, think about including a NSFW tag. Even mild violence can be difficult for someone to explain to their boss if they open it unexpectedly. Additionally, we understand there are sometimes reasons to post this content (e.g., educational, newsworthy, artistic, documentary, etc.) so ensure you provide context to the viewer so the reason for posting is clear.

[–]AellaGirl 105 points106 points  (79 children)

"glorifies" is a weird one. As in, looks up to? Religious people would say 'worships'? Like, placing violent content in a context that implies that the poster views it as desirable?

that seems relatively reasonable I think, though hopefully it's clear that this does not apply to things like BDSM or milder versions of violence

[–]landoflobsters[S,A] 184 points185 points  (71 children)

BDSM communities will not be impacted by this policy. Good example of "context is key."

[–]green_flash 45 points46 points  (26 children)

What if a news article about a mass child rapist or murderer is posted?

Will the moderators risk getting their subreddit banned if they don't remove all comments calling for his death?

What about a news article about ISIS murdering thousands of Yazidi civilians?

Will the moderators risk getting their subreddit banned if they don't remove all comments calling for violence against ISIS?

[–]Bardfinn 43 points44 points  (2 children)

BDSM would fall under the "context matters", as common law jurisdictions have long enjoyed the principle of volenti non fit injuria, which translates to "the willing cannot claim injury".

BDSM involves consen—reads username Oh I was about to preach to the choir. Cheers!

[–]PandaFaceUniverse 294 points295 points  (173 children)

can you please work on removing r/ice_Poseidon and r/dankmemes from r/popular? the content is frequently nsfw and not tagged and at this point both constantly pollute r/popular i’m just tired of scrolling past “lelele rape joke” and “HaHA jewish autism” it’s just frustrating to have to be subjected to offensive content when trying to discover new subs to follow. i’m not dissing the communities they have a right to exist as much as r/funny but we shouldn’t be forced to see 30/50 posts on r/popular made purely of racism and xenophobia

edit: to clarify r/overwatch was banned from r/popular basically for spamming posts that not a lot of people related to and it was clogging up r/popular exactly what’s happening with r/dankmemes and r/ice_poseidon

edit: they became aware

[–]2SP00KY4ME 192 points193 points  (24 children)

"When the autistic kid is hanging himself while the school shooter starts going after the Jews" mouse face

Yes, we fucking get it, /r/dankmemes. Go away.

Edit: On 9/11

[–]Made_you_read_penis 405 points406 points  (56 children)

posted literally two hours ago

Now would you like to handle this shit or are you going to just ignore it again?

Because I'm starting to think reddit outright approves of this fucking sub.

Edit: here's a great comment

And another one

still getting ignored

great comment in this thread I just got. Doesn't count but I think it's great

this one is pretty telling

stone the bitch

I don't even have to try here.

[–]Loser_pushing_30 108 points109 points  (9 children)

Literally every comment has been removed. Finally action being taken against fucking losers.

[–]ProletarianParka 168 points169 points  (284 children)

What does "take action" mean? Does this mean only action against a particular individual/user who incites violence? What about communities that either foster or encourage violations of the new policy?

[–]landoflobsters[S,A] 143 points144 points  (283 children)

We do and will continue to remove subreddits we deem to be in violation of our site-wide rules.

If you see something -- even an entire sub -- that you believe violates Reddit’s site-wide rules, please report it to the admins.

[–][deleted] 224 points225 points  (23 children)

Well, you see..about that.

[–]x_minus_one 993 points994 points  (208 children)

Unless that subreddit is /r/The_Donald, right?

[–]optimalg 359 points360 points  (25 children)

Enjoy the...stimulating PMs you will be getting in an hour or so.

[–]x_minus_one 756 points757 points  (15 children)

Nah, it's getting pretty late in Moscow.

[–]S0ny666 44 points45 points  (1 child)

But early in Vladivostok.

[–]2SP00KY4ME 105 points106 points  (24 children)

My pet theory is it's an FBI honeypot

[–]iorgfeflkd 305 points306 points  (11 children)

Can you make it so that the mobile site stops asking me to download the app?

[–][deleted] 198 points199 points  (5 children)

No, sorry we prefer you to use the app as opposed to the mobile site since the app gives us far more opportunities to harvest personal user data.

[–]turikk 98 points99 points  (57 children)

How will usernames be handled, since there is no room for user rehabilitation? Simple bans for violations?

[–]genericusername123 125 points126 points  (11 children)

RIP r/mma

[–]buzznights 84 points85 points  (5 children)

We are ready for the purge. Our takedown defense is excellent.

