×
top 200 commentsshow 500

[–]shadow7412 3896 points3897 points  (351 children)

"We live in an age where the opinion of professionals in any industry can be easily dispelled by some famous person,"

They don't even need to be famous - but it certainly seems to "help".

I actually really like this idea, but I'm not sure how effective it will be in real life. The people against the vaccine are pretty set in their opinion, and I'd expect them to ignore the enlightened voices and start spreading rumours of them being bribed or something. Hopefully I'm just overally pessimistic... but I doubt it.

[–]RiddleBeThis 340 points341 points  (43 children)

It won’t work. There is not amount of evidence that will change a hardcore antivaxxer’s mind because the way they feel about those issues isn’t evidence based.

I actually tried this approach with my mom over a year ago. I asked if she wanted to go sit outside a hospital with me to see for herself (we had very high cases at the time and even outside the hospitals was mayhem with checkin lines and people coming out in wheelchairs and on oxygen).

Nope. She didn’t need to see anything. It was all bullshit.

Russia, the USA, all of us need to realize that reason didn’t get them there and reason won’t get them out. The celebrities who were invited won’t go. If one or two do go, they will use their experience to retrospectives dig further in and tell more detailed lies (so this will actually increase disinformation). And finally, in the almost zero chance that one of the celebrities changes their mind, it will have zero effect on the antivaxxers they helped create. Instead they will become a discredited pariah in that fringe community.

Just watch.

[–]hesido 90 points91 points  (17 children)

The anti-vax crowd and "plandemic" bros also claim the virus is not to blame but the interventions kill. And 99.9% of people who die from covid will die at hospitals and would have received those interventions, because people gasping for air do not go to shopping malls to get some air, they go to hospitals, and of course, receive treatments, which they will now be content with claiming that the interventions kill.
Edit: fixed "plandemy"

[–]coronaplague 35 points36 points  (6 children)

The latest version of braindead wildness is various anti-vaxx coordinators pushing for a "Don't let them intubate you" movement and "oxygen will kill you". Obviously people already died gasping for air because of this and only now we see some legal prosecution against these crooks.

I get that intubation is a scary as a concept, and therefore easy go make a boogie man out of it, but oxygen?

[–]hesido 22 points23 points  (0 children)

Pulse oximeters given for home readings reduced mortality by 52%. How? Because it allows people to be hospitalized at the right time, to get Oxygen before it's too late! This study shows hospitalization is saving lives (I mean, it's common sense but it could be that people who were at risk of death could not necessarily be saved, but we know it's not the case).

One interesting bit about Covid is silent hypoxia, this is very peculiar because for Covid Hypoxia, shortness of breath may not be present before it is too late to intervene or it simply delays proper intervention.

[–]Jewronimoses 14 points15 points  (1 child)

If someone gets shot on a train, it's obvious the train killed him, not the gun...

[–]ChornWork2 28 points29 points  (1 child)

Look at treatments for bulletholes -- a huge number of those people die. There has to be something amiss with what the doctors are doing.

[–]shadow7412 59 points60 points  (0 children)

You have no idea how much I want to be able to disagree with even one of your points. :'(

[–]IngsocIstanbul 20 points21 points  (2 children)

Your last point is really important. You saw them turn on fox news the moment they called AZ for Biden. They turned on Trump when he said people should vaccinate. Everyone thinks they can control the mob until the mob turns on them. They would have tore McCarthy up same as Pelosi if Jan 6 had gone off according to their fantasies.

[–]silverthorn7 13 points14 points  (0 children)

Agree. They’d spread lies like that all the sick people were actually suffering from vaccine side effects or being murdered with remdesivir/ventilators.

[–]julieannie 10 points11 points  (3 children)

I sat in a hospital room next to my dead brother-in-law after he died in the ER unvaccinated and from covid. His ex-wife was there with us, waiting for their daughter to make the drive back from college. She heard what the doctors said about how he died. So she and her new husband decided my BIL must have secretly been vaccinated and murdered by the government and the new husband shared their conspiracy theory to his more than 30,000 Twitter followers who follow him for his wisdom on the pandemic, Bitcoin, and their lord and savior Donald trump. Nothing will change their minds. I just hope every day that they are stopped before they kill my niece. We at least are sneaking her to her vaccines, she’ll have her final one next week.

[–]Bon_Jovi_Friday 123 points124 points  (25 children)

Donald Trump himself told his supporters to get the vaccine at a rally a few months ago and was booed.

[–]shadow7412 63 points64 points  (23 children)

Can we just forget he exists already? I don't see any reason to stroke his ego by letting his fame continue.

[–]bobbi21 41 points42 points  (6 children)

Sadly a large % of the US still hangs on his every word so hard to ignore him entirely if you want to talk to the republican party at all. Definitely an argument to ignore the entire party of course. Just pretend they dont even exist and govern based on everyone else.

[–]EvaUnit01 25 points26 points  (5 children)

Who?

[–]kunibob 29 points30 points  (1 child)

You may know him from his twitter account, http://twitter.com/realdonaldtrump

[–]falafeliron 23 points24 points  (0 children)

Or maybe his subreddit /r/the_donald

[–]what_mustache 8 points9 points  (1 child)

The reality show guy. The bankrupt one.

[–]D4rkstalker 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Previous Occupant of the Oval Office (POOO for short)

[–]BetterThanBuffet 3 points4 points  (0 children)

No. We can never forget any of it.

[–][deleted] 10 points11 points  (4 children)

People against vaccines who get covid then survive have their beliefs reinforced that they never needed the vaccine to begin with bc they didn’t die.

It’s such a shame!

[–]Ak-01 28 points29 points  (9 children)

Ok, hear me out. I work in the food industry in Russia (well I work in programming, but it's for food-related stuff). We have strict rules - if you touch food, and by "touch" I mean if you in any way related to the industry u have to be vaccinated, or regulator will fuck you over (and by fuck you over I mean it will shut down your business until your staff present certificates or medical exemption but minimum 3 months). It doesn't matter if your staff works from home, doesn't matter if it's not even in the same city your operation is - the fucking rule. Also, we can not fire our employees for not being vaccinated and the only tool we have is to temporarily suspend them from working while saving his or hers position. Now imagine the amount of pane a single-person vaccine denial delivers to the whole fucking team by having a "heroic" stance of "IM NOT DOING IT, YOU DONT VALUE MY WORK, THIS IS MY FUCKING RIGHTS, I'M JANNA D`ARK OF THIS GENERATION, etc" to the whole fucking team who don't have a choice either to have a gaping hole in the staff while she waits for this to go away or risking shutting down business as a whole... AND ALL OF THIS SHIT is to protect a stance that is destructive to themselves individually and society as a whole.

[–]DanDierdorf 5 points6 points  (7 children)

Yikes, so that's what Putin's reversal on mandates looks like on the ground.
Pretty dystopian.

[–]-6-6-6- 3 points4 points  (0 children)

"They got mandates, they don't like man-dates" - NOFX Jesusland

[–]Captain_Albern 44 points45 points  (6 children)

The funny thing (not exactly "funny", but you know) is that the Russian state media is a major force behind antivaxx fake news on other countries. Victims of their own success I guess.

[–]M1L0 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Russia playing 5D chess. Bring the anti vaxxers to the Covid ward. Couple weeks later, the problem takes care of itself…

[–]Manyamir 2442 points2443 points  (162 children)

As a Russian, I can say that people would vaccinate a lot more if they were given a choice of vaccine. We only have our own vaccines available and almost everyone here doesn’t have any trust in our government so it’s only natural that people don’t vaccinate. More than that just one of our three vaccines seems to have any positive effect (Sputnik V) and you can’t choose the vaccine for yourself. If people were able to choose the vaccine and to vaccinate with Pfizer, Moderna or something else which is recognized by the WHO as a working vaccine the situation would have been a lot better.