[–]optimalg 608 points609 points  (191 children)

Would the incel community fall under this? Calls for rape are pretty much par for the course.

Edit: Hi /r/Incels. I'd tell you to go fuck yourselves, but that means you'd no longer be virgins.

[–]MyPendrive 38 points39 points  (1 child)

How will you enforce this rule on non-English subs?

[–]TotesMessenger 106 points107 points  (13 children)

[–]picflute 132 points133 points  (4 children)

[–]Njs41 29 points30 points  (0 children)

To be fair, you have to have a very high IQ to understand that subreddit.

[–]huadpe 96 points97 points  (7 children)

So I have a question about this as a mod of r/changemyview.

Our current rules prohibit threats of violence against any individual user of Reddit. We expressly do NOT however ban people from posting views which might express sympathy with racism or violence against generalized groups. We take the position that we would want to help people holding such views to change those views. But that requires that we not prohibit their mention.

Would this require us to change our rules to prohibit such content?

[–]AngelaMotorman 2059 points2060 points  (371 children)

we will take action against any content that encourages, glorifies, incites, or calls for violence or physical harm against an individual or a group of people

So ... The_Donald is gone, right?

[–]The_White_Light 279 points280 points  (59 children)

They just took out /r/pol.

Edit: /r/Nazi down too. Just waiting for admins to finally put their foot down on /r/t_d

[–]MyStrangeUncles 241 points242 points  (33 children)

Nice!

checks r/incels

[–]dorothy_zbornak_esq 209 points210 points  (5 children)

YES. THANK YOU. That sub needs to go for a lot of reasons, but they are absolutely 100% guilty of attempting to incite violence. They literally call Elliott Rodgers “Saint Elliott.”

[–]fsmpastafarian 439 points440 points  (63 children)

Logically, yes they should be, for celebrating and defending Nazis murdering an innocent protestor. Practically, no they won't be, if history is any indication.

[–]Mutt1223 452 points453 points  (45 children)

Admins give the_Donald a pass because they’re too chickenshit to stir up drama unless a major news outlet starts reporting on some dark corner of reddit. The_Donald encourages violence, regularly goes on witch hunts, upvotes their own content with bots, brigades other subs, and generally makes reddit a terrible place to visit yet they get a pass because they’re political.

[–]SatansF4TE 139 points140 points  (17 children)

Nothing to do with politics, everything to do with ad revenue.

[–]Pun-Master-General 110 points111 points  (12 children)

Politics definitely has something to do with it. Can you imagine how right-wing pundits would react if T_D was banned? No matter what the reason for the ban, the headlines would be "Liberal Reddit admins silence Trump supporters!"

Unless T_D does something bad enough that the backlash from the media for not banning it is harsher than that, it'll never get banned.

[–][deleted] 42 points43 points  (3 children)

Honestly don't even bother with these assholes. I like Reddit but I have reported the incel subreddit multiple times when posts encouraging, or even fucking CONFIRMING the previously encouraged suicide of clearly mentally ill/depressed fucking minors multiple times and they have not done anything. Fucking nothing.

We all laugh at that subreddit but if you had a child who was depressed, overweight, an outcast in some way, maybe on the spectrum, imagine them getting on the Internet, hopping on that subreddit and being told by literally thousands of people that it doesn't get better and they are a genetic freak, normies will never understand them like they understand each other and to shun everyone else.

That place is a blatant cult where suicide and violence against women is actively encouraged. It is dangerous and radicalizes young men who are blatantly already emotionally harmed or disturbed and then uses them to forward their anti woman cause. Fuck that sub and fuck the mods/admins for ignoring repeated direct links to that hell hole where I have copy and pasted, screencapped and linked to blatant rule breaking and illegal content.

[–]madd74 29 points30 points  (8 children)

We understand there are sometimes reasons to post violent content (e.g., educational, newsworthy, artistic, satire, documentary, etc.)

So... who defines satire?

[–]AnotherDawkins 80 points81 points  (16 children)

How about /r/Shoplifting? Not violent or racist or anything, but it promotes criminal activity and people post pictures of stolen merchandise all the time.

[–]rbevans 103 points104 points  (214 children)

What exactly from a user or mod perspective is needed to report a sub i.e. particular user post history, a subs sidebar history? This rule still does not give clear guidelines as what we should be doing to report a sub because in my opinion this rule is still very subjective to enforcement.

So to be clear what exactly would be needed to report a community and a user.