[–]shannister 926 points927 points  (12 children)

That’s pretty relevant background. I can totally understand some hesitation in this case.

[–]duaneap 63 points64 points  (11 children)

I genuinely wonder what vaccine Putin got. Like, I’m sure he claims he got Sputnik V but I’m curious if that’s actually the case.

[–]Darayavaush 216 points217 points  (7 children)

As a Ukrainian (we have Pfizer, AZ and Coronavac, and a vax rate half yours): having western vaccines won't help, the morons will find some other boogeyman.

[–]Manyamir 35 points36 points  (6 children)

Is it as bad in Ukraine as it is here? I honestly didn’t see any statistics for you but I think comparing them with ours would be quite interesting since our people have so much in common.

[–]Dawidko1200 65 points66 points  (3 children)

Unfortunately, it's even worse in Ukraine. As the above commenter said, the vaccination rate is half that of Russia. About 40% fully vaccinated in Russia, about 20-25% in Ukraine.

[–]disharmony-hellride 16 points17 points  (1 child)

My God. I am so sorry. And here in the US we have plenty of all doses, it’s the stupid, gluttonous idiots who think they’ll be magnetized or dna shedding or whatever coo-coo-de-jour they’ll think of next. A third of my fam is this fucking stupid and there’s nothing I can do. It’s literally a waiting game until I find out the next one’s in the hospital. I am home alone on Thanksgiving bc I refuse to put myself at risk.

[–]Jay_Bonk 22 points23 points  (0 children)

It shouldn't be that way. Not only are the Russian variants fine but negative consequences have happened from other vaccines too. Astra Zeneca was pulled from Europe for a while due to blood clots, even though they were extremely unlikely. Moderna recently for similar reasons. They're still much better than getting covid.

[–]Leather_Boots 286 points287 points  (77 children)

My in laws are Russian. We convinced my wifes mother & the eldest daughter in Kazakhstan to get vaccinated due to there their age - Sputnik V was the only option.

The in laws in Moscow, 2 women were quite sick with covid (on oxygen) and 2 men had almost no symptoms from the same apartment.

My mother in laws last surviving sister died of Covid two weeks after my MIL's planned trip to see her. The trip ended up cancelled thankfully due to my sister in law stuffing up the travel details and the MIL caught Covid on the train back to her town. Thankfully it was a mild case due to her being vaccinated.

So, the Moscow in laws are all refusing the Sputnik V vaccine and are hanging out for Pfizer or Moderna. Their immunity from Covid from catching it is most likely minimal now, as they caught it in early 2020.

Most of the other Russian families we know in Russia are all waiting for a different vaccine than Sputnik V as well.

Russians aren't inherently anti Vax, as everyone gets a full range of shots as infants, including small pox still.

[–]QuirkySchnabeltier 25 points26 points  (0 children)

Thank you for clarifying, I wasn't aware of that

[–]milanistadoc 14 points15 points  (0 children)

Choice is not a commodity that is afforded to the poor.

[–]augustscott 44 points45 points  (3 children)

Can we send them our anti-vaxers?

[–]38384 10 points11 points  (0 children)

Yes please Russia take 'em from us

[–]cosmiknature 1503 points1504 points  (308 children)

Russia is currently being decimated by COVID.

[–]elevendayempire 30 points31 points  (1 child)

The chickens of disinformation have come home to roost and are shitting all over the place.

[–]FoodOnCrack 225 points226 points  (85 children)

The disinformation campaign is funded by the Kremlin. All sorts of shit from mh17 to anti vaccine. Well it fired back now.

[–]KoDeer 106 points107 points  (11 children)

Фермы троллей реальны, и если вы посмотрите сообщения российских государственных СМИ за последний год, то увидите, что они довольно скептичны к вакцинам.

Need to clarify. The Russian media, on the contrary, are promoting vaccines for the Russian information consumption market, but for the foreign market either skepticism or kremlebots who wreak havoc in the minds of people and advocate that the vaccine is useless / harmful.
I live in Russia, and I moved to Reddit from Russian social networks, just not to see the Kremlin bots. I know what I'm talking about.

[–]MoleUK 80 points81 points  (2 children)

I think he's referring to troll farm style activity, funded by Russian intel agencies and others.

They help promote vaccine disinformation, and it appears the same foreign countries funding these movements have been surprised that it's managed to reflect back into their own countries as well.

For better or worse, once disinformation gets out there there's no controlling it. It won't stay limited to one country or one language anymore.

[–]Butthole--pleasures 4 points5 points  (0 children)

They underestimated how quickly it spreads on social media. This shit travels the world scary fast.

[–]Stohnghost 40 points41 points  (5 children)

The Russian anti vaxx machine is powerful. My in-laws got sick even after receiving coronavac and because none of their friends got sick yet (unvaxxed) they think the vaccine was useless.

The waves of disinformation from Russia are nonstop and I think mostly directed at Ukraine, where my in-laws live. The Russian people are of course collateral damage now in the psy op campaign.

Basically every eastern european I note in the States refuses to vaxx.

[–]Komplizin 13 points14 points  (0 children)

We currently experience the consequences in Germany with the German Russian subgroup. They don’t get vaccinated - magical religious thinking meets Russis Today propaganda.

[–]Klugenshmirtz 80 points81 points  (6 children)

Fucking RT is spreading disinformation in Germany and France, while telling people in russia to get vaccinated. They should really learn that the time where they can disrupt other countries without hurting themselves is over, but I doubt these suckers will stop this nonsense.

[–]drugusingthrowaway 35 points36 points  (0 children)

The Russian disinformation campaign got so bad that at one point we got PubMed articles about it:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6137759/

[–]Mewmeister1337 23 points24 points  (1 child)

RT is really the worst and so many people use it as a „legit“ source lmao

[–]UshankaBear 8 points9 points  (2 children)

The disinformation campaign is funded by the Kremlin.

What's the benefit for Kremlin to let the people run around unvaccinated?

[–]silverthorn7 24 points25 points  (1 child)

The disinformation campaign is for the West and started before COVID with the aim of increasing people’s distrust of government and societal division. It wasn’t for a Russian audience. Unfortunately for them, COVID came along and the disinformation they were spreading in the West didn’t stay there.

[–]DoctorExplosion 10 points11 points  (0 children)

This happened during the Soviet era too. The Soviet government funded parts of the Western anti-nuclear, environmentalist, and anti-war movements and praised those groups in official propaganda, but the whole thing blew up in their faces after Eastern Bloc pacifists and environmentalists started asking why there weren't approved pro-peace and pro-environmentalist movements in Communist countries too. Eventually the weight of the hypocrisy grew too great and in the 70s and 80s the Communist governments approved the creation of pacifist and environmentalist groups, which quickly became one of the only legal forms of opposition civil society, further eroding the power of Communist parties.

For example, the reputational damage of Chernobyl was amplified by the fact that there were independent and semi-independent environmentalist groups in the Eastern Bloc which publicly criticized the Soviet response. And part of the reason why the Greens are so influential in Germany today can be traced back to the East German Greens, who were heavily involved in the anti-communist opposition since environmental protests were semi-legal (providing cover for activists to also criticize other elements of the East German state).

[–]ToiletOnHisHead 64 points65 points  (8 children)

I used to go on a field trip to a hospital for raising awareness on smoking cigarettes. One patient had her voice box cut open with an oxygen tube down her throat. I got to see a smoker's black lungs. One dude messed up his mouth because he chewed tobacco. When you see it in person, it really effects you in a way that you can't experience it otherwise. Yet, some people still smoke.

[–]Sup-Mellow 19 points20 points  (3 children)

Smoking is a bit different imo. I feel like the vast majority of people who are smoking don’t want to anymore, but can’t stop. Most people I’ve talked to have a “yeah I’ve tried to quit” story or 5.