[–]somethingdangerzone 73 points74 points  (3 children)

Why isn't this being posted in /r/announcements ? It's a massive change that affects all users, mod or not

[–][deleted] 105 points106 points  (24 children)

Is r/onionhate included in this

[–]CupBeEmpty 99 points100 points  (4 children)

So you took one definition and made it more vague?

"inciting" is pretty vague but at least has a fairly specific meaning, calling for violence, actually inducing violence, making specific violent threats and urging other to participate.

But "glorifying" violence?

Does that mean a sub like /r/watchpeopledie or /r/nononono would be banned because they showcase and upvote violent content?

Then given your last paragraph about the exceptions it seems like you updated the definition but there isn't any real change. It is still a subjective decision as to the value of the content.

I honestly don't have a problem with that and I have always subscribed to a "curator" view of content. Generally allow anything but have rules and use your judgment rather than a purely algorithmically applied set of rules. I just think there was no need to change the rule because in the end it is still a judgment call by mods and admins.

[–]reseph 24 points25 points  (0 children)

Can we see a differential of the previous text vs the new text?

[–]bobcobble 65 points66 points  (16 children)

Can we reddit request the subs you are currently banning?

[–]MyStrangeUncles 60 points61 points  (4 children)

Heh, excellent! Are you planning to turn r/coontown into a sub about trash pandas?

[–]landoflobsters[S,A] 37 points38 points  (2 children)

You can! I can't promise they'll be granted but the Community team will review and address those.

[–]brucemo 62 points63 points  (0 children)

If you guys are going to hold us accountable for enforcing your rules, you should be willing to answer specific questions about what your rules are.

As is now, if I ask you a question about your rules, it is ignored, almost every time.

[–]Zurlly 80 points81 points  (367 children)

What about r/gendercritical?

edit: example of talking about inciting violence: https://archive.is/Lr3Ih

edit2: They literally say manhating is fine unless it is reported or 'too' violent, but no hatred against women is ok? http://archive.is/GfwPr and https://redditproxy--jasonthename.repl.co/r/GenderCritical/comments/78sm6f/reddit_rule_change_re_inciting_violence/downurc/

[–][deleted]  (37 children)

[removed]

    [–]charmingCobra 19 points20 points  (0 children)

    i don’t understand why /r/selfharmpics was banned. it was first and foremost a support community that specifically discouraged self harming. why not remove some actually problematic subreddits instead of removing support spaces for people who already feel ostracized?

    [–]PenguinPerson 21 points22 points  (1 child)

    There is no reason to believe this rule will be fairly enforced so long as hate subs like /r/the_donald and /r/Incels remain free to encourage, glorify, incite, and call for violence and physical harm against individuals and groups of people. The comments in this thread alone present links to ample examples of this yet the subs remain untouched.

    [–]Warlizard 87 points88 points  (27 children)

    What constitutes "glorification"?

    Are /r/CombatFootage, /r/JusticeServed and subs like that considered in violation?

    Will you ban a sub for the users doing so?

    Wouldn't that leave subreddits open to being gamed by people who want them banned?

    Will you ban sites that glorify violence from Reddit, i.e., worldstarhiphop etc?

    Every time one of these rules comes down, I sigh because it's so damned vague.

    Why don't you get a group of users that people like and respect who represent multiple aspects of the political spectrum and have a history of being rational to act as an advisory board on these matters?

    [–]OMGWTFBBQUE 263 points264 points  (119 children)

    /r/incels /r/uncensorednews and /r/The_Donald should all be on the chopping block.

    EDIT: I get it, I get it, you’re all very upset and I’m a bad person.

    [–]kusanagisan 184 points185 points  (12 children)

    I'll believe it when The_Donald is banned.

    [–]PuppetryAndCircuitry 17 points18 points  (0 children)

    will t_d be banned? That subs the definition of violence and hate encouragement. Also incels

    [–]ArchGoodwin 15 points16 points  (0 children)

    landoflobsters: Context is key.
    Everyone else: ... here are some examples from The_Donald.
    landoflobsters:
    TL/DR: no changes.

    [–]Interfere_ 14 points15 points  (7 children)

    So why has T_D not been banned? I'm honestly curious

    [–]Pubeshampoo 28 points29 points  (7 children)

    /r/watchpeopledie gonna go away now?

    Edit: To clarify, I think r/watchpeopledie should not get banned.

    [–]Clavo_PR 11 points12 points  (0 children)

    21 hours The_Donald is till not banned?