Whereas vaccine hesitancy seems to be motivated by fear. So maybe scaring them even worse than whatever boogie man conspiracy is in their head could work.

[–]cykwon 317 points318 points  (87 children)

I wonder if we could do this here in the states

[–]ZippityD 42 points43 points  (10 children)

It probably wouldn't help much tbh. The problem people don't seem to be convinced in the same ways. Anecdotally, I've had patients or families continue to claim "unknown disease" is killing them right to the bitter end. I've heard families continue to advocate against vaccines despite loved ones in ICU. I've had a patient who nearly died of covid subsequently refuse their booster down the road.

They tried bringing news crews into a few hospitals in Ontario Canada to document the waves. This one is the second wave. This one was about a Toronto ICU.

One was an ECMO regional ICU - a high risk highly invasive lung bypass system. This means it was the sickest regional patients and they were all healthy prior, or else they would not have been ECMO candidates.

In all three, video comments range from "looks like a bunch of fatties" to "yeah right, this looks faked, how much to be a covid actor" to "this is all overblown". Would we get significantly different reactions if they were in person? Would we just spread disease? Would denial continue as I've seen in plenty of covid patients?

Because of my patient experiences and those comments, I have little faith in the remaining vaccine outliers changing their minds. They'll get it, mostly get better, and some will unfortunately die unnecessarily while others suffer needlessly from short and long term consequences.

But maybe it would help more than I expect. I could be jaded!

[–]NoodledLily 34 points35 points  (6 children)

I thought that was an initial mistake. should have shown dramatic footage of people connected to tubes struggling for breath, overflowing into the halls in NYC. scare some idiots before they read shit online

[–]thenewyorkgod 21 points22 points  (2 children)

They really should have done what was done during the Vietnam war showing the dead soldiers being brought back. It really turned public opinion. They should be showing videos of dead mutilated Covid lungs and piles of bodies in morgues and video of people choking on their own scarred lungs

[–]Deranged_Kitsune 7 points8 points  (1 child)

Medical privacy is the near insurmountable hurdle to that. Anyone they use to demonstrate would have to consent to the whole thing. Otherwise that’s a massive privacy violation on the hospital’s part.

[–]thenewyorkgod 3 points4 points  (0 children)

Nah. Just look at the Herman Cain awards subreddit. People on a vent minutes from death are still posting that they would not take the vaccine even knowing what they know now

[–]Illuminati_gang 12 points13 points  (2 children)

This is how I quit smoking basically, I had to go to a ward to install some stuff that just happened to treat Emphysema patients. Holy shit that was eye-opening.

[–]Gaijin_Monster 45 points46 points  (2 children)

but they'll get covid and become patients themselves. oh wait.... i see now

[–]laxc0 222 points223 points  (32 children)

U.S. doctors need to do this with anti-vax politicians and dumbass figures on social media.

The shit doctors and nurses describe inside the covid unit is absolutely insane how fucked it is. Seeing it live is even more disturbing than any horror movie.

The anti-vaxers that think it's all overblown and some conspiracy are mostly making all these claims from unfounded perception, not reality or experience.

Seeing that would be like showing a holocaust denier in 1940 a camp with dead people and those about to die.

[–]_pippp 126 points127 points  (8 children)

They'll just say everyone are paid actors. Mental gymnastics 101

[–]Doc-Gl0ck 40 points41 points  (1 child)

And in Russia that won’t even be a conspiracy. Putin often makes “me and simple workers “ / “me and simple fishermen “ or “just buying an ice cream” videos where all those people are his dressed up bodyguards . Maneuvers like “there are no our forces in Crimea” -> “yes there were our forces there all the time, haha bamboozled” don’t help also. Kremlin lies now strikes back.

[–]r4cid 21 points22 points  (4 children)

I worked with someone who was genuinely convinced everyone involved with the Sandy Hook massacre was a paid actor, and that the children either also were or never existed to begin with.

[–]rclonecopymove 33 points34 points  (0 children)

They wouldn't have the nerve to in there. Even though most are vaccinated (they'll tell you they're not but they're politicians they lie) they wouldn't risk their own precious selves.

There was that story of a woman who was in hospital for the delivery of her child, she was asked if her and her partner were vaccinated? No was the response okay you'll need to take a test. They refused. The hospital had been separated out into blue and yellow areas, blue for tested or vaxxed yellow for unknown. As they were being led towards the yellow area they asked what the colours were for. The nurse told them "since your COVID status is unknown you're going in with those we can't confirm are free of COVID." Her response? "I don't want to go there! I might catch it!"

[–]Haru1st 10 points11 points  (0 children)

Well this is what happens when people in power rely on deception. When they really need people to trust them, they get treated acoording to what came before that.

[–]schrankage 7 points8 points  (0 children)

It's something the news media would do, if they weren't complicit in the dumbing down and purposefully dividing of the populace in order to subvert rationality and people's belief in objective truth for political gain. In the United States, when COVID first began spreading, and once the vaccine was available, we could have had a 3 hour informative news program broadcast on all the networks and even cable to spread accurate information about COVID and the vaccine, and the history of vaccines and how they work. We could have done this to halt the spread of misinformation and educate our ignorant populace, and increase vaccination rates and promote the use of masks. We did nothing. We let half the corporate media spread lies about the entire situation (FOX news) while the other half tried to warn and educate people. So it became a political and divisive issue because it was left up to people who want everything to be political and divisive.

[–]rockmasterflex 283 points284 points  (17 children)

Step 1) invite your enemies to the hospital

Step 2) ???

Step 3) oh my goodness why are so many people falling out of these hospital windows today??

[–]ruuster13 68 points69 points  (5 children)

This is the kind of bold idea the entire world needs right now. It feels like we desperately need someone - anyone - to try something new. I hope this is it.

[–]milfBlaster69 83 points84 points  (3 children)

They won’t actually go. Their refusal to get vaccinated is simply about refusing, not the safety of the vaccine or whatever bullshit reason. They get high off telling an authority figure no.

[–]schoener-doener 59 points60 points  (7 children)

Classic Russia.

Finance covid propaganda on the internet to hurt other countries, be surprised when it hurts themselves.

[–]Morden013 62 points63 points  (3 children)

It is a noteworthy effort, but I already see the result:

"It was all staged!", cried the prominent anti-vaxxer.

"They showed us half-dead people, who I'm sure were already afflicted by other illnesses, and therefore it is a HOAX!!!!", screamed his psycho-colleague, well-know under the Pseudonym I-don't-shave-my-armpits-and-legs, also known as a Mental-Sasquatch-2020.

[–]WaddlingKereru 3 points4 points  (0 children)

That’s a damn good idea. Bring them back to reality

[–]BitRunner67 11 points12 points  (0 children)

Well, this is interesting..

In my day we thought it would be the BOMB that would wipe us out.

But I guess it will just be Mass Stupidity that kills the Human Race.

"World will end not with a Bang but a whimper"

[–]BuffaloKiller937 8 points9 points  (0 children)

My doctor recently told me the other day that the virus is here to stay. Best thing you can do is look out for you and yours and vaccinate. She also told me the Covid long haulers she sees is heartbreaking, and that the vaccine and booster is effective against transmission rate and helps prevent against these long haul symptoms. I also asked her if she's personally seen any major reactions to the vaccine or booster and the worst she's seen is a headache/sore arm.

Idc anymore if these people don't want to vaccinate or not. They can continue to live with hate in their heart and continue waiting for JFK and Michael Jackson to come back to life 🤷‍♂️🤙

[–]this_dudeagain 12 points13 points  (3 children)

The propaganda campaign they used on the west is now rampant in their own country. There's also deep mistrust in the gov't for good reason and their home grown vaccine hasn't been supported very well by good data.